Autopsy Round 7, 2021: Hawks refuse to take the field

[spudmaster]

Moore had five possessions

You sure??

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I'll give whoever said that an ok as definitely in the last on tv they said it was 5th possession. He did get at least a couple more but not 13 more. One of those stat records is wrong. Could b yours could b tv who knows.

Darcy Moore (Pies) had 5 possies. Probably a simple case of getting your wires crossed (they may have mentioned it while our game was on etc)

 

[Messenger]

Got a rare trip to a corporate box today full of gobshite St Kilda supporters.

Drank their beer, but I wasn’t happy about it.

 

[Hawk Dork]

So Taz said “taking nothing away from the Saints but (Adlib) “you never see a hawks defence that far off the pace like they were today”

is this the case (didn’t see the game)

it started from the middle or their backline our backline just couldnt cope

 

[Davo-27]

thought we had a chance, but the Saints were just too motivated and we lacked some punch in the midfield to be competitive, JOM in his best form of his career, he misses the game and our midfield disintegrates, we desperately need to get some midfield talent, cant rely on what we have tbh.

not much to be said about the game, just got beaten by a better team with motivation to perform.

 

[Messenger]

So Taz said “taking nothing away from the Saints but (Adlib) “you never see a hawks defence that far off the pace like they were today”

is this the case (didn’t see the game)

That was the case, yes.

 

[moginie]

I'm pretty fearful that losses like that may do more harm than good. Instead of short term pain ... could be long term injury.Team morale would be shot & how confident do you reckon some of our younger players would be feeling right now? Ouch!

I don't think so to be honest.

The loss to Melbourne in 2006 just after we'd beaten Richmond in Launceston is one that immediately springs to mind.

 

[spudmaster]

Got a rare trip to a corporate box today full of gobshite St Kilda supporters.

Drank their beer, but I wasn’t happy about it.

Did we start to look better after each consecutive beer?

 

[Tuck In]

I came to be positive and find words to reflect what we saw....mmmm...nope, I got nothing.

So disappointing

 

[Mercy Seat]

That’s a big call. We lost 7 games in 2004 by more than 10 goals, plus a further 4 between 40 and 60 points.

I think it’s easy to look back at ‘04 now with rose-coloured glasses, because there were a number of players on the list (11 to be exact) who went on to play in the ‘08 premiership. But the list appeared to be in diabolical shape at the time - it took a new coaching staff (and the genius of Andrew Russell) for players like Bateman, Ladson and Osborne to realise their full potential.

Our current list is obviously a long way off contending, but I think we’ll be pleasantly surprised at how many of the guys currently aged 23 and under develop into good footballers with some elite young talent alongside them. We just need to make sure we nail our early picks in the next couple of drafts.

It will be a long process, but it will be worth it in the end. Just like those annual beltings by Port at Football Park in the mid-2000s became much more palatable after we got our hands on a few premiership cups.

We got smashed by 10+ goals a number of times in 06 as well and even a few times in 07. It’s part of the process.

 

[Blackhawk42]

I'll give whoever said that an ok as definitely in the last on tv they said it was 5th possession. He did get at least a couple more but not 13 more. One of those stat records is wrong. Could b yours could b tv who knows.

Definitely 100% said '4th quarter disposals'.

 

[brew]

Rebuilding they said

 

[cuttlefish]

Just when you think Clarko isn't the man to get us those high draft picks, he sends out todays squad...and together, they've really come up with the goods!
Those high picks are ours to lose, now!

 

[Maybloomer]

Just home from work, opened up the score...ugh.
Will read through Game day and autopsy after some wine, and then disconnect the internet for a few days so I don't see any replays. LOL.

For the first time in over 40 years I switched off a Hawks game early - before half time. Took the dogs for a walk, had 3 wines and watched the rest via Kayo delayed. I should’ve gone the whiskey.
The good news is I’ll be flying to Tassie in a few weeks to watch the Jason Horne Cup.

 

[savagelunchbox]

I'm pretty fearful that losses like that may do more harm than good. Instead of short term pain ... could be long term injury.Team morale would be shot & how confident do you reckon some of our younger players would be feeling right now? Ouch!

Not necessarily.

The player are smart enough to make it onto an AFL list so playing a style that isn't attacking, overly defensive and isn't effective at scoring yet only sees us lose by 20 is just as effective at doing long-term harm. They know that seeing forwards sitting at the top of the square when there's an acre of space 40m out from goal yet having to kick it to the square isn't going to win them many games.
However playing in a way that's attacking and very now and again will click and see us in winning positions, but may also see us get blown out a few times can be motivating knowing that they're improving and that there's light at the end of the tunnel.

It's a myth used by people who haven't played top level sport who says that losing big is only a negative.

 

[thehardway]

That was the case, yes.

The ball was coming in quick and fast but we did look disorganized and panicked at times. And let's face it, our key backs Hartigan, Frost and O'Brien are honest battlers at best.

 

[The hands of stone]

I’m with you 100%. Not gonna go far with him in the midfield. Our poor forwards

Titch is his own worst enemy . In a good side with good link up skilled mids he is invaluable .
In a poor/average side he gets seen as an accumulater who doesnt hurt the opposition.

Hopefully in a season or two he gets viewed as the first .

 

[Simon Crawshay]

We're in an unfortunate position where we have a competitive, albeit second tier class of mature players; McEvoy, Ceglar, Hartigan, Shiels, Phillips, ect, whilst our 'youth' (Hanrahan, Moore, ect) aren't anywhere near becoming premiership players.

