Review Round 15 vs Western Sydney @ ENGIE Stadium. Sun 22 June. 1:10pm

[robo_1]

Personally, I think people are too harsh on our forward line, offense. Sure, definitely scope for improvement but our average score is 93 despite 2 wet games when we scored only 64 and 37. E.g., Giants average is 86, Lions 87.

A lot of criticism after Giants games despite scoring 99 while missing 2 100% shots and probably another 5-7 gettable ones.

King is a primary example. He did score 2 goals - one from fantastic contested mark. He also handballed to Miller for goal on goal line. So that would be another goal and then he missed gettable one at the end.

Virtually every forward player should score at least one extra goal. E.g, Long missed 2 gettable shots. A couple of kicks on full.

We were 14.15 with couple of shots on full. With just average conversion we probably scored 120+ and won comfortably.

It's Dimma's system. He loves moving ball forward quickly, at least bring ball down and create chaos. Keep ball forward more than opposition and the team usually wins.

Despite long balls into packs, we also had 11 marks inside 50 vs Giants 6 while Giants had there Coleman winner Hogan, Cadman, Brown, Greene, Stringer.

Crap goals is another story. 1-2 is OK, 5-7 not so.

The coach just pretty much said the same on afl360

My feeling is these guys rely to heavily on free kicks for their goals.
ESPN podcast had a crazy stat on king for disposals and goals I can’t quite remember what it was

 

[lommy]

Yep... i do. Especially if we get some actual forward pockets. The two kids are going alright in my opinion, but they're probably costing us games right now as we push for finals in 2025, it's not an easy solution to get games into them for 2027 while trying to make finals in 2025

That’ll be year 4 for them, so maybe you’re right, I’d still prefer to keep King though.

 

[nutstar]

Very Lucky , What an escape Win !!!!! Peel

Welcome back… now kindly leave again

 

[RowellAnderson12]

The coach just pretty much said the same on afl360

My feeling is these guys rely to heavily on free kicks for their goals.
ESPN podcast had a crazy stat on king for disposals and goals I can’t quite remember what it was

Ben king

62 kicks in total

35 goals 14 behinds and whatever else he missed on the full or not carried

So 49/62 kicks on goal.

Basically doesn’t leave the 50 only gets them and has a shot

 

[KaySwizzle]

Yep... i do. Especially if we get some actual forward pockets. The two kids are going alright in my opinion, but they're probably costing us games right now as we push for finals in 2025, it's not an easy solution to get games into them for 2027 while trying to make finals in 2025

Maybe. I’ve seen no evidence that either of them will be the answer with certainty that makes me think they will be better than King in any way. They might be. But I’m not betting our future on some magic beans. I’ve seen how that works.

Read, for all the claims of being an endurance beast, hardly gets to the ball, is slow, and is subbed off most games and chops out but hardly impacts the ruck. Walter has one of the worst kicks and run ups I’ve ever seen. We are carrying both to various degrees. If we played one and then another, more experienced forward to support King, it would work a lot better. But we can’t.

I’m not trying to be overly critical. They are young and developing and that’s ok. But playing two is crazy. What other team aiming for finals/premierships, unless out of necessity due to injury, plays two 20 yo key forwards?

Now I’m not saying this strategy can’t work (it never has for us though). But we are making the present harder, in a market that demands success, in a team that could easily be picked apart in a year or two if we don’t have some success.

So far, the only academy player worth their weight is Graham. The jury is out on the rest and I’ll keep my hopes contained until I see objective proof.

 

[Jirik13]

Maybe. I’ve seen no evidence that either of them will be the answer with certainty that makes me think they will be better than King in any way. They might be. But I’m not betting our future on some magic beans. I’ve seen how that works.

Read, for all the claims of being an endurance beast, hardly gets to the ball, is slow, and is subbed off most games and chops out but hardly impacts the ruck. Walter has one of the worst kicks and run ups I’ve ever seen. We are carrying both to various degrees. If we played one and then another, more experienced forward to support King, it would work a lot better. But we can’t.

I’m not trying to be overly critical. They are young and developing and that’s ok. But playing two is crazy. What other team aiming for finals/premierships, unless out of necessity due to injury, plays two 20 yo key forwards?

Now I’m not saying this strategy can’t work (it never has for us though). But we are making the present harder, in a market that demands success, in a team that could easily be picked apart in a year or two if we don’t have some success.

So far, the only academy player worth their weight is Graham. The jury is out on the rest and I’ll keep my hopes contained until I see objective proof.

As Dimma said tonight, 3rd best offence with two 19 year old kids. We are doing something all right despite carrying both of them.

Just teasing.

Interesting fact, according to Dimma, only for 2-3 plays King, Walter, Read are at the same time on the ground.

