Chf Chb

[sosos]

I just wanted to push the Waite to the wing barrow some more. Don't mind the HFF idea either.

But then who is the CHB/CHF?

For CHF, I'm praying Hartlett can step up, though training reports aren't hopeful. Is Jake Edwards a chance?

Don't know who our CHB will be though. O'Hailpin to stand the monsters. Jamison on fast full forwards. Is Austin any chance?

Waite to take Riewoldt though .

 

[gandaal]

Rotate them as needed.

 

[Team Mo']

I just wanted to push the Waite to the wing barrow some more. Don't mind the HFF idea either.

But then who is the CHB/CHF?

For CHF, I'm praying Hartlett can step up, though training reports aren't hopeful. Is Jake Edwards a chance?

Don't know who our CHB will be though. O'Hailpin to stand the monsters. Jamison on fast full forwards. Is Austin any chance?

Waite to take Riewoldt though .

jake edwards absolutely smashed setanta today at training

 

[gandaal]

jake edwards absolutely smashed setanta today at training

And I heard Callum Chambers dominated in the midfield group.

 

[Team Mo']

And I heard Callum Chambers dominated in the midfield group.

i think it was jake...might have been someone else but they were yelling "Jacko" and "carlos" to him...

even though i love setanta he was caught out alot..he was always too far infront of the full forward and the ball got kicked over or he was too far behind to catch up to the lead...

 

[gandaal]

i think it was jake...might have been someone else but they were yelling "Jacko" and "carlos" to him...

even though i love setanta he was caught out alot..he was always too far infront of the full forward and the ball got kicked over or he was too far behind to catch up to the lead...

I think you missed my point. Form on the training track is an illusion that has little real effect on form during the foty season and shouldn't be taken seriously. You expect to see players working hard during the off season but other than that there very little you can read into any training track form at this very early stage.

Jay Neagle from Essendon is an example of this. He ripped it up for the Don during the preseason at the start of this year, and capped it off by kicking four goals in the intra-club match. I don't think he ended up playing a senior game.

 

[DonFletch]

jamison fb
setanta chb
hartlett chf
fev ff

id put waite on a hff or wing to free him up and be creative.

 

[Team Mo']

I think you missed my point. Form on the training track is an illusion that has little real effect on form during the foty season and shouldn't be taken seriously. You expect to see players working hard during the off season but other than that there very little you can read into any training track form at this very early stage.

Jay Neagle from Essendon is an example of this. He ripped it up for the Don during the preseason at the start of this year, and capped it off by kicking four goals in the intra-club match. I don't think he ended up playing a senior game.

oo ok sorry..yeh i guess your right...

anyway its good to see setanta get angry and show passion in a little training drill when he got beaten....i hope he takes the pride onto the field again next season

 

[THE AISSASSIN]

And I heard Callum Chambers dominated in the midfield group.

Maybe you are selling Jake short, and Chambers got a go in the 1's to see if he could hold his form.

ATM it seems like Jake is in ripping form and all our backs are really struggling to go with him when he leads.

He certainly is going a lot better than Harts ATM and deserves an opportunity before him.

 

[gandaal]

Maybe you are selling Jake short, and Chambers got a go in the 1's to see if he could hold his form.

ATM it seems like Jake is in ripping form and all our backs are really struggling to go with him when he leads.

He certainly is going a lot better than Harts ATM and deserves an opportunity before him.

I'm not selling Jake as anything. Just pointing out that form in a training session means squat.

 

[THE AISSASSIN]

I'm not selling Jake as anything. Just pointing out that form in a training session means squat.

I disagree it means squat, however it can be misleading on occassions

 

[Pie_squasher]

Wouldn't mind seeing the following rotations:

CHB: T-Bird, Setanta, Waite

CHF: Waite, Edwards, Hartlett

Hopefully one of them to step up early on and make a name for themselves in these critical positions

What about this for a crazy idea:
Fevola at CHF!!! Great disposal, every chance from 50-60m. Needs to improve his fitness....any chance???

 

[Bluebear]

I can understand what gandaal is saying. You can't read too much into training form in terms of how they may perfrom in the regular season. David Teague was renouned for being excellent on the training track.

