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Jake Carlisle Updates

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So to recap, if I've read this right:

- Carlisle lied to McConville.
- then came clean to him.
- McConville decided to protect both his arse and investment by talking to the AFLPA not StKFC.
- AFLPA advises McConville to look into it but NOT tell the club?!
- we lose picks 5 & 24 for a potential gun, but one with huge issues to overcome.

That about right?!
 
Mowman said:
Are we Unlucky (Carlisle & Lovett) or are we just a badly run club that just seems to find trouble around every corner. 40 years I have followed my beloved Saints and I'm sick of it. Just sack the prick
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How in hell is this our fault?

When arseholes withhold information how can that be construed as a badly run club?
 
Daddy_Barrels said:
So to recap, if I've read this right:

- Carlisle lied to McConville.
- then came clean to him.
- McConville decided to protect both his arse and investment by talking to the AFLPA not StKFC.
- AFLPA advises McConville to look into it but NOT tell the club?!
- we lose picks 5 & 24 for a potential gun, but one with huge issues to overcome.

That about right?!
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Sounds pretty close

Can our players tell the AFL PA to piss off if they want.
Sounds like the AFL PA went to the Cathay Jackson school of crooked unionism
 

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Joffaboy said:
How in hell is this our fault?

When arseholes withhold information how can that be construed as a badly run club?
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If this was any other club, many on this forum would be giving them so much sh1t telling them they should done their research much better, This is disaster IMO
 
Periphery said:
Holy shit you people need to calm the hell down.
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I'm not sure we do... What you have is the players association actively telling a player manager to keep information of a crucial nature from a club in negotiation about his player.

It's a massive undercutting of trust in the whole system.
 
Daddy_Barrels said:
I'm not sure we do... What you have is the players association actively telling a player manager to keep information of a crucial nature from a club in negotiation about his player.

It's a massive undercutting of trust in the whole system.
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Spot on
 
Not nuch of a conspiracy guy, but I feel like the Hawthorn "interest " in Carlisle was part of the deflect from our rapists agenda......
 
Daddy_Barrels said:
So to recap, if I've read this right:

- Carlisle lied to McConville.
- then came clean to him.
- McConville decided to protect both his arse and investment by talking to the AFLPA not StKFC.
- AFLPA advises McConville to look into it but NOT tell the club?!
- we lose picks 5 & 24 for a potential gun, but one with huge issues to overcome.

That about right?!
Click to expand...
It seems that:
Channel nine contacted McConville Tuesday morning (Oct 20)
McConville contacts Carlisle
Carlisle denies there could be an issue
McConville contacts AFLPA Wednesday morning (Oct 21)
AFL advises McConville not to disclose
St Kilda trades for Carlisle Wednesday morning (Oct 21)
McConville contacts Carlisle who now comes clean Wednesday afternoon (Oct 21)
Channel nine begin advertising the video clip Wednesday afternoon (Oct 21)
St Kilda FC goes into damage control Wednesday afternoon (Oct 21)
BigFooty goes into meltdown
 
Mowman said:
If this was any other club, many on this forum would be giving them so much sh1t telling them they should done their research much better, This is disaster IMO
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Tosh
Maybe some have a victim mentality at St. Kilda but this is in now way the clubs fault.

What should they have asked? Oh BTW Jake you haven't got any videos of you snorting coke per chance?

Easy to point fingers but how was our club to know if the information was purposely withheld?
Geez bloody harsh
 

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I don't know why ppl think that any thing will change. The trade has happened, the afl don't give a **** about us and never will, if it was one of the big clubs they would be making arrangements now to compensate them

And don't see why ppl blame the club for this, they have been lied to by everyone, and the afl will let it just go away

We have to accept that he is at our club, just hope that this has been the kick up the arse he needs
So pissed at all this
 
I wonder if the AFLPA advised Carlisle not to come clean to McConville initially. They may have been acting in Carlisle's best interests, but not in the best interests of 43 other St Kilda players.

There are no winners in this.
 
Daddy_Barrels said:
I'm not sure we do... What you have is the players association actively telling a player manager to keep information of a crucial nature from a club in negotiation about his player.

It's a massive undercutting of trust in the whole system.
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Trust? What trust? The AFLPA is there to look after the players. The player manager is there to look after the player and their own interests. At no point do any of those parties have any responsibility to the clubs.

If this was the AFL coming out and saying "Yeah, we knew about it and didn't tell the Saints" then there would be a trust issue. But as far as we know they didn't.

If the AFL has an issue with the way this went down then I can guarantee that they'll do something about it but they also wont make a massive fuss about it. They wont revert the trade or give us any picks as compensation but it will come in other less obvious/related areas.

In the end this revelation doesn't change a thing for us. We still have a 8 year key defender that the club wanted for his on field performance. His off field might not be what we wanted but we should back ourselves in to change that. Plus, I think this could be the kick in the ass that Carlisle needed to really make a change in his life and become a better person and player. If it isn't then he was probably doomed to fail regardless of if the video came out or not.

