Karma Train
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So then you are basically saying is that there is a lack off effort as well as poor coaching? Correct.
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No, I am saying the priorities for improvement are gameplan, structure, positional setup.
Player workrate, as a whole, was not substandard in the first 2 weeks
The Old Dark Navy's
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It won't happen. Some players are untouchable for what they can do, regardless of whether they do it. When one of these players don't meet KPIs, we won't know what their KPIs were, so we get told that they followed instructions for this game, that there KPIs were different that week anyway.
This isn't a Carlton thing, this is across the board. Coaches support players, which they should, especially externally.
Karma Train
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At the end of the day if you want to lay 100% of the blame on the coaching panel then go ahead. Many would disagree with you. As I see it, it is a combination of poor coaching, poor game plan, poor player selection, as well as minimal effort from the certain players. We also have poor player development, but thats a whole other story.
I get that, but look at Beveridge... had no qualms dropping Daniels and look where he is now... Johanason dropped and was med sub finally today which showed he started to pull his finger out. Kpis of course will be slightly different for each player but what I allude to is if you had a chance to go tackle, chase, support, block and didn’t you’ve not met that requirement.
JustaBattler
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I dont think Teaguey is going anywhere and i hope not either- but he could do with some help.
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I agree with you completely. I'm just adopting a fatalistic approach.
Can anyone remember a surprising omission by us in recent history?
I don't think Gibbs or Murphy ever got dropped. Kreuzer never got dropped. I think Cripps may have got dropped after token minutes in his first game or am I imagining that. Still, not a surprise there.
The last one I can remember at this moment was Chris Yarran by Mick Malthouse.
I wasn’t there ...
but understand it was driven by Teague. Main focus player effort/commitment
- Oct 4, 2015
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Yeah... that's clearly what I said isn't it?
I guess cherry picking and zeroing in is your MO on here...
How about you go and read the whole conversation before chiming in???
Btw, pushed square in the back is bs... he tried to play for the free and deservedly so didn't get it.
- Oct 4, 2015
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Was going to say this too...
Selection has been very safe for a very long time and there's no sign of that changing.
The chances of a notable omission (i.e. Murphy, Casboult, Curnow) are essentially zero, which is why this talk of a brutal review doesn't particularly interest me.
juzz88
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I get where you're coming from, but when did Kreuzer ever deserve to be dropped?
We could use some of his hardness right about now. Physically and mentally.
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I get where you're coming from, but when did Kreuzer ever deserve to be dropped?
We could use some of his hardness right about now. Physically and mentally.
Not saying he did necessarily, although there were some detractors who thought Warnock should be number one ruck ahead of him back in the day.
It's worth noting that at the time Teague was elected as head coach the word around the media circles was that the Carlton board etc. Weren't too keen on him, but the very vocal support from fans and players as well as the apparent on field success made it extremely difficult to deny him.
Is it possible they were right to have doubts? I thought Teague was great early and was excellent at making on field changes in game, but that seems to have deserted him. Also one of the big moves was getting the senior heads back on ball -Murphy, Curnow being the main ones. Now that they're struggling or have had role changes the lack of development from all our young mids bar Walsh is frighteningly laid bare for all to see.
Is that a symptom or a coincidence? Who knows, but right now clearly Dow and O'Brien in particular are miles off it while Stocker and Kennedy can't even be seen. Not to mention SPS and Setterfield who have had bizarre position changes.
Is it possible they were right to have doubts? I thought Teague was great early and was excellent at making on field changes in game, but that seems to have deserted him. Also one of the big moves was getting the senior heads back on ball -Murphy, Curnow being the main ones. Now that they're struggling or have had role changes the lack of development from all our young mids bar Walsh is frighteningly laid bare for all to see.
Is that a symptom or a coincidence? Who knows, but right now clearly Dow and O'Brien in particular are miles off it while Stocker and Kennedy can't even be seen. Not to mention SPS and Setterfield who have had bizarre position changes.
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The Old Dark Navy's
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graig ballamy be nice to pick his brains or a couple of tackling sessions
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That would cause too much angst between players and club.
They need to drop key players who aren't performing. That will send the message that no one is safe.
Teague unfortunately isn't the type to do it. Just like his predecessors.
Exactly why is Murphy playing HFF? It's obvious to everyone including Teague that he can't cut it as a mid any more. So they need to re-invent him to fit him into the side so he can hit his 300 games. This is just pure BS.
Setters shouldn't be on the wing, he should be in the guts, why is freakin Ed Curnow still in there?
Why is Levi getting games ahead of OMac?
These sorts of things are very detrimental.
Teague needs to show some balls and cut the crap.
OUTS: Murphy, Levi, Curnow INS: Stocker, OMac, JSOS
But instead it'll be more like
OUT: Fogarty IN: Betts
He's just frothing at the thought of sticking Betts out there and Fogarty, well he's on thin ice because he's actually showing something, just like OMac did...
That's probably an AFLPA and collective bargaining issue tbh, the AFLPA wouldn't allow too much of that.
So after having a weekend to sit on our performance I’ve had a few thoughts about expectations on this group. It’s okay to have high expectations and I think they all do of themselves. It actually reminds me of the port Adelaide group in 2018/2019. They just picked up Rockliff, Motlop and Wingard. Guess where they finished. And look at them now. They finished 10th. I guess they’re port and we’re Carlton our external pressure is much greater. But in 1-2 years time we will be up there I can feel it. We just need to sit tight and believe. No tearing down Teague and the assistants. No blaming plowman who has been a rock for some time on the smalls. I don’t want to lose to Fremantle and GC but if it happens it’s going to be a tough year again for us. The club needs to hold steady. We need to resign Teague like Richmond did with Hardwick. And port did with Hinkley.
Unless the base salary is sufficient, no player would accept a performance bed contract, particularly where being played out of position (over which the player has no control) can severely impact output. Also it can lead to selfish plays in an effort to maximize individual return at the expense of the overall team’s performance.
Karma Train
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thanks for that mate. Glad to see Teague has noticed a lack of effort amongst the players, lets see what he does at team selection this week. I just hope he has the guts to take a good look at himself and how he is performing.
A bit early to place Teague in the re-signing debate. The long term coaches that eventually won flags after extending their stays have been cited here before. I haven't seen a list of the long term 'busts', one that includes Eade, Craig, Daniher and Scott. And while they are doing a good job, Buckley and Hinkley are yet to achieve the ultimate success.
BTW, it was Watts that transferred from Melbourne to Port, not Wingard.
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We only need to re-sign teague if not only the board believe he is the right coach, but also the players.
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