Review Bad, Ugly, and Horrendous vs Hawks

[Minor Threat]

I was so excited the whole Preseason all the way to opening bounce. That game certainly took the wind out of my sails.
The again, watching the game I couldn’t help but question why I expected anything more than what we put up.
Deflating stuff

 

[ManInTheArena]

Why is everyone talking about disfunctional forward structures? We moved the ball slow and butchered half our kicks. Forwards are generally shit house when the opposition can flood the 50 and the delivery inside 50 is poor. Actually it was worse than poor. I don't think any of our forwards are "cooked", especially Eddie Betts, he was as spritely as I've seen in a long time. They're never going to play well when the forward line is congested AF and kicks inside 50 may as well have been kicked by my 12 year old son.

We were slow with ball movement and rusty with posession, and couldn't handle the Hawks pressure and game plan. We had no answers whatsoever off the field or on it. It should have been a 10 goal flogging on our home deck. Atrocious.

Matt Crouch, Rory Sloane, Rory Laird, and I thought Wayne Milera, played valiantly under the circumstances.

Jones did okay in his first game considering we were playing so badly.

 

[King Elvis]

Why is everyone talking about disfunctional forward structures? We moved the ball slow and butchered half our kicks. Forwards are generally shit house when the opposition can flood the 50 and the delivery inside 50 is poor. Actually it was worse than poor. I don't think any of our forwards are "cooked", especially Eddie Betts, he was as spritely as I've seen in a long time. They're never going to play well when the forward line is congested AF.

We were slow with ball movement and rusty with posession, and couldn't handle the Hawks pressure and game plan. We had no answers whatsoever off the field or on it. It should have been a 10 goal flogging on our home deck. Atrocious.

Matt Crouch, Rory Sloane, Rory Laird, and I thought Wayne Milera, played valiantly under the circumstances.

Jones did okay in his first game considering we were playing so badly.

Classic chicken/egg as to which is the trigger; but both are shit.

 

[mick500]

Bad : Out coached.

Ugly : Injuries to doedee and Douglas.

Horrendous : Our lack of hunger or desire to work as hard as the hawks and failure to keep running or offering leads or plug up holes in the transition into the Hawks back to forward line. Basically 1 way running side.

Not good enough.


Optimistic view : At least it was round 1 and not a knock out final.

Pessimistic view : Seasons shot after 1 round. Pyke can't coach, Crows have no plan B other than a lightning symbol for the last 5 mins when we are down by 5 goals.

 

[ManInTheArena]

Classic chicken/egg as to which is the trigger; but both are shit.

Maybe, time will tell if we can get our shit together.

 

[Elite Crow]

I50 tackles were a joke too.

Yep, 7 to 19. Zero to Douglas, Jones and Murphy, Betts with 3.

So 3 of our 4 small forwards laid 0 inside 50 tackles. What the ****?

 

[Elite Crow]

Why is everyone talking about disfunctional forward structures? We moved the ball slow and butchered half our kicks. Forwards are generally shit house when the opposition can flood the 50 and the delivery inside 50 is poor. Actually it was worse than poor. I don't think any of our forwards are "cooked", especially Eddie Betts, he was as spritely as I've seen in a long time. They're never going to play well when the forward line is congested AF and kicks inside 50 may as well have been kicked by my 12 year old son.

We were slow with ball movement and rusty with posession, and couldn't handle the Hawks pressure and game plan. We had no answers whatsoever off the field or on it. It should have been a 10 goal flogging on our home deck. Atrocious.

Matt Crouch, Rory Sloane, Rory Laird, and I thought Wayne Milera, played valiantly under the circumstances.

Jones did okay in his first game considering we were playing so badly.

Early when the tone of the game was set we butchered our inside 50s and we never recovered, our kicking into inside 50 was amateur stuff.

Having said that, of concern was the lack of movement and the ability of any of our key forwards to take a big mark. None of them can, to still see Eddie flying is a disgrace. He just never ducking takes them.

I love Tex but ****, he’d want to improve. Jenkins was pathetic. The smalls pretty much useless. When your bombing the ball and the ball hits the ground, how about laying a fuxking tackle.