 

[KaySwizzle]

As Dimma said tonight, 3rd best offence with two 19 year old kids. We are doing something all right despite carrying both of them.

Just teasing.

Our forward line looks good when midfield dominates. When they don’t, there is very little “individual brilliance” that could carry the team. No X factor to swing momentum back our way.

Long works damn hard and runs to pockets of space well. Humphrey is a strong marker and is close to being that player to turn games. King gets his 2+ goals but has rarely had those games where he wins it himself. The rest are lucky to kick a goal each game.

We are the 3rd best offence. Now imagine if we weren’t carrying two kids every week and had players who could be a genuine threat at all times

Interesting fact, according to Dimma, only for 2-3 plays King, Walter, Read are at the same time on the ground.

Yeah, because Read and Walter are often somewhere in the mid to high 50 percentage for time on ground, which is low.

Witts is nearly 90%. Our defenders are mid to high 90s. Every other forward is in the 70s.

Plus Read gets subbed off every week, which means we go in with this plan (meaning our ability to sub and who to sub off is very inflexible and strategically hampers us, especially if we get an injury).

So yeah, that’s not something we should be aiming for in my eyes.

 

[davidgoes4wce]

I watched the Suns v Giants game as a neutral and your team had the rough end of the deal with the umps in the 2nd half. Whoever says the umps don't influence matches, are kidding themselves.

Gold Coast were the better team on Sunday. Inaccurate footy though was another factor that cost them the game.

 

[robo_1]

I watched the Suns v Giants game as a neutral and your team had the rough end of the deal with the umps in the 2nd half. Whoever says the umps don't influence matches, are kidding themselves.

Gold Coast were the better team on Sunday. Inaccurate footy though was another factor that cost them the game.

They had to even up the count after half time it was like 20 something to 8 our way

 

[Iva Bigun]

I watched the Suns v Giants game as a neutral and your team had the rough end of the deal with the umps in the 2nd half. Whoever says the umps don't influence matches, are kidding themselves.

Gold Coast were the better team on Sunday. Inaccurate footy though was another factor that cost them the game.

The team has no one to blame for the loss than themselves, they folded as the Giants upped the pressure

 

[The Kings Ransom]

 

[SandyToes]

That's how I saw the game which made it all the more frustrating

 

[Jirik13]

I bet Noah had Mac on his mind. Those 4-5 errors by Mac in the last quarter were bad and costly (See First Crack).

Pressure is beginning to mount on the Suns after they suffered their third-straight defeat of the season, with Anderson believing his team needs to play their moments better.

“Take the result out of it, we still feel like we did a lot right (against GWS), 80 per cent was good and then that last quarter let us down with moments,” he said.

“We had a look at them and reviewed them and talked about how we can change that in the future but still trying to stay positive because we’re doing a lot right.”

The issue with ‘playing their moments’ has been a re-occurring theme within the Suns camp under Damien Hardwick.

At the beginning of the campaign, Hardwick highlighted playing moments better as a key area for improvement in 2025 and the issue has come to the forefront in recent weeks in their defeats to the Giants and Fremantle.

“I think that’s probably the final part of our team and our group on our improvement level, looking at the group this year, it’s not like we’re getting beaten by a lot or anything, we’re always in these games,” Anderson said.

“It’s just those experiences will continue to hold us in good stead, I’ve got a lot of faith that these younger guys who are still learning will get that done this year.”

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[cootagc]

I was at the game. When Mac missed the ball when he attempted to kick off the ground I could hear Noah yelling MAC!!!

 

[davidgoes4wce]

Hardwick should have that $2k fine revoked. Disgusting decision from the umps, considering GWS got those same calls for insufficient intent in that 2nd half.

Here was Hardwick on AFL360 with his response:




At least Hardwick can see the funny side, but inside he would be fuming.

 

[Stroppy]

On the ump calls, I think most infuriating would be the combo of the non-call against Brown on the mark when Uwland had the ball on our 50 in the 2nd qtr when the ump said Stand 3 times and he kept moving and it was not paid, versus the Powell one when a different ump said Stand once and then pinged him 50. Even more annoying was the fact that Brown was the one with the ball and kicked the goal.

Got the rough end of the stick both coming and going.

 

[The Kings Ransom]

Champion Data on SEN reported that if you are more accurate in goal shots you win 75% of games this year, last year was 55%.

Expected score is a highly relevant metric.
It's encouraging that we were ahead on expected score.
It's disappointing that we still lost!

 

[Jirik13]

Champion Data on SEN reported that if you are more accurate in goal shots you win 75% of games this year, last year was 55%.

Expected score is a highly relevant metric.
It's encouraging that we were ahead on expected score.
It's disappointing that we still lost!

