The war against renewable energy

[Baltimore Jack]

And the war on renewables continues

But most of them (some still think it's a Chinese hoax) have at least shifted their focus from outright denial to now attacking the solutions, which too will eventually shift to a new right wing talking point

 

[telsor]

But most of them (some still think it's a Chinese hoax) have at least shifted their focus from outright denial to now attacking the solutions, which too will eventually shift to a new right wing talking point

Argue the 'solutions' and you get a discussion.
Argue the realities about the warming religion and you tend to get fingers stuck firmly in ears and a torrent of abuse.

On SM-J530Y using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Kwality]

As an east coast power user it frustrates me when blame is apportioned to the Feds when every State Govt has a FAIL when it comes to generation, particularly gas.

WA got it right in the mid 2000s under the Carpenter Labor Govt when it negotiated a gas reservation for WA* - no such foresight by State Govts on the east coast (so blame it on the Feds) & the policy continues to deliver for WA:
https://thewest.com.au/business/energy/gas-from-chevrons-wheatstone-flows-to-wa-customers-ng-b881125622z

*https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-23/the-case-for-an-east-coast-gas-reservation-policy/9074896

 

[Hawk Dork]

As an east coast power user it frustrates me when blame is apportioned to the Feds when every State Govt has a FAIL when it comes to generation, particularly gas.

WA got it right in the mid 2000s under the Carpenter Labor Govt when it negotiated a gas reservation for WA* - no such foresight by State Govts on the east coast (so blame it on the Feds) & the policy continues to deliver for WA:
https://thewest.com.au/business/energy/gas-from-chevrons-wheatstone-flows-to-wa-customers-ng-b881125622z

*https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-23/the-case-for-an-east-coast-gas-reservation-policy/9074896

A proper Mining Tax would have been delivered Qatar type revenue.
Removing any attempt at one was treason not keeping a domestic supply was also treason.
Playing politics with climate policy is treason

 

[Kwality]

A proper Mining Tax would have been delivered Qatar type revenue.
Removing any attempt at one was treason not keeping a domestic supply was also treason.
Playing politics with climate policy is treason

So you dont see any failure by State Govts on the east coast not following WA & reserving gas for their residents?

 

[Hawk Dork]

So you dont see any failure by State Govts on the east coast not following WA & reserving gas for their residents?

so you didnt see the second part of the my second point?

 

[Kwality]

treason? Thats a comment .... more like a motherhood statement.
Its just a plain ordinary management failure, IF indeed it was even considered. Again both sides of politics in group think !!

 

[volcboy]

Astroturfing at its finest. Glencore invests 4 to 7 million pounds attacking green groups and unions, including targeting individuals within these groups personall. Glencore say they didn't break the law, but won't say if they were telling the truth. Ex-LNP politicians running fake grassroots websites supporting coal power refusing to say whether they received funding from Glencore to set up their sites.

It all has a very 1970's tobacco industry feel about it...

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...re-bankrolled-covert-campaign-to-prop-up-coal

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Astroturfing at its finest. Glencore invests 4 to 7 million pounds attacking green groups and unions, including targeting individuals within these groups personall. Glencore say they didn't break the law, but won't say if they were telling the truth. Ex-LNP politicians running fake grassroots websites supporting coal power refusing to say whether they received funding from Glencore to set up their sites.

It all has a very 1970's tobacco industry feel about it...

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...re-bankrolled-covert-campaign-to-prop-up-coal

Photoshopping wind turbines onto the background of WWI war graves renders satire completely meaningless.

These people are so far up their own arses they’ve practically turned inside out.

 

[NSWCROW]

Enjoy this video of Grimlock having to eat shit

 

[Generalissimo]

Muahahaha

 

[nut]

Im not arguing anything other than politics - the idea is still born politically, so there is no point pursuing it until the mood of the electorate and the politicians changes.

I think we should have fully user pays on roads (monitors on all vehicles and charged per km), but there is no point chasing that either because the punters would lynch the first poli to suggest it

if you want to force change against the electorates will, you either have to change their minds, or become a dictatorship. The latter wont happen, and the former hasn't occurred for the past 60 years on this issue - and i see either the events or the political will to reverse this

Isn’t taxing fuel easier than putting monitors on cars and a per kilometre tax? And it rewards cars with low fuel rates.... and electric cars.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Isn’t taxing fuel easier than putting monitors on cars and a per kilometre tax? And it rewards cars with low fuel rates.... and electric cars.

