Expansion Canberra

[Walshawk]

Painful to hear about how far Rugby has fallen in Australia.

We need to leave the Super Rugby and create a domestic competition ASAP.

Do you reckon that would help?

 

[MelbourneGWS]

Still doubts about the entry of the Canberra soccer team into the men’s elite national competition. Seems that whilst the Australian Professional League which runs the ALeague men and women competitions is keen, Football Australia which have to formally approve the expansion, seem more cautious. The clock is ticking if Canberra is to have a team in the 2024-25 season.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/football/football-australia-yet-to-approve-canberras-bid-for-entry-to-aleague-mens-competition/news-story/c0e01fb8353997c2615696ae1b86e37a

 

[Rob]

Who's coming up with an 8 figure licence fee, plus all the other expenses that come with the establishment of a new club, when multiple clubs in larger markets can't find buyers for presumably a lot less dollars?

 

[speedpeck23]

You cant be a Canberra team and and Sydney team at the same time.
You are either one or the other.
GWS should play all their home games in Sydney to build up their fan base there.

Geelong has a huge supporter base in Melbourne. Probably more Cats all over Melbourne than in Geelong. A few in Sydney and Brisbane as well. Young Cat's fan's grow up and many leave the Cattery..... Same will happen for Giants in Canberra.....many will head to Sydney.......it's all process...not a fixed reality. Even the Swans have a significant supporter base in Melbourne. Residential location of footy fans in the long term is not so closely related to location/name of their footy club.
It's a moving picture.....just like a footy match itself....the named position is only a starting point....players move all over the ground....they even go to other clubs!!

 

[Bjo187]

Geelong has a huge supporter base in Melbourne. Probably more Cats all over Melbourne than in Geelong. A few in Sydney and Brisbane as well. Young Cat's fan's grow up and many leave the Cattery..... Same will happen for Giants in Canberra.....many will head to Sydney.......it's all process...not a fixed reality. Even the Swans have a significant supporter base in Melbourne. Residential location of footy fans in the long term is not so closely related to location/name of their footy club.
It's a moving picture.....just like a footy match itself....the named position is only a starting point....players move all over the ground....they even go to other clubs!!

These days yes it is because every game is on tv. So people naturally choose the team they like the most, more so than just their local team in the past.

 

[Aussie in exile]

Geelong has a huge supporter base in Melbourne. Probably more Cats all over Melbourne than in Geelong. A few in Sydney and Brisbane as well. Young Cat's fan's grow up and many leave the Cattery..... Same will happen for Giants in Canberra.....many will head to Sydney.......it's all process...not a fixed reality. Even the Swans have a significant supporter base in Melbourne. Residential location of footy fans in the long term is not so closely related to location/name of their footy club.
It's a moving picture.....just like a footy match itself....the named position is only a starting point....players move all over the ground....they even go to other clubs!!

In my opinion GWS won't grow their fan base much in Sydney by playing games in Canberra

 

[speedpeck23]

In my opinion GWS won't grow their fan base much in Sydney by playing games in Canberra

Only time will tell

 

[Walshawk]

In my opinion GWS won't grow their fan base much in Sydney by playing games in Canberra

This is pretty obvious.

AFL needs to do a deal with the NSW govt to play Gather Round there in 2027 and in return, Henson Park gets a new 4K grandstand and capacity increase to 10k - 12k for two GWS games during the Easter show outage. Marrickville is in the middle of Sydney’s ‘Inner West’, which, along with the eastern suburbs and northern suburbs, is one of the three major AFL strongholds in Sydney. The Inner West should be in GWS’s Academy/promotional zone, along with other western suburbs like Bankstown that are in Swans zone.

If GWS gave up playing games in Canberra, and actually played games and promoted themselves in the suburbs of western Sydney where there are actually AFL fans, they might help too.

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

This is pretty obvious.

AFL needs to do a deal with the NSW govt to play Gather Round there in 2027 and in return, Henson Park gets a new 4K grandstand and capacity increase to 10k - 12k for two GWS games during the Easter show outage. Marrickville is in the middle of Sydney’s ‘Inner West’, which, along with the eastern suburbs and northern suburbs, is one of the three major AFL strongholds in Sydney. The Inner West should be in GWS’s Academy/promotional zone, along with other western suburbs like Bankstown that are in Swans zone.

If GWS gave up playing games in Canberra, and actually played games and promoted themselves in the suburbs of western Sydney where there are actually AFL fans, they might help too.

Great idea re Henson Park and attaching that upgrade to Gather Round. Yeah as it stands, GWS has little to no presence in any of those three AFL strongholds that you mentioned.

 

[Aussie in exile]

This is pretty obvious.

AFL needs to do a deal with the NSW govt to play Gather Round there in 2027 and in return, Henson Park gets a new 4K grandstand and capacity increase to 10k - 12k for two GWS games during the Easter show outage. Marrickville is in the middle of Sydney’s ‘Inner West’, which, along with the eastern suburbs and northern suburbs, is one of the three major AFL strongholds in Sydney. The Inner West should be in GWS’s Academy/promotional zone, along with other western suburbs like Bankstown that are in Swans zone.

