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USA MAGA activist Charlie Kirk shot dead during Utah rally

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Okay. We've probably had enough of a free for all.

There are still forum and site posting guidelines, and you will abide by them.

A few seem to be of the opinion that now is a good time to have a crack at moderators or moderation. I'd rather like to discourage that impulse so I'm going to make it explicit: a moderator on this forum is a poster like any other, and can share their views and have free use of the forum like any other. If you feel a post breaches the rules report it; attacking a mod for their posting or objecting to a post purely because a moderator said it is grounds for an infraction and some time off.

From here, if you cannot speak civilly, you will not be allowed to participate.

Thanks all.
 
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bourbons said:
Yeah, I noticed this too.

Like I accept its out there and happening, but for all the people seeing leftists gloating and celebrating everywhere they turn on the internet I suspect it has more to do with their algorithm than anything else.
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It's not the blue-haired 19-year-old they/them uni students laughing on TikTok that bother me. They're unhappy souls and I pity them more than anything. I haven't seen too much of it either.

It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.

And it's what isn't said - anything about free speech, the importance of hearing those we disagree with, how great it was that Kirk was so committed to entering university campuses and engaging with students, professors and anyone else who would line up for a turn at the microphone.

That's what bothers me.
 
PJays said:
It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.
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Its the 30 year old Christian who says '' God loves us all but ****ing kill all lefties ''

No need for the pause after the but
PJays said:
That's what bothers me.
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So this is your line?
 
spinynorman said:
The US is a violent country where people get shot all the time. In this case, the person who was shot and killed was a reprehensible person, a hateful grifter, who propagated the said violence that in the end killed him.

The thing that's making this different is the right's lunatic response, who have seemingly enforced a week of international mourning for a Youtuber, and any of us who choose to opt out of this are heckled for it (and with the threat from JD Vance of worse).

I'm not sure how we can get to 101 pages on this in less than a week - the same as the thread about the rise of China has gotten in 7 years, and easily more than combined the threads on Macron's France, Starmer's UK, Milei's Argentina, the fallout of Bolsonaro's attempted coup on the Brazilian election and the India-Pakistan conflict.
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Don't want to take all of the credit but I was the TS!

lP9db-.gif
 

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PJays said:
It's not the blue-haired 19-year-old they/them uni students laughing on TikTok that bother me. They're unhappy souls and I pity them more than anything. I haven't seen too much of it either.

It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.

And it's what isn't said - anything about free speech, the importance of hearing those we disagree with, how great it was that Kirk was so committed to entering university campuses and engaging with students, professors and anyone else who would line up for a turn at the microphone.

That's what bothers me.
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And which side of politics has been trying to shut down University campuses for the past, I don't know, 100 years?

Kent State, Sit-Ins, Freedom Rides, anti-nuclear, anti-genocide. Every single time, the conservatives met free speech, peaceful discussions and protests with violence and then blamed the students for saying things they didn't like.

In recent years, the attacks on so-called anti-semitism on campus has been a big deal to conservatives. But Charlie Kirk is a bigoted homophobe anti-trans campaigner and was doing a tour of Uni campuses. If bigots aren't supposed to be on any campuses, why is some bigotry allowed, but not other imagined bigotry?
 
spinynorman said:
I'm not sure how we can get to 101 pages on this in less than a week - the same as the thread about the rise of China has gotten in 7 years, and easily more than combined the threads on Macron's France, Starmer's UK, Milei's Argentina, the fallout of Bolsonaro's attempted coup on the Brazilian election and the India-Pakistan conflict.
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Social media algorithms and mainstream media content focus here just cut and pasting form America. The way our media have been talking about C Kirk, you’d think he was as popular here as Princess Diana, like in 20 years time the average Australian will be thinking “I remember where I was when I heard the news Charlie Kirk had died”
 
PJays said:
It's not the blue-haired 19-year-old they/them uni students laughing on TikTok that bother me. They're unhappy souls and I pity them more than anything. I haven't seen too much of it either.

It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.

And it's what isn't said - anything about free speech, the importance of hearing those we disagree with, how great it was that Kirk was so committed to entering university campuses and engaging with students, professors and anyone else who would line up for a turn at the microphone.

That's what bothers me.
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Again comments that are absolute in nature serve no purpose but to alienate.