Doesn't work with electric cars

An electric truck/SUV chews up as much bitumen as a diesel truck/suv

 

[nut]

giggle SA pays almost 50% more on average than it's neighbours

Germany almost 100% more than france, sweden and norway (who use nuclear and or hydro)



and france, sweden and norway are 10-15 times better for the environment, safer and more reliable.


So other than price, reliability, safety and the environment............Germany and SA are doing great!

Norway does not and never have used Nuclear for power generation .... they are virtually 100% hydro and sell some of its excess to neighbouring countries....

 

[nut]

Doesn't work with electric cars

An electric truck/SUV chews up as much bitumen as a diesel truck/suv

I get that we need to pay for roads, but surely taxing electric cars and petrol cars the same is counter productive to the current environmental problems.
Monitors in electric cars makes sense for the future.

 

[Power Raid]

Norway does not and never have used Nuclear for power generation .... they are virtually 100% hydro and sell some of its excess to neighbouring countries....

I think you missed the word “or”

Every jurisdiction on the planet that delivers the benchmark standard of 40-70g CO2 per kwhr use nuclear OR hydro

nz, tassie, ny state, parts of Canada, most of South America, France, Norway, Sweden


YET not one place on earth using wind and solar with hydro or nuclear can make that benchmark

Instead those following the failed German model will follow suit delivering an outcome 10-15 times worse CO2 and waste money. In the case of Germany alone they’ll blow $1.5 trillion in subsidies.

Yet some say job well done! If that’s the case, they are also saying Australia doesn’t need to do anything as we aren’t far behind Germany’s 2035 as they continue to build coal to replace nuclear.

 

[Power Raid]

I get that we need to pay for roads, but surely taxing electric cars and petrol cars the same is counter productive to the current environmental problems.
Monitors in electric cars makes sense for the future.

At the moment petrol is cleaner than the EV. That will change over time, for those who build hydro and nuclear.

The fuel excise tax will be a huge loss to government coffers but it’s a fundamental reform that will happen. I dare say the driverless uber will replace the family car, so even rego will be diminished.

We will see the rise of wealth taxes in time being both annual and in death.

 

[Hawk Dork]

With Abbott back flipping is the war over ?

and why did they sack Truffles again?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I get that we need to pay for roads, but surely taxing electric cars and petrol cars the same is counter productive to the current environmental problems.
Monitors in electric cars makes sense for the future.

I'm also a fan of a carbon tax (and expanding the GST to all purchases while reducing income and company tax)

One tax doesn't fix everything

 

[Kwality]

I get that we need to pay for roads, but surely taxing electric cars and petrol cars the same is counter productive to the current environmental problems.
Monitors in electric cars makes sense for the future.

Where does the revenue shortfall come from? Govts arent going to reduce spending.

 

[nut]

Where does the revenue shortfall come from? Govts arent going to reduce spending.

Taxes

 

[Hawk Dork]

0.0"something" will make up the short fall today that number slightly increases as electric car uptake does

 

[E Shed]

With Abbott back flipping is the war over ?

and why did they sack Truffles again?

I would imagine that if in the unlikely event both the COALition and Speedo man are reelected all bets will be off again.
They will say anything to try and get back but if they were to go around again Abbott would just say that meant they had a mandate to build a carpark on the great barrier reef to let Adani do whatever they want with and put a new coal fired power station on every street corner.
He had literally no principles that are not for sale.

 

[CM86]

Instead those following the failed German model* will follow suit delivering an outcome 10-15 times worse CO2 and waste money. In the case of Germany alone they’ll blow $1.5 trillion in subsidies.

*Un-sourced statement
Energiewende is in phase 2 of it's total target reduction of GHG emissions by 2050.
Legislative support for Energiewende was passed in 2010.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energiewende_in_Germany
http://deepdecarbonization.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/DDPP_DEU.pdf

 

[Power Raid]

*Un-sourced statement
Energiewende is in phase 2 of it's total target reduction of GHG emissions by 2050.
Legislative support for Energiewende was passed in 2010.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energiewende_in_Germany
http://deepdecarbonization.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/DDPP_DEU.pdf

Facts speak for themselves...........

More $ and an outcome 10-15 times worse than the benchmark and 65 years behind France

Unsourced? Do you believe Australia should do nothing, as we aren’t that far behind Germany now and their replacement of nuclear with coal plants and the expansion of gas will see us even closer.