Will ASADA/WADA appeal? - UPDATE: ASADA will not appeal - WADA has appealed

[Davo63]

The guy that made it said it was TB4.

The guy that bought it said it was TB4.

The guy that compounded it said it was TB4.


My understanding of 'comfortable satisfaction' clearly needs revision!

So if your pharmacist stocks methadone that makes you a recovering heroin addict?

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Supply chain to where?

#standbythebrownvial

 

[Mahlepi]

So if your pharmacist stocks methadone that makes you a recovering heroin addict?

There is no logic there
Dank is not accused of taking the substances
Hird did, and so too did his players

 

[Davo63]

No, I dont. You know it is very likely your players took banned substances, but for a lack of records, they go unpenalised. Be grateful, celebrate, but don't be an arse. Sure as eggs, there'll be another twist in this.

I'll say innocent, because in this country you are just that until proven guilty. It's called presumption of innocence. That's not being an ass about anything. You are the one saying despite a not guilty finding that you don't accept they deserve to be considered to have been cleared. Who's being an ass?

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

So if your pharmacist stocks methadone that makes you a recovering heroin addict?

Let's cut to the chase...

What was in the brown vial?

 

[Davo63]

There is no logic there
Dank is not accused of taking the substances
Hird did, and so too did him players

I'll go slowly - all those guys could actually have had real life TB4 - which could for instance have gone to anti aging clinics. Whether or not thay dealt with actual TB4 does not put it at Essendon. Just like your pharmacist having methadone does not provide it to you.

 

[thegerman]

i never said innocent, I said not guilty.

And please, you dont think Essendon supporters deserve to be arses after the last 2 years on here?

Maybe, but not if you're going to let your club put God knows what into athletes without due care of their health.

If you are just continuing this line of comment, to say the club has received their punishment, without the care for your players; that is abhorrent.

Perhaps if you really do care about your players, direct some of this effort to the club to make those accountable who used players as guinea pigs.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

i never said innocent, I said not guilty.

And please, you dont think Essendon supporters deserve to be arses after the last 2 years on here?

I'd be utterly embarrassed if I supported Essendon.

The tribunal findings are utterly damming.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

I'll go slowly - all those guys could actually have had real life TB4 - which could for instance have gone to anti aging clinics. Whether or not thay dealt with actual TB4 does not put it at Essendon. Just like your pharmacist having methadone does not provide it to you.

We all know they could have.

That's why the players got off.

But in reality, it's very hard for anyone not bound by levels of satisfaction, to believe that TB4 wasn't in that brown vial.

 

[thegerman]

So if your pharmacist stocks methadone that makes you a recovering heroin addict?

And if the tribunal said they are satisfied the players didn't inject the legal variant......So what did they get?

 

[Mahlepi]

I'll go slowly - all those guys could actually have had real life TB4 - which could for instance have gone to anti aging clinics. Whether or not thay dealt with actual TB4 does not put it at Essendon. Just like your pharmacist having methadone does not provide it to you.

Chief, if I had a personal pharmacist employed by me sending sms messages, and dealing in the quantities he had, and having them at the workplace, and all the staff on something
Well I would assume he was getting the stuff for another business

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

And if the tribunal said they are satisfied the players didn't inject the legal variant......So what did they get?

#standbythebrownvial

 

[thegerman]

Supply chain to where?

To dank. Perhaps read the findings, and the court actions before writing comment on what it appears you have very little knowledge of.

 

[thegerman]

#standbythebrownvial

#standbyinjectionregominethatmatchedTB4

 

[the conch]

not in todays sporting environment. Doping 45 players without their knowledge, especially after this recent case, would be all but impossible

Hundreds of injections. No questions asked. What a dumb arse cultie phenomenon.
I would have thought it would have been impossible then.
Where was J Watsons leadership then? Or couldn't he go against daddy's mate?

 

[thegerman]

Well from the report it seems ASADA couldn't even prove to a comfortable level that first batch from China was TB4. Talk about fairy dust.

They don't need to, charges could be for suspected use, where the plausibility to gaining advantage through such means.

I find it impossible to believe that you are standing up for your club, when they injected unknown substances into your players. It is bemusing that you either find this funny, or that the club means more to you than the players. They are just fodder for you.

Do you know what the outcome could be of a player is given a synthetic growth stimulant, and already have abnormal cell growth?

 

[thegerman]

impossible. The Essendon case was a wake up for the entire league. Theres no way a team would try to dope an entire list without their knowledge.

Also, the players legal team never tried to prove the use of a compliant form of thymosin, so that theory hasnt been tested

Got to say, the injection program matched perfectly the intended injection regime for TB4. Weight of imported TB4 matched the compounding requirements for the vials provided to Dank.

Impossible? The tribunal thought it was possible, yet didn't meet their definition of 'comfortable satisfaction'.

So who provided the definition of that term?

 

[Boxhead_31]

thats what ASADA are wondering. Makes sustaining a charge fairly difficult.

Anyway, Im not going to excuse the club for allowing this, but lack of records alone is not proof of doping

So it's better to get off on a technicality than it is to be fully cleared?

 

[the conch]

I'd be utterly embarrassed if I supported Essendon.

The tribunal findings are utterly damming.

If this happened at the Doggies I wouldn't support them until all the management, admin and personnel with any responsibilities at the time were discarded. I would also be disgusted with the players lack of spine / independent thinking / questionable morality.

 

[Cunctipotent]

Well where the @&&$ are they Sherlock?

Someone either has them or they are destroyed. FFS you are picking him up for what everyone is thinking.

They received a call from Vlad, funny that from there, they 'self' report and have no records.

Common sense is not a strong suit.

Records were destroyed well before that call.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Hundreds of injections. No questions asked. What a dumb arse cultie phenomenon.
I would have thought it would have been impossible then.
Where was J Watsons leadership then? Or couldn't he go against daddy's mate?

So brave.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

If this happened at the Doggies I wouldn't support them until all the management, admin and personnel with any responsibilities at the time were discarded. I would also be disgusted with the players lack of spine / independent thinking / questionable morality.

Completely agree.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Gets silenced by the dodgy bikie types that are associated with the anti ageing/ personal appearance scene.

It's one thing that surprises me, why people are shocked dank isn't concerned about an asada ban - it's his silent partners that will be keeping him up at nights

 

[ezard15]

Seriously guys, move on.

You all got it badly wrong.

Systematic doping just doesn't make sense given the punishments that would be handed out.

Talk about being poor losers.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

It can with laboratory tests. Here is an example - http://www.cloud-clone.us/ELISA/ELISA-Kit-for-Thymosin-Beta-4-(Tb4)-28284.htm At the bottom of the page are links to other tests. This particular is overly complex/expensive and probably too expensive for mass screening. It is probably only a matter of time for a simple kit to be developed. I was looking up its tb4 pharmacokinetics and I ended up here, offering tb4 'help' http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/peptides-growth-factors/85988-thymosin-beta-4-help.html Highlights the money behind the peptides. Also found it has been patented by Roche. These body building forums are so kind, they even give you stuff for free - which is rather disturbing.

View attachment 120585
PS I did not join and get my gift.

This is not why Elisa kits are used. They are notorious for being inaccurate, and the testing industry hates them.

They are a nice screening tool, but that's it.

Just as an example, Elisa is the main tool for testing allergens in food right now. Adoption by industry has been sfa though, because everyone is waiting until a more accurate method using lc-ms is available.