So all primary school teachers now condone violence? What was after the 'But'?

When was the last time you were at university? You seem to have this concept that its all the left that deal with identity politics. Look at what you are doing. Woke theories, identity politics. You are doing the thing that you claim the left do.

He isn't a saint.
Did he deserve death? No.
Will I mourn him? No.
Do I feel for his family. Damn straight. No one deserves that.
 
Markfs said:
Someone tried to kill this guy? His dad after he trashed the family car?
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No, he went after John Barilaro when he was in Parliament in NSW, who had connections to Clubs NSW and criminal organisations, exposing their corruption, not long after someone firebombed his house, all happened about 5 years ago, luckily he wasn't home when it happened.
1000002896.jpg
 
Satan said:
got friends that watch sky after dark, they are cooked
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My mate when I ask did you get that from Sky ' no I check all news channels ' yet only uses Sky phrases
 
schneebly111 said:
Social media algorithms and mainstream media content focus here just cut and pasting form America. The way our media have been talking about C Kirk, you’d think he was as popular here as Princess Diana, like in 20 years time the average Australian will be thinking “I remember where I was when I heard the news Charlie Kirk had died”
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Diana was were all this ridiculous performative mourning began. I don't have a lot of regard for the English but the stiff upper lip has always been something to commend them for and they just lost control of themselves for some reason when that woman died.
 
PJays said:
It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.
Click to expand...

So you admit you just don't like any criticism of Kirk, even if they don’t “celebrate” his death.

As far as “free speech” goes did Kirk support or oppose the free speech rights of those who were punished for speaking out in favour of Palestine?
 

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PJays said:
It's not the blue-haired 19-year-old they/them uni students laughing on TikTok that bother me. They're unhappy souls and I pity them more than anything. I haven't seen too much of it either.

It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.

And it's what isn't said - anything about free speech, the importance of hearing those we disagree with, how great it was that Kirk was so committed to entering university campuses and engaging with students, professors and anyone else who would line up for a turn at the microphone.

That's what bothers me.
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Again consider his comments on gun control and school shootings and that may give you an understanding on why teachers are resisting the sanctification of Kirk.
 
Gough said:
Diana was were all this ridiculous performative mourning began. I don't have a lot of regard for the English but the stiff upper lip has always been something to commend them for and they just lost control of themselves for some reason when that woman died.
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I think there was evidence before about a world wide mourning - I think the favourite ones before Diana was Kennedy and Lennon

Certainly my memory was strongly of Lennons death being mourned world wide for weeks (Kennedy just too early) and one in which I experienced that ' where were you ' moment

Diana is vague - I think I could dredge up a moment but not as specific as Lennon. Kirk ? Do you know if you asked me what day this week I would struggle
 
GreyCrow said:
I think there was evidence before about a world wide mourning - I think the favourite ones before Diana was Kennedy and Lennon

Certainly my memory was strongly of Lennons death being mourned world wide for weeks (Kennedy just too early) and one in which I experienced that ' where were you ' moment

Diana is vague - I think I could dredge up a moment but not as specific as Lennon. Kirk ? Do you know if you asked me what day this week I would struggle
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diana sunday morning watching junior football, lennon overseas airport seeing photo on foreign newspaper, looking for english newspaper, millane at work monday morning ?
 

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PJays said:
It's not the blue-haired 19-year-old they/them uni students laughing on TikTok that bother me. They're unhappy souls and I pity them more than anything. I haven't seen too much of it either.

It's the 30-year-old primary school teacher who says "Well I don't condone violence, but.....".

It's how quickly they pivot to the "but"... and what is said thereafter.

Quotes taken out-of-context, with subsequent commentary seeped in themes of identity politics and woke theories they learnt at uni 10 years earlier which have gradually become a core part of their worldview.

And it's what isn't said - anything about free speech, the importance of hearing those we disagree with, how great it was that Kirk was so committed to entering university campuses and engaging with students, professors and anyone else who would line up for a turn at the microphone.

That's what bothers me.
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Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, but I thought this was a quality post that articulated why reasonable people have been disheartened by the response to Kirk's death.

So far it's got multiple laugh reactions.

Numerous people have quoted it- and between all those replies, there was a noticeable lack of fallacy-free, rational responses that demonstrated comprehension, or grappled with my post in a serious way.

Sad.
 

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