However, I'd argue that training form right now is the only form, and for some guys this will be forming opinions in the minds of coaches, and even more importantly US , as to what their season 2008 might be like.

Setanta will be fine - has had some minor injuries and probably isn't at full pace......yes, he still needs to learn about how to position himself, and hopefully Crossisca and Ratts are working hard with him on this.

What we should be reading in the training reports is that Harts, Jake, Blackers, Russ, Bentick.......and any others who may be on the fringe and fighting for their career......are ripping it up on the track.

Jake is doing exactly what he needs to.

Harts by all accounts has presented in "not the best" shape and is struggling. Is he serious? As soon as JK went out the door Harts should have sworn off the piss, stopped eating Pizza's and started running.
The CHF position is his to take.......and I'd be very disappointed if he sat back waiting for it to arrive.

same goes for Russ, Blackers and any other mid who is now on the fringe and has been around for a while.

For a number on our list it is perform or perish........and that includes training.

 

[Blue Dawn]

Maybe you are selling Jake short, and Chambers got a go in the 1's to see if he could hold his form.

ATM it seems like Jake is in ripping form and all our backs are really struggling to go with him when he leads.

He certainly is going a lot better than Harts ATM and deserves an opportunity before him.

Agreed. Not only would it be lovely to see the Jakester get a crack but the emphasis is now certainly on Hartlett to make every post a winner and show he wants it or he may well see the door at next season's end.

Edwards, Waite, Fisher, Fev, Eddie and Kreuzer with Houla/Gibbs rotating through would be my starting forwardline as of today at least.

I'm also glad you can vouch for McKee's coaching credentials Smurfs because i'd be concerned otherwise - absolue dud of a ruckman.

 

[DonFletch]

Maybe you are selling Jake short, and Chambers got a go in the 1's to see if he could hold his form.

ATM it seems like Jake is in ripping form and all our backs are really struggling to go with him when he leads.

He certainly is going a lot better than Harts ATM and deserves an opportunity before him.

not sure that jake is a chf though, as hartlett is. id love edwards as a fast leading hff, with harts chf, and fisher hff. Waite on the wing.

id love to see that!!!

 

[btdg]

We don't need a CHF. Waite and Fisher are mobile flankers capable of marking and kicking goals and can play as the linkman up the ground effectively. And Fevola leads so far out and is so effective on those long leads that he renders CHF a moot position (see what happened to Whitnall's career once Fev came into the team).

Our structure should be Fisher and Waite playing up 1 wing each, with Fev as the primary leading target inside 50. Fisher and Waite then drop back into the space behind Fev as secondary targets, and Kreuzer plays out of the goalsquare. Then we keep Houlihan on the ground, and preferably Murphy as a forward oriented midfielder linking up to hit targets (a la Pendlebury for Collingwood).

As for CHB, O'Hailpin is the natural fit with his size, athleticism and ability to run with the ball.

 

[Dramoth]

I can understand what gandaal is saying. You can't read too much into training form in terms of how they may perfrom in the regular season. David Teague was renouned for being excellent on the training track.

However, I'd argue that training form right now is the only form, and for some guys this will be forming opinions in the minds of coaches, and even more importantly US , as to what their season 2008 might be like.

Setanta will be fine - has had some minor injuries and probably isn't at full pace......yes, he still needs to learn about how to position himself, and hopefully Crossisca and Ratts are working hard with him on this.

What we should be reading in the training reports is that Harts, Jake, Blackers, Russ, Bentick.......and any others who may be on the fringe and fighting for their career......are ripping it up on the track.

Jake is doing exactly what he needs to.

Harts by all accounts has presented in "not the best" shape and is struggling. Is he serious? As soon as JK went out the door Harts should have sworn off the piss, stopped eating Pizza's and started running.
The CHF position is his to take.......and I'd be very disappointed if he sat back waiting for it to arrive.

same goes for Russ, Blackers and any other mid who is now on the fringe and has been around for a while.

For a number on our list it is perform or perish........and that includes training.

I think that they will help, but it might take someone like SOS or Sticks to help Carlos with his positioning.

It's just the little things like timing and knowing how to manhandle your opponant that makes the difference between a good fb and a great one. And I dont think that you could ever beat SOS for the manhandling bit

 

[barnesy]

For those nominating Jamison in the backline.

