Rumour Bluemour Discussion XLI

[Aphrodite]

#BUMP from February


Re: 'Alleged' rumours resurfacing ...

Folks, this is the way things are here.

Posters are responsible for what they post. Moderators can not attest to the accuracy or otherwise of any rumour posted.

Moderators will intervene for a couple of reasons.

1. If a thread is threatening to be derailed because of a post.

2. If invested parties request the removal of material.

None of this draws a conclusion as to the accuracy or otherwise of the original post.

There is no need to further speculate. What will be will be.

Also, you need to remember that this thread like all parts of this forum is bound by the rules of poster conduct. If you want to express skepticism towards a rumour that's fine, but having a crack at posters who are contributors to this forum is simply not on and will be acted upon.

Simply put, don't be a dick.

Thanks all!

 

[ferrisb]

Am I the only one not remotely excited or interested in Butters?

Butters is a superstar.

But he'll cost $1.5M+ a year over 6-8 years for a player that plays a fairly physical game. Plus 2-3 first rounders (port will force a trade).

Our list was too top-heavy when we were paying Charlie less than that.

Do I love Butters the player? Yes
Do I love Butters the recruitment? No

 

[Soapy V]

in which order would you select

I’d go Phillips. I like him and even though his last pre season was poor he had a great year. Says a lot. Good intercepter

 

[Benaly28]

I thought we’d re vamp our footy department and list but I wasn’t expecting this much change.

In saying that I love all the changes we’ve made and am so excited for next year more so than I was this year strangely enough.

 

[GT619]

I’d go Phillips. I like him and even though his last pre season was poor he had a great year. Says a lot. Good intercepter

good, tell baldy to get it done

 

[Dramoth]

Poor Geeelong it’s so unfair they got found out

If it'd been us, it wouldn't have been a 40k suspended fine and 37.5k in actual fine. We would have lost draft picks, been fined a million dollars... basically smashed like we were 23 years ago.

 

[GT619]

I thought we’d re vamp our footy department and list but I wasn’t expecting this much change.

In saying that I love all the changes we’ve made and am so excited for next year more so than I was this year strangely enough.

I feel more is coming

 

[HarryFlashman]

Jack had issues with Bolton, then with Teague, then with Voss.... what's the common denominator?

That all 3 are not good at being head coach, so bad in fact, they were fired because they couldn’t do the job.

All have a win record of less than 45%. All have had losing streaks of 4 or more games in a row per season, as coach of Carlton

Two were never given the opportunity to be head coach again & the third was not the first choice for the job he got.

Given the clear evidence of poor performance, it’s very likely that someone with a deep understanding of the game, would take issue with how they coached.

You think for a minute Jack might have been onto something?

 

[gab213]

That all 3 are not good at being head coach, so bad in fact, they were fired because they couldn’t do the job.

All have a win record of less than 45%. All have had losing streaks of 4 or more games in a row per season, as coach of Carlton

Two were never given the opportunity to be head coach again & the third was not the first choice for the job he got.

Given the clear evidence of poor performance, it’s very likely that someone with a deep understanding of the game, would take issue with how they coached.

You think for a minute Jack might have been onto something?

There's always an excuse that people can find for Jack's ordinary attitude. I guess it comes as a perk with the name.

 

[Soapy V]

Jack had issues with Bolton, then with Teague, then with Voss.... what's the common denominator?

Standards and Culture

 

[HarryFlashman]

There's always an excuse that people can find for Jack's ordinary attitude. I guess it comes as a perk with the name.

So they are shit at their job which directly effects him & his job but Jack is shit bloke for not being happy about it???

FFS - u named 3 examples of losing coaches that were fired for being overwhelmingly poor at coaching a team.

I’d be pretty pissed too if I was Jack & my club was led by people who are proven to be shit at there job!

 

[gab213]

So they are shit at their job which directly effects him & his job but Jack is shit bloke for not being happy about it???

FFS - u named 3 examples of losing coaches that were fired for being overwhelmingly poor at coaching a team.

I’d be pretty pissed too if I was Jack & my club was led by people who are proven to be shit at there job!

He's never been happy about anything; it's an entitled attitude. Whatever you say doesn't change that. Anyway, he's not worth having an argument over , he's gone now, thankfully.

 

[Blue By Blood]

While I'd LOVE to have Butters in navy blue, the reality is, it will be very costly...

First of all, Port will match any bid... anyone who thinks they're gonna let him walk for a single band 1 compo pick is living on another planet. They are forcing a trade for him.