Anyone that thinks any part of this is the clubs fault needs to get a grip.
 
Periphery said:
Trust? What trust? The AFLPA is there to look after the players. The player manager is there to look after the player and their own interests. At no point do any of those parties have any responsibility to the clubs.

If this was the AFL coming out and saying "Yeah, we knew about it and didn't tell the Saints" then there would be a trust issue. But as far as we know they didn't.

If the AFL has an issue with the way this went down then I can guarantee that they'll do something about it but they also wont make a massive fuss about it. They wont revert the trade or give us any picks as compensation but it will come in other less obvious/related areas.

In the end this revelation doesn't change a thing for us. We still have a 8 year key defender that the club wanted for his on field performance. His off field might not be what we wanted but we should back ourselves in to change that. Plus, I think this could be the kick in the ass that Carlisle needed to really make a change in his life and become a better person and player. If it isn't then he was probably doomed to fail regardless of if the video came out or not.

Anyone that thinks any part of this is the clubs fault needs to get a grip.
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I don't think ANY of this is the club's fault, but negotiating in bad faith, or more pertinently withholding material facts from a party to a negotiation get you disbarred in my world.

You want to ignore it, fine, but I'm disgusted.
 
This WILL blow over eventually. Yes it's disappointing but, like with guys like Hodge and Lake misbehaving for Hawthorn if Jake performs on the field then we will still have won the trade.

We just need to ride out the storm that was in no way our doing and let Jake's actions speak on the field. It is what successful clubs do.
 

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Mowman said:
If this was any other club, many on this forum would be giving them so much sh1t telling them they should done their research much better, This is disaster IMO
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Seems like you have a "any other club is better than ours mentality". Can't see that the saints have done much wrong here.

Personally I think the media hype is blowing this way out of proportion. This is not about St.Kilda. Don't be fooled by the dogs "oh we new better cr*p". If they did why did they request a meeting with Carlisle?

Gold Coast must be absolutely loving that no one is questioning their environment anymore, regardless of the fact that's where Bennell went feral.
 
Rors said:
Should have offered picks 5 & 24 for Lachie Weller & Alex Pearce...

And right now, I'd have taken that deal
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Very very happy with Jake & pick 14 myself

Think about mid July next year this will be a non issue and everyone will be smiling.


As for Mark Evans he has a selective memory about some doctors notes on the drug issue at Hawthorn.
That story was killed , when clearly there was a drug issue in the AFL over a decade ago .
Big end of town bought it out, so it did not see the light of day.

Happy to move forward myself .
 
Daddy_Barrels said:
I don't think ANY of this is the club's fault, but negotiating in bad faith, or more pertinently withholding material facts from a party to a negotiation get you disbarred in my world.

You want to ignore it, fine, but I'm disgusted.
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The club fault comment was not really directed at you but more in general.

It's not about ignoring it. It's about understanding that neither the AFLPA or McConville had any sort of responsibility to look after the Saints.

Of course it's a bad thing that could taint any future interactions with the AFLPA and McConville, but nothing we can do will change what happened and neither of those parties will be involved in any form of compensation.

In the end none of this changes the fact that Carlisle and 14 for 5 and 24 is a good deal and makes us a stronger team in the short and long term.
 
Periphery said:
The club fault comment was not really directed at you but more in general.

It's not about ignoring it. It's about understanding that neither the AFLPA or McConville had any sort of responsibility to look after the Saints.

Of course it's a bad thing that could taint any future interactions with the AFLPA and McConville, but nothing we can do will change what happened and neither of those parties will be involved in any form of compensation.

In the end none of this changes the fact that Carlisle and 14 for 5 and 24 is a good deal and makes us a stronger team in the short and long term.
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Agree 100%
 
I have no doubt the story of Carlisle telling McConville after he signed is bullshit just to cover McConville in any wrong doing!

As I said they are both lying turds!

Its a travisty that our club ended up tied to one of them......I wished the club could have legally rescinded the trades and contracts but obviuosly they couldnt. Carlisle to me will always be a lying druggie no matter what he does on the field he can never undo the damage he has done to the club and supporters IMO!
 
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The AFLPA may have acted in Carlisle's best interests in advising McConville to keep quiet.

However signing a big contract only to have controversy emerge later does not really help Jake all that much. No point signing for a huge amount only to have it reduced to a lesser amount when the crap hits the fan. Or worse, when the contract is torn up and the player sacked. Either way the player/club relationship is off to a very rocky start.

And what of the 40 or so St Kilda players potentially negatively affected by these developments? This could affect their season. Trading pick 5 for a player who could fail to produce could greatly hinder the rebuild and push towards finals footy. Yes, you may advise the AFLPA member to hide stuff from the footy club, but in doing so you're also advising the AFLPA member to hide stuff from other AFLPA members.

It's all a bit conflicted IMO.


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