 

[Crow till I die]

Why is everyone talking about disfunctional forward structures? We moved the ball slow and butchered half our kicks. Forwards are generally shit house when the opposition can flood the 50 and the delivery inside 50 is poor. Actually it was worse than poor. I don't think any of our forwards are "cooked", especially Eddie Betts, he was as spritely as I've seen in a long time. They're never going to play well when the forward line is congested AF and kicks inside 50 may as well have been kicked by my 12 year old son.

We were slow with ball movement and rusty with posession, and couldn't handle the Hawks pressure and game plan. We had no answers whatsoever off the field or on it. It should have been a 10 goal flogging on our home deck. Atrocious.

Matt Crouch, Rory Sloane, Rory Laird, and I thought Wayne Milera, played valiantly under the circumstances.

Jones did okay in his first game considering we were playing so badly.

I agree with most of that except our forwards were always playing 2 metres behind instead of 2 metres in front considering the hack kicks coming out of defence were mainly dropping short all night. It was dumb forward play

 

[AmericanCrow]

C'mon man you're making yourself look silly. The coaches got them to play to a game plan that simply will never stack up against Hawthorn if you want to count that. It plays to their hands. A number of our players were good and tried their guts out. But they were handcuffed

Nope, am tired of players getting free passes. It's ALWAYS an excuse.

When are we holding the players responsible for crap ass performances.

Last year it was "camp" this year its the "coaches"

Enough

 

[Drewie11]

Walker, Jenkins, Doedee, Douglas out

Fogarty, Greenwood, Otten and Stengle in

 

[pjcrows]

View attachment 640579

Here's another one. Obviously a clogged forward line, this is a repeat entry. Kelly is kicking into 50 and there's an obvious bit of space between these players.

But as you can see, the SEVEN players we have inside 50 in that zone are not in any position to lead into that area! This includes Lynch and Walker who are close together on the left of screen. Jenkins is out of screen on the left. Lynch literally does not bother whatsoever to make a contest, Walker can't get there, and then we have a bunch of other blokes closer to the 50 mark who are never going to be effectively utilized from this kick. And there was a period of time that it was obvious the ball is coming back inside 50.

Why are all of Walker, Jenkins and Lynch within 20m of eachother inside 50, but none of them lead into the obvious space available for a kick inside 50? The Hawthorn player knows this is exactly where the kick is going. But not a single player leads into the space or is even in a position to do so despite having plenty of numbers in the area.

The result is a Hawthorn player takes an uncontested mark in a paddock

That's basically Clarkson's gameplan. Guard space, and roll that structure all over the ground. We looked like rookies trying to just bomb it in to that. How could we not have been prepared for that, after 6 months of preparation?

 

[CrowBloke]

1) correct. you are absolutely allowed to think Keath played badly
2) what you aren't allowed to do is expect to be taken seriously when doing so. it's so far from reality it's not even a joke anymore.

It's so unlike you to jump on a bandwagon to sink the slipper . I thought you'd know better by now than to rattle my chain .
You're smart enough --- or you fake being smart enough, more likely --- to understand logic, so here's some just for you:
--- I explained several times why I watched Keath closely, looking for good things to happen. I repeat, I was happy he was selected and on reflection maybe my perception of his game was distorted by my high expectations of/for him. Reality is like that (see below).
--- I thought Keath had a poor game and said why, specifically, that his use of the ball was ineffective and he takes too long to dispose of it (and that was before I knew his DE was 50%). While Keath was thinking, Hawthorn were setting up.
--- while he had 20 possessions including 6 marks, he had only 2 tackles (the new kid, Jones, had 4!)
--- only 10 of those possessions were effective. By contrast, a week earlier Milera had 29 possessions @ 100% DE. Even you would agree that was a terrific effort.

1) everybody in here is allowed to voice an opinion and back it up with info to support that opinion. Thank you for verifying that, at least .
2) "So far from reality"?? You shouldn't have got me started.
"Reality" is subjective (look it up --- oh wait --- I just remember that you revile Googlers/Googling). One's perception is one's subjective reality, and mine was to be disappointed by Keath's game. You want to argue "reality" with me? Go for it!
Now, the weight of opinion in here is quite the opposite, so I've had to rethink my opinion (something you never do) which would probably change if I watched the game again out of respect for say Kane McGoodwin or jenny61_99, but
a) I don't have access or a copy to do that and
b) I never want to watch that game again. It was painful enough yesterday.
To all those who thought Keath played well, no worries. I won't be attacking you for being eg "silly" or out of touch with reality. He took a few good contested marks, stopping some Hawthorn advances, but 10 times out of 20 he disposed of the ball ineffectively. From maybe 5 of those the ball came back, quick-smart.

