I dunno that game vs the hawks wouldve been nice to win
Which team is closer to a premiership - Richmond, GWS or Collingwood?
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Uhhh franklin. Rhoughhead. Riewoldt. Just to name a few now
Yes he can work up the ground. I said that. Point is he cant do it enough cos you have no other really good forwards bar elliot and swan.
That loss is a very good example of how marginal our improvement needs to be to move a long way up the ladder. Thanks for pointing that out.
And the other losses you had in second half of the year. No its not a good example of how little you need to improve its a good example how much you need to improve your consistency in order just to win enough games to qualify for finals and show up week in week out to give yourself the best chance. Collingwood have a decent list that can push the 8 i have no doubt just still have a bit of work to do.
We beat Geelong comprehensively with Cloke out injured. His kicking for goal outside 50 on an angle is the best in the business. 25 metres directly in front and it can go anywhere. Without a doubt mental.
Yep injury and inexperience cost us a couple of wins and thats why Pies fans are so excited. Percentage was good enough to make finals, a few honorable losses and then the wheels fell off a bit late in the season , ending in a meaningless dead rubber loss in the last round in a bruise free contest with Essendon.
Add Reid Cloke Greenwood to the lineup for a full season, plus Aish and Treloar, and a years experience for the younger players, especially Grundy, and all for the loss of three player who couldnt get a game. No eldery citizens to worry about (Swan being the oldest had a great year). Not hard to imagine 12th turning into 5th or 6th just by turning some of those late season losses of 2015 into wins.
Add Reid Cloke Greenwood to the lineup for a full season, plus Aish and Treloar, and a years experience for the younger players, especially Grundy, and all for the loss of three player who couldnt get a game. No eldery citizens to worry about (Swan being the oldest had a great year). Not hard to imagine 12th turning into 5th or 6th just by turning some of those late season losses of 2015 into wins.
Our win-loss with him vs our win-loss without him was?
And that was in a poor season from him.
Dan
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Richmond are Richmond :/
GWS/GC will play finals, don't think they'll win premierships when Hawthorn's run is over. Who knows when that'll be.
Collingwood has a good list. Strong recruiting over the off-season and unlike Richmond, they don't have mental barriers to deal with.
GWS/GC will play finals, don't think they'll win premierships when Hawthorn's run is over. Who knows when that'll be.
Collingwood has a good list. Strong recruiting over the off-season and unlike Richmond, they don't have mental barriers to deal with.
Richmond in 2013 finished 5th and won 15 games.
In 2013 the best players were Martin, Cotchin, Deledio, Rance, Riewoldt and Maric with support from Grigg, Houli, Newman, Chaplin and Jackson who although unfashionable were great contributors.
Ellis, Vlaustin and Conca were the most promising youngsters and Vickery frustrated.
In 2015 not much changed, Ellis elevating himself to the best players, Edwards is improved a guy like Miles replaced Jackson.
The Tiger's ain't made any major improvements since 2013...have they peaked!?
Also had a dream run with injury in 2015 - Rance, Chaplin, Martin, Cotchin, Maric, Reiwoldt, Ellis, Miles, Grigg, Houli, Vlaustin and Batchelor played 22 or 23 games...basically the defence, key ruck, main midfield and key forward were there every week!!
The major injuries to important players was Deledio and Edwards, but they played 18 and 16 respectively.
Giants had - Mumford, Shiels, Coniglio, Davis, Patfull, Hoskins-Elliott and Patton not get 20 games.
Pies had - Reid, Cloke, Sidebottom, Adams, Grundy and Greenwood not get 20 games.
Tigers have already peaked, cop a GWS or Pies like run with injury in 2016 and they will miss the 8.
Brilliant analysis except for the fact it is just a massive assumption lacking anything but your own opinion.
Heres my opinion, most of our stars are still at an age where they still have plenty of room for improvement, injuries is an unknown for every team and as WCE showed its not always season ending, keeping a team together over a number of years is a positive not a negative.
Which of the Tigers stars have improved from 2013?? Which stars will get better??
Having the nucleus of your team all play the majority of the season means they will get better results compared to a team who copped injuries and never had a settled line-up.
Well it would be right if it weren't for pesky little stats. Those pesky stats of a percentage 12% better as well as a tougher draw compared to 2013 as well as Jackson and King retiring. Maric didnt play 22 games wrong again on that count
Miles does not replace Jackson
Gee shucks your just full of s**t
Maric did play 22 games in 2015.Well it would be right if it weren't for pesky little stats. Those pesky stats of a percentage 12% better as well as a tougher draw compared to 2013 as well as Jackson and King retiring. Maric didnt play 22 games wrong again on that count
Miles does not replace Jackson
Gee shucks your just full of s**t
% in 2013 was 122.8, % in 2015 was 123.1
I wasn't saying that Miles directly replaced Jackson, but they are similar in importance. Jackson was the club champion in 2013 and Miles 4th this year, yet neither gets the outside attention of main stars.