Unfortunately, I am pretty sure our actual score is more behind than ahead on expected score.

It was bloody good game from us except conversion and giving up too many crap goals. The worst part is than even in the last quarter stats were in our favour (according to Dimma on AFL360). I can't remember a team going inside 50 ten times and score 8.1

I am close to blame loss on Andrews's 4-5 errors in the last quarter. That First Crack vision is damming. Lack of effort, most of them ended up in goals.

 

[The Kings Ransom]

Unfortunately, I am pretty sure our actual score is more behind than ahead on expected score.

It was bloody good game from us except conversion and giving up too many crap goals. The worst part is than even in the last quarter stats were in our favour (according to Dimma on AFL360). I can't remember a team going inside 50 ten times and score 8.1

I am close to blame loss on Andrews's 4-5 errors in the last quarter. That First Crask vision is damming. Lack of effort, most of them ended up in goals.

Yeah we've been very fortunate in having a young Uwland come in and be a solid defender who performs consistently week in and out, pretty much from when he came back into the side last year. This week he had a down game.

Mac has been out of sorts. But I hope that his requirement to play more defensively will in fact turn him into a better player in the long run once Ballard is back.

 

[Jirik13]

Yeah we've been very fortunate in having a young Uwland come in and be a solid defender who performs consistently week in and out, pretty much from when he came back into the side last year. This week he had a down game.

Mac has been out of sorts. But I hope that his requirement to play more defensively will in fact turn him into a better player in the long run once Ballard is back.

Most frustrating for me is that we wasted great effort from midfield. Flanders and Ainsworth also found their mojo. Hoping they can do the same job against Demons.

 

[The Kings Ransom]

The good

• Anderson, Miller, Rowell as the first choice centre bounce midfield all played well. Got their hands on the ball and converted stoppage wins into scores for themselves and others. The centre bounce rotation seems pretty set. Rowell (88%) + Anderson (88%) + Miller (62%) /Humphrey (38%). Fiorini (24%) comes in for Rowell or Anderson if they are off the ground. I am happy with this mix.
• Whilst clearances were somewhat even, Witts domination in the ruck seemed to give us a number of clear breaks from clearance. His contested mark and goal in the square helped us get a bit of momentum back in the 3rd.
• Bailey Humphrey clearly in our best 8 players - contested marks, kicking goals, bustling around the ground. Had about 3-4 quiet games this year but otherwise a difficult match up for opposition and really helps us win. You can see that next year those quiet games will become less and less.
• Flanders looked more dynamic - hopefully he can build into the back half of season again.
• We were able to kick goals and get the game back on our terms in the 3rd quarter

The indifferent

• Jeffrey / Rioli / Noble had about 60 touches between them but didn't seem to provide much drive. Just over 1000m gained between the 3 and only 7 score involvements combined.
• It seems like we need a bit more from our mid range players. We win when we get a couple of players like Jeffrey, Clohesy, Powell, Ainsworth, Weller etc.. having a really good day. Ainsworth was good early but faded out of the game a bit. The others were just ok - nothing more.
• Our young tall forward. I thought Read did alright. Got to position to mark the ball around the forward 50 on a few occasions. Walter seemed largely absent outside of the 1st quarter. There was a few occasions where Walter brought his man into the leading lane for King - just need to work better together.
• The umpiring. We got a lucky goal for Rioli's goal - should have been holding the ball against Walter, We would have gone up 61 - 26 with 8 minutes left in the first half if Uwland was given that clear 50m penalty.

The bad

• Easy missed shots - we should have just about put the game to bed in the first half.
• Mac Andrew not able to use his attributes to influence the game positively in any way and you can pretty much guarantee he'll make 1-2 bad mistakes each week.
• Buderick as small forward didn't work. He tackled pretty hard for a small fella, but clearly just didn't know how to position himself and was a non-scoring threat. Surely playing an actual forward would have been better.
• Holman had 1 handball and 1 pressure act in his 20 minutes on the ground and was an ineffective sub. Other than maybe one game from Rogers our subs have done virtually nothing the whole year.
• Obviously the last quarter. It's hard to explain what went wrong. They kicked miracle goals on 2 occasions which doesn't help. It didn't seem like we tried to change how the game was going when they got a run on.

Overall, I think we largely played well and should have won.
The frustrating thing is that the stuff that goes wrong is somewhat predictable and we don't seem to do anything to address this week in and week out.

 

[geoffneverflies]

Please don't panic. The Suns may be following the script of the second half of their seasons like it's set in stone but please don't panic.

It may have been one of our greatest ever chokes and we maybe should have been up by 10 goals after half an hour but please don't panic.......

https://eyesonthesuns.wordpress.com...-suns-review-the-cup-stays-in-sydney-for-now/

 

[Billy ray]