My understanding is if we select someone in the PSD, then Jamison remains a rookie until a LTI and hence elevation...

Anyone reconfirm this....

 

[Artie Bucco]

For those nominating Jamison in the backline.

My understanding is if we select someone in the PSD, then Jamison remains a rookie until a LTI and hence elevation...

Anyone reconfirm this....

My understanding is, as we will have no veterans now that Kouta is gone we are eligible for one nominated rookie.

Being that he is still a rookie, but able to play all 22 games + finals, without the need for somebody to be on the LTI list.


FWIW I think Jamison will be our future FB absolutely loved his games this season, not too sure if he'll be ready for the job permanently in 08 as he still is a bit thin.

 

[THE AISSASSIN]

[/b]

not sure that jake is a chf though, as hartlett is. id love edwards as a fast leading hff, with harts chf, and fisher hff. Waite on the wing.

id love to see that!!!

Traditional positions are not necessarily required anymore.

Hawks have 4 forwards ( at least 3 talls ) that stay inside 50 in a box formation. They do not use a traditional CHF.

We need to pick the best options for whatever structure Rats has in mind.
The training drills earlier in the week had our forward line operating without anybody playing the traditional CHF role so it will be interesting to see what eventuates.

 

[windows]

I've been watching training for years and good players GENERALLY look good in training. Duds don't look any good. You just have to watch carefully. Edwards did look good in patches today but he also dropped a lot of marks he should have held. Still more to be done. But from training you can see Hartlett isn't going to make it. He can't get off his man despite trying his guts out. From training you can see Hammo is absolutely dominant in the hitouts. Both boundary and throw in. And it is very likely to project to him taking over in the ruck this season. Guys who fumble in games fumble in training. Guys who can't kick don't suddenly pick the attribute up in training. It is just that without pressure sometimes guys can look ok for a while. But if you watch long enough the flaws will show if they are there.

 

[btdg]

I've been watching training for years and good players GENERALLY look good in training. Duds don't look any good. You just have to watch carefully. Edwards did look good in patches today but he also dropped a lot of marks he should have held. Still more to be done. But from training you can see Hartlett isn't going to make it. He can't get off his man despite trying his guts out. From training you can see Hammo is absolutely dominant in the hitouts. Both boundary and throw in. And it is very likely to project to him taking over in the ruck this season. Guys who fumble in games fumble in training. Guys who can't kick don't suddenly pick the attribute up in training. It is just that without pressure sometimes guys can look ok for a while. But if you watch long enough the flaws will show if they are there.

Interesting comments. I've never really seen Edwards play, but there's never been a moment that I've been watching Hartlett on the field and thought he might actually be ok. He just looks a step slow - not just in terms of leg speed but his ability to read the game and translate that into the movements of his body.

As for Hampson, I think we all saw glimpses of his athleticism and raw ability this year. But ruck is probably the one unique position in that what you see in training doesn't necessarily translate. Its such a grinding position, so many physical contests yet combined with the necessity to cover such large territory. Plus, every week you go up against one of the top 15 ruckmen in the league - whereas a midfielder or forward gets the occasional game off (your second-string midfielder is likely to play matches against players not even in the top 50 midfielders in the comp depending on matchups). Very tough position to judge, but we'll see what happens.

 

[marcmurphy3]

Apparently Ratts was on the radio today and said that Waite would be played mainly back.

Based on that I expect us to go:
FB: Setanta
CHB: Waite
CHF: Cloke/Edwards
F: Fevola

Also I agree with people who say that these days not all sides have a traditional CHF these days. You don't have to have one.

 

[audas]

Apparently Ratts was on the radio today and said that Waite would be played mainly back.

Based on that I expect us to go:
FB: Setanta
CHB: Waite
CHF: Cloke/Edwards
F: Fevola

Also I agree with people who say that these days not all sides have a traditional CHF these days. You don't have to have one.

What are the chances of having Kreuzer / Hampson ruck combination. When one is resting the other goes forward for CHF. Both can play there.

 

[marcmurphy3]

What are the chances of having Kreuzer / Hampson ruck combination. When one is resting the other goes forward for CHF. Both can play there.

I wouldn't be surprized at all if that happened eventually.