Secondly, any trade negotiation will involve Port DEMANDING our 2026 1st round picks. Both of them. Forget the 27 and 28 picks... that's not going to cut it, in fact Port will want those thrown in on top. They are investing heavily into next year's draft and those 2 first round picks we hold will be the only thing they really want from us, that I can assure you.

Third, the contract will have to be the biggest in AFL history. Butters will have 10 Vic clubs knocking on the door. We can't sell success yet, like say a Hawthorn or Geelong can. All we can do is sell him on the fact there are some familiar faces here with CD, MV, TB and Torin... but we'll have to stump up more $$$ because let's be real, that will be what he is after as well. What's the knock on effect of paying him say $2M / season for the next 8 years? just look at the Stains already this year... the TDK contract has ruffled the feathers of some of their existing players... I get the feeling that all is not well in Stainland and as a result, we won't see the improvement most expect from them...

Which brings me back to my point about Sam Walsh... he's also a free agent next year... if he sees us negotiating a $2M contract for Butters and not for him, he will feel betrayed and it's probably rightly so... and then we could lose him. Other clubs are already circling and ready to offer him big $ as well...

It's an all in bet I'm afraid. We'll have to satisfy Port, Butters and the rest of the playing group. It's the kind of bet you make when you're in Hawthorn's position, not ours. We just won't compromise matching the bid for Cody especially after he has committed to us and at the same time risk losing Sam Walsh and disrupt the culture we're trying to build...

Agree with most of what you say here BF- good post. But on the Walsh part.. he's professional enough to know how free agency works. If we get Butters and he thinks that will help us win a premiership then he may stay and not be as concerned about a maxed out contract given he'd be handsomely remunerated anyways. Or.. he spits the dummy and seeks out another team. Who? If it's Geelong.. well they never pay crazy contacts anyway so he wouldn't be getting 2M there.

Contrary to the TDK decision.. not many leave for simply the biggest contract offer. The carrot of success is what drives most of them so long as they are still handsomely paid. Butters would be a costly acquisition for sure in terms of both $ and picks but our team will be primed to bring in a FA after obtaining quality youth across consecutive drafts.

The good teams have players staying on slight unders. So yes it would have to be a buy in from the playing group and they would have to see us on the right path. It's why 2026 is a big year for us to take a step forward in playing style, in wins, and in culture. But regardless of Butters I'm very bullish on the talent we have and what's coming in.

 

[HarryFlashman]

He's never been happy about anything; it's an entitled attitude. Whatever you say doesn't change that. Anyway, he's not worth having an argument over , he's gone now, thankfully.

100% Jacks attitude is why we have been shit as a team, spot on

FFS do u pay any attention to the games?

Good luck finding anyone who put in the effort & attitude to win like Jack did on the field.

The bloke continually fought 2 opponents at the same time, tried to win or halve every ball & was the first to try and smother a kick.

Let’s just assassinate the blokes actual effort on the field because u don’t like his personality.

I give zero ****s if he’s a happy go lucky or a deadset Debbie downer - on field the bloke gave his all.

Yes he’s gone, but u can’t use 3 shit coaches as an example and then point to him as a common denominator.

 

[gab213]

100% Jacks attitude is why we have been shit as a team, spot on

FFS do u pay any attention to the games?

Good luck finding anyone who put in the effort & attitude to win like Jack did on the field.

The bloke continually fought 2 opponents at the same time, tried to win or halve every ball & was the first to try and smother a kick.

Let’s just assassinate the blokes actual effort on the field because u don’t like his personality.

I give zero ****s if he’s a happy go lucky or a deadset Debbie downer - on field the bloke gave his all.

Yes he’s gone, but u can’t use 3 shit coaches as an example and then point to him as a common denominator.

Oh, I wasn't talking about on field,when he was actually available he wasn't bad, it was the off field stuff that wasn't good, but that's been resolved now. I give a crap how it affects the team.

 

[ITCHY EYEBALLS]

Stuff them all, they aren't Carlton players any longer. I don't wish them ill, but at the same time, I don't wish any of them success in their football careers.

I’m 100% confident that our new arrivals will have more success than our recent departures

 

[HarryFlashman]

He's never been happy about anything; it's an entitled attitude. Whatever you say doesn't change that. Anyway, he's not worth having an argument over , he's gone now, thankfully.

What’s entitled is u spouting off crap arguments as u don’t like personality or maybe the fact he left.

Call him a shit bloke, say what u like, that’s your opinion but when u make shit arguments you will face opposition.

Facts don’t lie, especially around a losing coaches record

 

[KohPhi]

While ago it was taboo to ask about Elijah.

Now it seems okay.

Can someone more intelligent than me please clarify why the club allowed him to play last few games in 2’s if his papers were stamped.


It’s all very bizarre.