Now, off you go Sanders, to look for someone who'll tremble in your mighty shadow. Btw, loooove the new avatar which is big-headed (hence the mighty shadow, I suspect) and cringeworthy. So apt!

 

[AmericanCrow]

Last year was a failure off field, they ****** up our fitness program, they ****** up our preseason.

The club and Pyke has been so focused on correcting last year, why? Because he admits they ****** up.

This year is so far one game. They played like crap. They thought they would just win and the coach has a lot to do with that mindset. As the saying goes, they weren’t ready to play and the Hawks were.

Again, there is always some sort of excuse covering the players--the ones, you know, actually playing game after game of this type of product.

They revamped everything because of all the crying that didn't occur until WELL into the season and correlated exactly with these types of performances.

So the players got what they wanted right? By that I mean camp was held to meet their "standard" right??

And yet the same craptastic result we saw from week 10 on last season was what the players put out there.

Effort was lacking and poor decision making was rife.

That ain't on the coaches.

So I ask, when do the players get called out on the carpet?

 

[VSTone]

Any chance we can seek to hit a target by hand or foot in the first 6 weeks?

 

[Viva la Mattner]

Nope, am tired of players getting free passes. It's ALWAYS an excuse.

When are we holding the players responsible for crap ass performances.

Last year it was "camp" this year its the "coaches"

Enough

I’m on both sides of this AmericanCrow
Camp last year could tell messed players up and were mentally shot

At this stage I’m not getting too pissed off of a round 1 performance, round 1 is notoriously known for throwing up crazy results, if the same shit is happening come say round 5/6 we’re in trouble

If the season does pan out to be a failure then a clean out is needed, otherwise we’re on track to be just like St.Kilda

 

[AmericanCrow]

I’m on both sides of this AmericanCrow
Camp last year could tell messed players up and were mentally shot

At this stage I’m not getting too pissed off of a round 1 performance, round 1 is notoriously known for throwing up crazy results, if the same shit is happening come say round 5/6 we’re in trouble

If the season does pan out to be a failure then a clean out is needed, otherwise we’re on track to be just like St.Kilda

Fair enough, but I am hot under the collar as you all can tell.

I thought for a team with the talent level we all seem to believe we have, it was downright embarrassing.

Maybe it just was one of those games--but I saw enough to see stark similarities to the nonsense we saw last year.

 

[mistylake]

Need a McAdam or Davis. McAdam injured with a hammy. Davis kicked 3 other night. Would run with him and Greenwood who is a very good pack contested mark. Would also bring in Gallucci for Murphy who is average at best. You right Jenkins and Walker are useless at taking a pack mark. They are lead up forwards

I’m assuming Himmelberg is injured but he might need to come in as a marking target.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

It all started when we selected David Mackay. A stupid, idiotic, disgusting selection that immediately threw up red flags. Did we learn from last year? Obviously not judging from that one decision before the game even started. Can't move forward when we have pathetic decision making like that.

It looked like our players had done everything but play football over the off season. Horrendous skills. Destroyed in the air. Destroyed on the ground. Mutilated in the forward line. Annihilated by a severely undermanned Hawthorn midfield. An absolutely pathetic performance. The players should be ashamed.

Don Pyke had his pants pulled down. His pants were then taken off and thrown in the river. It was like he was coaching with his penis exposed to the players and that's all the players could think about throughout the match. He needs to take ownership, put his pants back on and learn. If I hear excuses like "we just needed to execute better" I might vomit.

Douglas is shit. Mackay is shit. Jacobs is cooked. Walker is cooked. Lynch is soft. Jenkins sucks. Betts is finished. Knight did nothing. Murphy did nothing. Milera was awful. Laird was bad. Kelly tried but he just sucks. Gibbs was useless.

And then Doedee does his ACL. Well **** me the signs aren't good

Forget the fact he was by no means our worse player .....but using that decision as a reason for the loss, shows the shallowness of your ability to analyze a football match

This is just analysis from the bottom of a beer glass

 

[Elite Crow]

Again, there is always some sort of excuse covering the players--the ones, you know, actually playing game after game of this type of product.