If GWS gave up playing games in Canberra, and actually played games and promoted themselves in the suburbs of western Sydney where there are actually AFL fans, they might help too.

I the didn't think the NSW Govt were giving any more money for stadium refurbs for the foreseeable future or has that changed?

 

[speedpeck23]

This is pretty obvious.

AFL needs to do a deal with the NSW govt to play Gather Round there in 2027 and in return, Henson Park gets a new 4K grandstand and capacity increase to 10k - 12k for two GWS games during the Easter show outage. Marrickville is in the middle of Sydney’s ‘Inner West’, which, along with the eastern suburbs and northern suburbs, is one of the three major AFL strongholds in Sydney. The Inner West should be in GWS’s Academy/promotional zone, along with other western suburbs like Bankstown that are in Swans zone.

If GWS gave up playing games in Canberra, and actually played games and promoted themselves in the suburbs of western Sydney where there are actually AFL fans, they might help too.

Inner west is great. So you are advocating the Giants to play inner west and outer west?

 

[Bjo187]

Inner west is great. So you are advocating the Giants to play inner west and outer west?

Giants fans don't count inner west as reflective of where the team represents, however, I do agree, the giants should try to steal some fans in a stronger footy area to help build that initial base. Once you have the initial base, more people in outer west are likely to see it as more appealing to jump on board.

Perception as to what's popular is really important, crowds bring crowds basically.

 

[PaythePerryman]

Giants fans don't count inner west as reflective of where the team represents, however, I do agree, the giants should try to steal some fans in a stronger footy area to help build that initial base. Once you have the initial base, more people in outer west are likely to see it as more appealing to jump on board.

Perception as to what's popular is really important, crowds bring crowds basically.

I think a lot of GWS members are Inner Westies. The Women's team have played a fair few games at Henson and it's usually really popular. Plenty of Giants merch around Inner West but it is technically zoned Swans.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

Interesting local article on Canberra’s national sports teams today, including plans to have more elite level national teams. Currently off-field, the Raiders and Capitals our female basketball team, seem to be doing fine - but not the Brumbies.

The article also discusses ACT Cricket’s plans to have a men and women BBL team as well as having an ACT cricket team in the first class competition, with decision on Canberra’s men’s soccer team expansion also close - noting that this soccer expansion has the support of the Aleague.

Noteworthy is that whilst the article speculates about the (re)entry of a Canberra men’s basketball team, there is no discussion at all by the writer of a standalone AFL Canberra team. There seems to be no overwhelming enthusiasm or public intentions by either the ACT Government or AFL Canberra to lobby the AFL Commission for Canberra to be Team 20.

There is a finite amount of money to fund Canberra sport. To survive, several sports will have to tap financial backers from elsewhere outside the city’s business community.

Dream teams: How money is dictating the fortunes and future of Canberra’s national sports teams | Region Canberra

It's hard to get a reliable read on whether Canberra will have a team in the A-League Men's competition for…

the-riotact.com

 

[Canberra Pear]

Noteworthy is that whilst the article speculates about the (re)entry of a Canberra men’s basketball team, there is no discussion at all by the writer of a standalone AFL Canberra team. There seems to be no overwhelming enthusiasm or public intentions by either the ACT Government or AFL Canberra to lobby the AFL Commission for Canberra to be Team 20.

Not really any point in the context of the article. Any AFL team would be at least nine years away, whereas the other teams mentioned are all, potentially, within the next few years.

 

[Walshawk]

Inner west is great. So you are advocating the Giants to play inner west and outer west?

Yes. And reverting to Western Sydney Giants. Or better still - West Sydney Giants.

 

[Bjo187]

I think a lot of GWS members are Inner Westies. The Women's team have played a fair few games at Henson and it's usually really popular. Plenty of Giants merch around Inner West but it is technically zoned Swans.

That's interesting. If there wasn't Canberra games I actually wouldn't mind one Blacktown game either. So maybe:
8 Showgrounds
2 Henson park
1 Blacktown

Promote the shit outta it at the maccas across the road, flyers in letter boxes throughout the whole suburb etc. Free entry for kids. It might help introduce a few newbies to the game and keeps the identity of the giants as being true western sydney as well.

 

[PaythePerryman]

That's interesting. If there wasn't Canberra games I actually wouldn't mind one Blacktown game either. So maybe:
8 Showgrounds
2 Henson park
1 Blacktown

Promote the s**t outta it at the maccas across the road, flyers in letter boxes throughout the whole suburb etc. Free entry for kids. It might help introduce a few newbies to the game and keeps the identity of the giants as being true western sydney as well.

Depends if we are playing San Fran

 

[Bjo187]

Depends if we are playing San Fran

Yeah that proposal doesn't make sense to me. Unless they drop out of gather round with one other team and do it that week instead, then have a bye the week after, then they don't lose a home game.

Just thinking about it, what would be the purpose? To draw in overseas investors? Or to attract athletes (ie. College athletes that didn't make it). L.A makes more sense to me in that respect, more aussies there too.