I’ve asked this question multiple times and no one has answered or given their opinion.

Check the PM..

 

[gab213]

What’s entitled is u spouting off crap arguments as u don’t like personality or maybe the fact he left.

Call him a shit bloke, say what u like, that’s your opinion but when u make shit arguments you will face opposition.

Facts don’t lie, especially around a losing coaches record

Nah, it's not opinion, but okay.

 

[gab213]

I’m 100% confident that our new arrivals will have more success than our recent departures

I think we are a better, more balanced team overall with their departures and likely, a happier one too.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Agree with most of what you say here BF- good post. But on the Walsh part.. he's professional enough to know how free agency works. If we get Butters and he thinks that will help us win a premiership then he may stay and not be as concerned about a maxed out contract given he'd be handsomely remunerated anyways. Or.. he spits the dummy and seeks out another team. Who? If it's Geelong.. well they never pay crazy contacts anyway so he wouldn't be getting 2M there.

Contrary to the TDK decision.. not many leave for simply the biggest contract offer. The carrot of success is what drives most of them so long as they are still handsomely paid. Butters would be a costly acquisition for sure in terms of both $ and pucks but our team will be primed to bring in a FA after obtaining quality youth across consecutive drafts.

The good teams have players staying on slight unders. So yes it would have to be a buy in from the playing group and they would have to see us on the right path. It's why 2026 is a big year for us to take a step forward in playing style, in wins, and in culture. But regardless of Butters I'm very bullish on the talent we have and what's coming in.

Yeah of course, there's a good chance Sam will still want to stay. Geelong won't offer massive contract but Hawks I can see doing that, they're desperate to add to their midfield star power.

Just on where we're at, let's just say, I'm far more confident after this off season than I was a couple months ago. I think GW, CD and MA have all done an incredible job. Having said that, I still don't think we finish higher than 10th. But it will def be more about the way we play than just the W/L results.

 

[HarryFlashman]

Nah, it's not opinion, but okay.

WTF does it matter whether he’s a sad sack if he gives his all on the field. Of course there’s a level of entitlement - his family is Carlton bloody royalty! never stopped him from putting his body on the line thou.

No one who played with him would question his want for the team to be better and to win.

I’d rather be around a sad sack who had my back than a happy go lucky idiot like Charlie who gave no ****s.

 

[Blue By Blood]

Yeah of course, there's a good chance Sam will still want to stay. Geelong won't offer massive contract but Hawks I can see doing that, they're desperate to add to their midfield star power.

Just on where we're at, let's just say, I'm far more confident after this off season than I was a couple months ago. I think GW, CD and MA have all done an incredible job. Having said that, I still don't think we finish higher than 10th. But it will def be more about the way we play than just the W/L results.

I think we'll be in the 7 to 10 range with a decent injury run. We have key players returning from injury, our youth got exposed to some games late in the season which is a plus, and we have greater balance across the park. More run and carry, better foot skills. We have some forwards now who actually lead at the ball in Hayward, Ainsworth, Kemp etc and runners who can actually hit a target.

A lot will come down to how much Voss can adapt his game plan to facilitate an attacking style and how well our structure is to defend the turnover. Some of the turnovers we made this year were so amateurish that no team could have defended the counter. It left the defence completely exposed. But more leading options and better foot skills should help with this a lot. I'm bullish.

Hawks do loom as a big player for Walsh. Hopefully they target Merrett again and get tied up with that. We just need to focus on ourselves, build a good culture amongst players and staff, improve our ball movement.. the players will start having more fun, it will lead to wins. If that helps us land a FA like Butters even better. Our supporters really get behind the team when we are doing well.. it's actually epic how much of a good vibe we bring when we are up and about. It's intoxicating for the players and they ride that momentum as we saw in 2023. We just need to get up and going and it will be a fun journey.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Check the PM..

Can someone pass me the PM? Thanks in advance.

 

[KingCharles]

will be in blue next year.
Livid things didn’t go to plan.

 

[Bearded Carpenter]

I feel a bit for Jack.

Bloke was unfortunately born in the wrong timeline.

Serg played in 4, won 2.
Sos, we all know how good and blessed he was in his era.

Jack got the raw end of this timeline
Entitled, sure, injured, heaps, as good as his dad and grandad, no way, groomed to join Carlton, absolutely, expected to play consistent finals, sure, was our club crap before and during his tenure, absolutely, gave his all when fit, yes from me.

All this would do most peoples heads in.

Was never going to win a flag with his club he loved, realised only few years left, cashed in.

Right or wrong for him and his family only he will know.

Wish him well, but he was not the reason why we are where we are at.

The silvagni family name regardless of recent times will always mean a great deal to me.