They revamped everything because of all the crying that didn't occur until WELL into the season and correlated exactly with these types of performances.

So the players got what they wanted right? By that I mean camp was held to meet their "standard" right??

And yet the same craptastic result we saw from week 10 on last season was what the players put out there.

Effort was lacking and poor decision making was rife.

That ain't on the coaches.

So I ask, when do the players get called out on the carpet?

Have you read this board? Do you think the players are getting off lightly?

What you’re being called out for is your poxy thoughts on last year. To somehow think last year was a sook is delusional. The club is responsible for getting the off field right and they fuxked it. They’ve admitted it but somehow you are now denying it.

Effort was lacking is on both the coaches and players. The coaches set mindset, they clearly failed.

Coaches spend the whole preseason on gameplans, working on the players decision making. They failed.

The players sucked and sucked bad but so did the coaches. Having said that it was round 1. They both can respond, let’s see if they are capable.

As for the camp, the fallout didn’t start in rd 10, there were rumblings from when it finished, it just got louder when the club handled the aftermath so poorly, Don admitted he got it wrong.

 

[Hugh Jass]

I thought our much heralded half back line was terrible. They made some really bad mistakes early which saw them go completely into their shell.

There was zero drive and attack from there which resulted in slow movement, rushed kicks and increased pressure. It was just hard work moving the ball up the ground.

Its games like these where the lack of class really shows.

I actually don't blame the forwards for this one.
The half back line is where it broke down.

Agree on the half back line, Smith and Laird were horrible.

 

[Viva la Mattner]

Fair enough, but I am hot under the collar as you all can tell.

I thought for a team with the talent level we all seem to believe we have, it was downright embarrassing.

Maybe it just was one of those games--but I saw enough to see stark similarities to the nonsense we saw last year.

I was pissed too! Stayed to the end against better judgement
Watching them live yesterday the thing that stood out was the lack of spread, we’d lose a clearance we would be jumper chasing and look lost

Win a clearance we’d kick to dead open space with no desire shown from the forwards to lead or make a space for a teammate to lead into.
The lack of forward line pressure was disgusting, Hawthorn strolled out like a hot knife through butter

A lot of finger pointing going on at times
It’s as if the games motto and Pyke plastered this on the whiteboard pre-match

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Was it 2010 that we lost Porplyzia in a Round 1 Hawthorn game?

 

[AmericanCrow]

Have you read this board? Do you think the players are getting off lightly?

What you’re being called out for is your poxy thoughts on last year. To somehow think last year was a sook is delusional. The club is responsible for getting the off field right and they fuxked it. They’ve admitted it but somehow you are now denying it.

Effort was lacking is on both the coaches and players. The coaches set mindset, they clearly failed.

Coaches spend the whole preseason on gameplans, working on the players decision making. They failed.

The players sucked and sucked bad but so did the coaches. Having said that it was round 1. They both can respond, let’s see if they are capable.

No, what I am saying is the players all covered themselves in excuse making when they started putting these types of performances out on the regular, all of last season.

Last year they screamed long and loud it was "camp". I started in by saying what is their excuse this year? Cause that product was identical to last seasons "camp".

I don't at all think it's out of bounds to call them out.

As or the board, I see a hell of a lot of its the "coaches" excuses.

That won't fly with me--sorry, but these players --the same ones that said everything was "camp" last year, just put up the same effort and result to start off the season.

Next week better be a very different display or this season is going down the toilet fast

 

[AmericanCrow]

I was pissed too! Stayed to the end against better judgement
Watching them live yesterday the thing that stood out was the lack of spread, we’d lose a clearance we would be jumper chasing and look lost

Win a clearance we’d kick to dead open space with no desire shown from the forwards to lead or make a space for a teammate to lead into.
The lack of forward line pressure was disgusting, Hawthorn strolled out like a hot knife through butter

A lot of finger pointing going on at times
It’s as if the games motto and Pyke plastered this on the whiteboard pre-match

View attachment 640655

Exactly right and those fingers should be pointed in the mirror

 

[Crowbling]

Thought the players tried, just did not execute at an AFL level.

Mackay and Douglas way off the pace, Knight and Murphy are limited footballers. Jacobs and Tex just roam around the field like stiffs in the twilight of their careers. Really sad to see.

Still 95.45% of the home and away season to go.