Our hopes; Day, Brockman, Downie, Reeves aren't ready & the players keeping us competitive (Wingard, Burgoyne, Bruest, Gunston, Mitchell, O'Meara) probably won't be in contention for a premiership by the time these kids develop.

We're literally in no-man's land. It's bloody depressing. I've never been this pessimistic about our list before.

Great post you have articulated most of my concerns.

I can handle a loss for a developing side but it is the age profile and overall makeup of our list that worries me more.

90% of our talented players are in the upper age bracket and we are thread bare in quality 23 to 28 year olds.

Also the structural makeup of the list is heavy with rangy half back flankers and slow 5 foot 11 wingers. We are severely lacking in quality, quick, big mids and our ruck division is probably worst in the league (no offence to big boy who tries his guts out)

Goinf to be an interesting off season to see what direction the club takes with the rebuild.

 

[hawkman]

Port getting smashed by Brisbane. Even the good teams can put in a shocker.

One horrible game isn't great but just need to respond next week

 

[Nastyfish]

Real tough day at the office..
We get the Saints on their home deck (can’t remember the last time we didn’t play them at Marvel)
First time all year they’re at full strength and with their season on the line..
So we decide this week is the best time to rest two of our best and most experienced mids?? Crazy selection decisions..

Seemed like from the start we never believed we could compete- the mindset wasn’t there and when they threw everything at us we just crumbled..

Senior players look like the games gone passed them and younger players just weren’t ready to compete and got a reality check.. very difficult viewing and hoping we don’t see many more of these types of games this season..

Shows the limits of “play the kids”. It’s a shame the old hands can’t offer more around the kids. Those days are gone. Clarko has a tough job to balance providing opportunities while remaining competitive. Don’t think the kids learn much from such a hiding. So he needs to keep us competitive while playing the kids who offer the most.

Midfield smashed again. So slow. Such rubbish skills. Mitchell, worpel, shiels and others not running two ways and turning it over. Omeara and wingard in. Might be time for shiels to sit.

We had too many talls up forward, and they destroyed us from half back. Who are we going with up forward? Got one too many big men, especially with gunner not fit yet. Be good to persist with Jeka but I’m not sure it can work with the other two.

Let’s bring in some good ball users like hopefully Downie, or maybe greaves. They could be part of the future, let’s find out more. One can replace Morrison who was rubbish.

TOB not the worst, but out ‘cause we are too tall, with gunners the swing man. Breust dropped to send a message for a lame effort. Was he any better than Ollie today? I suppose at least he can finish, but the effort and presence was lacking.

Big boy smashed today. It’s looking dire in the ruck.

CJ so exciting but one on one not great. Maybe he can come up to the wing. Greaves down back.

The lack of skill and poise from hartigan and frost was depressing but there is no one to replace these ball butchers. Those turnovers are killers.

It’s gonna be a grind - I said after Melbourne I thought this is the worst hawks team I have seen. Better coach than 2004 I guess.

 

[Nastyfish]

Great post you have articulated most of my concerns.

I can handle a loss for a developing side but it is the age profile and overall makeup of our list that worries me more.

90% of our talented players are in the upper age bracket and we are thread bare in quality 23 to 28 year olds.

Also the structural makeup of the list is heavy with rangy half back flankers and slow 5 foot 11 wingers. We are severely lacking in quality, quick, big mids and our ruck division is probably worst in the league (no offence to big boy who tries his guts out)

Goinf to be an interesting off season to see what direction the club takes with the rebuild.

Tall forward stocks look good. Needs in order are are midfield, KPD, ruck, small forward.

 

[eldorado]

Titch is his own worst enemy . In a good side with good link up skilled mids he is invaluable .

Our inside/outside balance is bad.

We have no one to accelerate away after the third (or so) close-in handball receieve. All we are really doing a lot of the time is a succession of quick handballs to someone who then needs to boot the ball quickly, rather than the final handball finding someone free, and away.

 

[Nastyfish]

How was Lewis' work rate? Hoping tv just made it look poor?

Soft. Folded like a tissue after the stomach tap.

 

[Bremner20]

We have a massive problem in the ruck.
Gawn owned us & we get thumped
Ryder smacks us & we get pummelled
Against good rucks our mids will mostly be 2nd to the ball.

We need another quality mobile ruckman/ forward . In the past this position has been undervalued by Clarko but for some reason this year I’ve noticed the ruckman are having more influence and ours unfortunately aren’t up to it McEvoy tries his guts out and is a great mark but just this year looks too slow and Ceglar is just a poorer version of McEvoy .

 

[Nastyfish]

His disposal has always been average, even at BHH. He's not the answer for mine when you already have Worpel, Shiels, Phillips and Mitchell in the midfield who are all average kicks. We need to get Downie into the team for run and his kicking.

He’s not the answer but he worked harder than those other lads.

 

[SA HAWK]

That’s a big call. We lost 7 games in 2004 by more than 10 goals, plus a further 4 between 40 and 60 points.

I think it’s easy to look back at ‘04 now with rose-coloured glasses, because there were a number of players on the list (11 to be exact) who went on to play in the ‘08 premiership. But the list appeared to be in diabolical shape at the time - it took a new coaching staff (and the genius of Andrew Russell) for players like Bateman, Ladson and Osborne to realise their full potential.

Our current list is obviously a long way off contending, but I think we’ll be pleasantly surprised at how many of the guys currently aged 23 and under develop into good footballers with some elite young talent alongside them. We just need to make sure we nail our early picks in the next couple of drafts.

It will be a long process, but it will be worth it in the end. Just like those annual beltings by Port at Football Park in the mid-2000s became much more palatable after we got our hands on a few premiership cups.

I mean the list is in a worse position.