News Sam Hayes signs for North Melbourne VFL

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RussellEbertHandball said:
Just another stupid management issue around our rucks that I have been banging on about for almost a decade now.

Before Hinkley, I had the odd whinge about a ruck selection here or there, or the odd development issue, but since Hinkley it has been a constant gripe, not enough of them, not a proper spread across the age brackets, stupidly not using an insurance policy, not playing them at the right time etc.

Unfortunately this will continue on and on until at least one of the head coach, assistant coaches, Football Ops Manager, List Manager, and head recruiter is an ex ruckman or ex KPP of 195+cms height who had to play as 2nd ruck.

They just don't understand them and how to manage them properly.
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Reeks of a coach desperately trying to 'bury' his failure to develop a young ruckman.

I will always come back to that seriously good ruckman from Norwood - Bill Wedding. Huge, lumbering giant but a magnificent palmer to a teammate and could out mark almost anyone. And please don't tell me footy in the so called 'good ol' days' wasn't as fast as the modern era. Perhaps not as quick in some areas but a quality palming/marking ruckman was and always will be a plus.
 
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What on earth is going on with our list management?

We've set this guy up as the future of our ruck division, they liked him enough at SANFL level that he won the B&F. He comes in and performs admirably, in line with what you'd expect from a ruck of his age and experience, and he gets harshly dropped and then left out for a midseason draft pick.

Did he steal Hinkley's carpark or something?

He's now gotta be a flight risk, and his trade value is much lower than his actual value because he's arguably our 4th choice ruck despite being comfortably our best tap ruckman.

Unless Teakle is some sort of young Gawn, we're blowing this hard, again.
 
El_Scorcho said:
What on earth is going on with our list management?

We've set this guy up as the future of our ruck division, they liked him enough at SANFL level that he won the B&F. He comes in and performs admirably, in line with what you'd expect from a ruck of his age and experience, and he gets harshly dropped and then left out for a midseason draft pick.

Did he steal Hinkley's carpark or something?

He's now gotta be a flight risk, and his trade value is much lower than his actual value because he's arguably our 4th choice ruck despite being comfortably our best tap ruckman.

Unless Teakle is some sort of young Gawn, we're blowing this hard, again.
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Probably some dumb statistical measure that he's falling short on.

Unfortunately the football media suck so nobody asks the questions that need to be asked, such as those posed above.
 
El_Scorcho said:
What on earth is going on with our list management?

We've set this guy up as the future of our ruck division, they liked him enough at SANFL level that he won the B&F. He comes in and performs admirably, in line with what you'd expect from a ruck of his age and experience, and he gets harshly dropped and then left out for a midseason draft pick.

Did he steal Hinkley's carpark or something?

He's now gotta be a flight risk, and his trade value is much lower than his actual value because he's arguably our 4th choice ruck despite being comfortably our best tap ruckman.

Unless Teakle is some sort of young Gawn, we're blowing this hard, again.
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s**t club, plenty of history.
 
El_Scorcho said:
What on earth is going on with our list management?

We've set this guy up as the future of our ruck division, they liked him enough at SANFL level that he won the B&F. He comes in and performs admirably, in line with what you'd expect from a ruck of his age and experience, and he gets harshly dropped and then left out for a midseason draft pick.

Did he steal Hinkley's carpark or something?

He's now gotta be a flight risk, and his trade value is much lower than his actual value because he's arguably our 4th choice ruck despite being comfortably our best tap ruckman.

Unless Teakle is some sort of young Gawn, we're blowing this hard, again.
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Absolutely 100% bang on. And it makes me so angry 1) that we're doing this 2) that no one bothers to mention it 3) that ******* failure fraud of a coach hasn't been given his marching orders
 
We gave Sam a 2 year extension on his standard 2 year first AFL contract, after he played 2 games for the Magpies. May have negotiated it well before that, but that's when the announcement was made.

8 weeks later he does his ACL and is out for 12 months. Comes back and plays well and plays in 2019 SANFL GF and did a decent job, not as good as Ladhams on the GF, but not far behind him.

2020 Covid *s up his development, plays a few scratch matches as AFL bans Port and the crows playing in the SANFL.

January 2021 announced he has re-signed for an extra 2 years so is signed up until October 2023. Doesn't get an AFL game in 2021, but plays well for the Maggies and wins the ARC McLean medal as best player for the year, with 126 votes, Joel Garner got 102 and Lienert 93.

We trade out Ladhams and replace him in the draft with an 18 year old Dante.

Sam must have done a lot right to get these extensions and win the B&F, according to the important people in the footy department.

The club finally gives him a go, reluctantly after Lycett's injury, and he does well in the ruck IMO, gives us a different dimension, looks a better tap ruckman than Lycett. I agree he didn't give us a lot around the ground but he wasn't dominated by his opponents who ran off him and smashed us.

It just doesn't make sense that we would basically tell him he is our long term ruck and then panic after he has played 7 games and say he isn't doing well enough.

I watched the video that Ford put in Teakle's thread, about Ken announcing to the group he would play this week, and how much energy he has and has brought to Alberton and to keep up his energy levels and I thought, I bet Sam's energy levels at that moment were on zero.
 

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Saltiga said:
Hopefully hayes will soon learn the 2nd and 3rd efforts required.
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I mean 2nd and 3rd efforts are nice, but I would rather have a ruck that could win the tap in the first place than have to get involved in 50/50 contests afterwards.