 

[Coolangatta]

Yeah that proposal doesn't make sense to me. Unless they drop out of gather round with one other team and do it that week instead, then have a bye the week after, then they don't lose a home game.

Just thinking about it, what would be the purpose? To draw in overseas investors? Or to attract athletes (ie. College athletes that didn't make it). L.A makes more sense to me in that respect, more aussies there too.

That's a great idea, not that doing it in the first place is, but the only practical way to do it. And I think it probably would be played in LA.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

Interesting article in today’s ABC about Canberra’s chances of getting a men’s and women’s BBL/WBBL team. The last paras are about whether Canberra is big enough for these teams. Any full time BBL/WBBL team in Canberra that results in an upgrade of Manuka, would be good for AFL?

Is Canberra's cricket market big enough?​

The ACT's population is around 460,000 and is expected to edge towards 800,000 by 2060, according to the ACT government.

But is that big enough to satisfy Cricket Australia officials? And what about funding?

"The opportunity [to join Cricket Australia] would allow us to actually generate more funds," Vergano said.

He described the ACT as an untapped market for Cricket Australia with potential financial opportunities.

Another option could see a current BBL team relocated to Canberra, such as the Sydney Thunder which is based out of western Sydney and already plays some home games at Manuka Oval.

However, that might be a tough sell considering Canberra's population is dwarfed by Sydney's west.

Will Canberra be granted a spot in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues?

Cricket ACT is pushing hard to have a Canberra team in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues (BBL) — but what are its chances?

www.abc.net.au

 

[3rd Grade Maggy]

Interesting article in today’s ABC about Canberra’s chances of getting a men’s and women’s BBL/WBBL team. The last paras are about whether Canberra is big enough for these teams. Any full time BBL/WBBL team in Canberra that results in an upgrade of Manuka, would be good for AFL?

Is Canberra's cricket market big enough?​

The ACT's population is around 460,000 and is expected to edge towards 800,000 by 2060, according to the ACT government.

But is that big enough to satisfy Cricket Australia officials? And what about funding?

"The opportunity [to join Cricket Australia] would allow us to actually generate more funds," Vergano said.

He described the ACT as an untapped market for Cricket Australia with potential financial opportunities.

Another option could see a current BBL team relocated to Canberra, such as the Sydney Thunder which is based out of western Sydney and already plays some home games at Manuka Oval.

However, that might be a tough sell considering Canberra's population is dwarfed by Sydney's west.

Will Canberra be granted a spot in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues?

Cricket ACT is pushing hard to have a Canberra team in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues (BBL) — but what are its chances?

www.abc.net.au

I mean, different market and all, but Paarl has one of six teams in the SA20 and that joint holds about 10,000. Paarl probably the same population as Hobart. Just depends how it's setup.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Interesting article in today’s ABC about Canberra’s chances of getting a men’s and women’s BBL/WBBL team. The last paras are about whether Canberra is big enough for these teams. Any full time BBL/WBBL team in Canberra that results in an upgrade of Manuka, would be good for AFL?

Is Canberra's cricket market big enough?​

The ACT's population is around 460,000 and is expected to edge towards 800,000 by 2060, according to the ACT government.

But is that big enough to satisfy Cricket Australia officials? And what about funding?

"The opportunity [to join Cricket Australia] would allow us to actually generate more funds," Vergano said.

He described the ACT as an untapped market for Cricket Australia with potential financial opportunities.

Another option could see a current BBL team relocated to Canberra, such as the Sydney Thunder which is based out of western Sydney and already plays some home games at Manuka Oval.

However, that might be a tough sell considering Canberra's population is dwarfed by Sydney's west.

Will Canberra be granted a spot in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues?

Cricket ACT is pushing hard to have a Canberra team in the men's and women's Big Bash Leagues (BBL) — but what are its chances?

www.abc.net.au

The article from last year said "Barr is eager to redevelop Manuka Oval, but said that is dependent on securing a BBL licence". So a BBL side could only be a good thing for Manuka and subsequently AFL.

Also, I know I harp on about it, but it annoys me when they discuss the ACT's population as if we're an island. Especially when they're calling it too small.

I don't expect them to go into the Capital Region demographics, but the city very much flows over the border. Canberra-Queabeyan is more like 510k. You can get from Queanbeyan to Manuka in 12 mins.

 

[Walshawk]

There were a bunch of commentators over the weekend saying that the BBL won’t be expanding. Why - because they have just cut the number of games so adding more teams will only dilute the product. It is not like the SFL where more games = more broadcast revenue. The broadcasters last year asked for less BBL.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

There were a bunch of commentators over the weekend saying that the BBL won’t be expanding. Why - because they have just cut the number of games so adding more teams will only dilute the product. It is not like the SFL where more games = more broadcast revenue. The broadcasters last year asked for less BBL.

It wouldn’t be a bad option if it expanded to 10 teams long-term though and allow Canberra and someone else (Gold Coast?) to join so every team plays each other once (5 home / 5 away) for a much fairer competition every year, although the player pool depth would be a massive concern IMO.