Seems like you need to brush up on ur own team ay Komrade.
Been up for 30+ hours, statistics are blending together (12% increase was 2014-2015) 2015 was still an exceptionally tougher draw
similar in importance? they play 2 different ******* roles. Miles is an extractor where Jackson was the "enforcer". Jackson's has been replaced by Moore and/or Townsend
Miles also does get attention as the moment he gets the ball he's being tackled at the bottom of a pack (hence his high free-kick count)
I think i know my own team better than some MB flog
Worry about your own team thats gone backwards every under the FIGJAM and fatchins spin doctoring of "much youth, very improvement"
2015 the Tigers dbl up teams were Carlton, Essendon, Collingwood, North and Freo....the Tigers were 8 wins from those games...that is considered a tough fixture!??
Jackson won the BnF in 2013, he was a hugely important player to the success that the Tigers enjoyed in 2013...but he never considered one of the main stars like Cotchin, Lids, Jack etc. Jackson was also a great leader...something lacking at Tigerland.
Comparing Miles to Jackson was a compliment, and as good as Miles has been he ain't as good as Jackson was in 2013.
And the Tigers, even with a great injury run and easy fixture in 2015, couldn't improve on 2013...despite the stars being smack bang in their prime.
double up against 3 teams that made finals, one of which made the prelim (where they finished at the end of the year is irrelevant as you rate the draw based on the year before's form) is considered an easy fixture? whaaaaaat?
Miles is also incredibly young compared to the Jackson of 2013. Before that, every tiger would cover their eyes when he had the ball and the ONLY thing he had going for him was his leadership and 'enforcer' role
Nick riewoldt not jack. Nick is still out performing cloke with ease.
It ain't a tough fixture, you are aware of the three tier groupings that the AFL use when doing fixturing.
Collingwood, who missed the finals in 14, copped dbl ups against 3 teams who made the finals...the Horror!!
Although just looking and in 2013, the Tiger's were fixtures to play just ONE finalist from 2012 (Freo) twice...so I guess to them it may be a tough fixture.
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Gone Critical
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Komrade can you explain that exceptionally tougher draw 1 more time?
Double up teams 2014 GWS, St K, Bris, Ess and Port (3 of the bottom 4 sides) 8 wins 2 losses
Double up teams 2015 Carl, Ess, NM, Coll, Freo ( 2 of Bottom 4 sides) 8 wins 2 losses
Seems only real conclusion to draw here is Richmond has had 2 easy draws in the last 2 years and made the most of that by winning 80% of their double up matches which is well above the rest of the season average.
Looking at non double up games in 2014 Tiges won 4 of 12 and in 2015 7 of 12. Looks like it may have been lucky you got the draw you did both years.
OK, your basing the double up on where they finished THAT year not where they we're the year before which is not how you rate a draw as in hindsight ANY draw can be made to look easy/hard. You rank it off of exposed form
2014 Draw: GWS - bottom 4
St K - bottom 4
Ess - Top 8 (that they we're kicked out of the finals is not the point - they finished with enough wins to be in the "Top 8")
Port - Top 8
Bris - Middle of the table, 12th
So that argument is wrong
2015 Draw: Carl - Middle of the table, 13th
Ess - Top 8
NM - Top 8
Coll - Middle of the table, 11th
Freo - Top 4
That argument is wrong as well
I'm too tired to go and find it but there are/is a thread/s ranking the 2016 Draw using the same method if you doubt me as well as if they we're played at Home or Away (but that is based around the interstate games)
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Collingwood's 2015 double ups: Melbourne (13th), Essendon (15th), Geelong (10th), Carlton (18th), Richmond (7th)
You went 5-5
Gone Critical
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Cmon Komrade the AFL have to make a prospective order when they do the draw based on the previous years form because they have no choice. That doesn't mean looking at 2014 form to rank whether a draw is easier or harder in 2015 is accurate. Ranking the difficulty of the draw off how teams performed in the year of the draw is patently more accurate. That option is not available to the AFL when they make the draw before the season begins.
What's with the statement that you can't rate the draw in hindsight because any draw can be made to look easy or hard. That's just nonsensical. Now that the 2015 season is complete we can draw more accurate conclusions about who had an easy draw or not because we know how the teams did perform in that season. Suggesting you could do that more accurately at the end of 2015 by referencing the form of teams in 2014 rather than 2015 just doesn't make sense.
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You get it, but don't.
We do have the benefit of hindsight, and exposed 2015 form to evaluate the 2015 fixture now...and Richmond's was soft.
We don't have exposed 2016 form yet, so the AFL uses 2015 finishing positions in an attempt to create relatively equitable fixtures.
w***ers like Rohan Connoly then try to rank difficulty of a 2016 fixture based on 2015 performance!!?? But it is just dribble as there is no exposed 2016 form yet, nobody knows who actually has an easy or hard 2016 fixture yet.
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