Lobbe and lycett were excellent 2nd effort guys. Bog average rucks tho
port_adelaide_1870 said:
I’ve never been a fan of Hayes. Think he is a good to okay SANFL player but doesn’t have the speed, engine or follow up to ever make it in the AFL

But hey hopefully he proves me wrong.
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Good sanfl player?

He’s elite in the afl for hitouts and hitouts to advantage while still a foetus in ruck terms.

I mean his numbers are historically good for sanfl lol. Who was the last 22 yr old ruck who delivered those numbers in the sanfl? Has there been one in recent history?
 
philthy05 said:
I mean 2nd and 3rd efforts are nice, but I would rather have a ruck that could win the tap in the first place than have to get involved in 50/50 contests afterwards.

Lobbe and lycett were excellent 2nd effort guys. Bog average rucks tho

Good sanfl player?

He’s elite in the afl for hitouts and hitouts to advantage while still a foetus in ruck terms.

I mean his numbers are historically good for sanfl lol. Who was the last 22 yr old ruck who delivered those numbers in the sanfl? Has there been one in recent history?
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Moving forward, the extra efforts around the ground should be the easy bit of his development.
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
We gave Sam a 2 year extension on his standard 2 year first AFL contract, after he played 2 games for the Magpies. May have negotiated it well before that, but that's when the announcement was made.

8 weeks later he does his ACL and is out for 12 months. Comes back and plays well and plays in 2019 SANFL GF and did a decent job, not as good as Ladhams on the GF, but not far behind him.

2020 Covid *s up his development, plays a few scratch matches as AFL bans Port and the crows playing in the SANFL.

January 2021 announced he has re-signed for an extra 2 years so is signed up until October 2023. Doesn't get an AFL game in 2021, but plays well for the Maggies and wins the ARC McLean medal as best player for the year, with 126 votes, Joel Garner got 102 and Lienert 93.

We trade out Ladhams and replace him in the draft with an 18 year old Dante.

Sam must have done a lot right to get these extensions and win the B&F, according to the important people in the footy department.

The club finally gives him a go, reluctantly after Lycett's injury, and he does well in the ruck IMO, gives us a different dimension, looks a better tap ruckman than Lycett. I agree he didn't give us a lot around the ground but he wasn't dominated by his opponents who ran off him and smashed us.

It just doesn't make sense that we would basically tell him he is our long term ruck and then panic after he has played 7 games and say he isn't doing well enough.

I watched the video that Ford put in Teakle's thread, about Ken announcing to the group he would play this week, and how much energy he has and has brought to Alberton and to keep up his energy levels and I thought, I bet Sam's energy levels at that moment were on zero.
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All I could think of too was Sam during that video. Duursma also. And the smug prick carrying on like a pork chop while lauding himself coz he been around footy a long time. Too long.
 
What I don't get is how we play Hayes as first ruck in the SANFL every time he's not in the AFL team, and then promote the part time ruck/forward to the AFL team to play first ruck there? We did it with Ladhams and we're doing it with Teakle. If they're that much better in the ruck than Hayes then why aren't they playing there in the SANFL?? If they aren't better, then how are they going to get better pinch hitting for 5 minutes a quarter against Mitch Harvey before going up and playing against Max Gawn?? What sort of ******* tinpot organisation are we?
 
My brother inlaw has sent me a few texts over the last 30 minutes.

What is the position with Goldstein at North? Is he retiring? He's out of contract at the end of the year. I don't know I reply

Then he comes back with - if they need to find a replacement, and JHF wants to come home - how about Hayes + our rd 1 pick + compo pick for Amon or maybe our future Rd 1 pick for JHF?

I respond with - they will probably want more than that. He comes back with well they took polec and pittard, they aren't too sharp.

I responded with - they sacked 3 recruiting guys. He came back with they weren't given the arse, they walked and then said which recruiting guys with talent will go to North, they are 1 year from heading to Tassie!

I hope we aren't deliberately setting Sam up to get pissed off, so that he will say, yeah trade me away.
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
My brother inlaw has sent me a few texts over the last 30 minutes.

What is the position with Goldstein at North? Is he retiring? He's out of contract at the end of the year. I don't know I reply

Then he comes back with - if they need to find a replacement, and JHF wants to come home - how about Hayes + our rd 1 pick + compo pick for Amon or maybe our future Rd 1 pick for JHF?

I respond with - they will probably want more than that. He comes back with well they took polec and pittard, they aren't too sharp.

I responded with - they sacked 3 recruiting guys. He came back with they weren't given the arse, they walked and then said which recruiting guys with talent will go to North, they are 1 year from heading to Tassie!

I hope we aren't deliberately setting Sam up to get pissed off, so that he will say, yeah trade me away.
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,,, and what really pisses me off is that this is actually plausible. The genius of Hinkley.
 
Jack Cahill is often credited for making his players think they were invincible and capable of walking on water. Meanwhile, Kern, Montgomery and Bassett tell their players that they have significant challenges in their games. If you continuously tell players they have weakness, that’s how they will see themselves. We have the shittiest coaches in the world.
 
Gotta play Hayes against Witts.

We got away with playing tall lean athletic Finlayson and Teakle against tall lean athletic Party Pete.

Witts is a 208cm, 112kg giant. He has about 10cm and 20kgs over Jezza. Have to play our 205cm giant Sam against him.

If they dont, you know there is some BS happening at Alberton.
 
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