Conspiracy Theory Australian Politics

[zill]

I'm assuming ABC didn't add the laugh track, but who knows. Kelly should have just linked the unedited video, without the communist flag added.

 

[Cyclops]

The smallpox infection technique was used in some areas eg North and South America, so you can see why people think it could have happened here.

Those instances AFAIK used live viruses from infected individuals: there was no tech to preserve live viruses when the First Fleet arrived.

Judy Campbell wrote a book Invisible Invaders, and her thesis is the three major outbreaks of smallpox in Australia in the 19th century correspond to outbreaks in SE Asia at that time. She's a serious academic, not a crackpot like Windschuttle, so it's written without polemic or ill will.

The UK forces that landed in Australia had plenty of techniques for displacing and killing Indigenous people, alcohol was used to drug them, and lead used to kill them. I believe poisoned flour and other techniques are attested.

 

[Mofra]

The UK forces that landed in Australia had plenty of techniques for displacing and killing Indigenous people, alcohol was used to drug them, and lead used to kill them. I believe poisoned flour and other techniques are attested.

Poisened flour and blankets infected with disease were used (and documented) - those techniques borrowed from the British experience in North America.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

The smallpox infection technique was used in some areas eg North and South America, so you can see why people think it could have happened here.

Those instances AFAIK used live viruses from infected individuals: there was no tech to preserve live viruses when the First Fleet arrived.

Judy Campbell wrote a book Invisible Invaders, and her thesis is the three major outbreaks of smallpox in Australia in the 19th century correspond to outbreaks in SE Asia at that time. She's a serious academic, not a crackpot like Windschuttle, so it's written without polemic or ill will.

The UK forces that landed in Australia had plenty of techniques for displacing and killing Indigenous people, alcohol was used to drug them, and lead used to kill them. I believe poisoned flour and other techniques are attested.

Fairly sure this has been widely debunked.

 

[Cyclops]

Poisened flour and blankets infected with disease were used (and documented) - those techniques borrowed from the British experience in North America.

I haven't seen a smallpox blanket instance documented in Australia, but its been 20+ years since I was in the field. Would love to see the sources. Such an act would require competence and planning, neither of which was a strong point of the First Fleet.

Plenty of positive proof the colonies here were established with clearly genocidal policies and practices, both government and private. You only have to read the letters to the editor in the Port Phillip Gazette etc to see the discussion was mostly around how to do it (shoot them all, or round them up so they could die out of sight).

The technology simply didn't exist to transport live virus from the UK to Australia, variolation material was dead scabs which promoted an immune response but could not cause infection. This technique was pioneered in China several dynasties ago: live virus could be used for variolation and gave better immunity but also the risk of actual infection, but it had to be taken from living subjects. IIRC the infamous incident in Brazil was done in this way, smallpox sufferers blankets were taken from them while infected and given directly to indigenous people.

Its a shocking accusation to make, but given the various examples from the 13 colonies and Brazil its plausible, and colonial authorities or individuals would have if they could have.

I think it wasn't practicable.

 

[Cyclops]

Fairly sure this has been widely debunked.

You have been misinformed, the military officers involved reported on the use at the time:

The use of smallpox as a bioweapon against native Americans - PubMed

This study examines the use of smallpox as a biological weapon during the European colonization of the Americas, focusing on its deployment against indigenous populations as an early example of unethical human experimentation and biowarfare. Primary and secondary historical sources were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It is 100% accurate to say colonial authorities in North America tried to use smallpox as a weapon to annihilate indigenous tribes, but as the tribes had previously been exposed to unintended outbreaks they had some immunity.

Its been thirty years since I studied Brazilian history and I have no way to reach the resources I used to have, but from memory it was just as incontrovertibly attested.

 

[zill]

You have been misinformed, the military officers involved reported on the use at the time:

The use of smallpox as a bioweapon against native Americans - PubMed

This study examines the use of smallpox as a biological weapon during the European colonization of the Americas, focusing on its deployment against indigenous populations as an early example of unethical human experimentation and biowarfare. Primary and secondary historical sources were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It is 100% accurate to say colonial authorities in North America tried to use smallpox as a weapon to annihilate indigenous tribes, but as the tribes had previously been exposed to unintended outbreaks they had some immunity.

Its been thirty years since I studied Brazilian history and I have no way to reach the resources I used to have, but from memory it was just as incontrovertibly attested.

What a ridiculous straw man, the ABC should be defunded for spreading this BS.

 

[Cyclops]

What a ridiculous straw man, the ABC should be defunded for spreading this BS.

Not seeing the straw man.

Defunding the ABC would be an idiot move.

 

[zill]

Not seeing the straw man.

Defunding the ABC would be an idiot move.

It happened in america so it must have happened here?

 

[PenskeFile]

You have been misinformed, the military officers involved reported on the use at the time:

The use of smallpox as a bioweapon against native Americans - PubMed

This study examines the use of smallpox as a biological weapon during the European colonization of the Americas, focusing on its deployment against indigenous populations as an early example of unethical human experimentation and biowarfare. Primary and secondary historical sources were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It is 100% accurate to say colonial authorities in North America tried to use smallpox as a weapon to annihilate indigenous tribes, but as the tribes had previously been exposed to unintended outbreaks they had some immunity.

Its been thirty years since I studied Brazilian history and I have no way to reach the resources I used to have, but from memory it was just as incontrovertibly attested.

I can’t be bothered reading the report. What method have they proposed that the live virus was transported to be used as a weapon?

That ABC show was absolutely disgusting!
Shame on the ABC!

In Australia we can arrest people for suggesting Israel are committing genocide, meanwhile our own tax payer funded media pisses all over our own country, reporting something that someone thinks might have been able to happen.

We protect Israel and then allow this vile, disgusting rhetoric about Australia. Shame on the ABC!

 

[Cyclops]

It happened in america so it must have happened here?

Comparing two British colonies in the 18th century is quite reasonable.

The British experience in North America definitely informed their conduct here, with a move from franchise colonies to direct crown rule.

I can’t be bothered reading the report. What method have they proposed that the live virus was transported to be used as a weapon?

That ABC show was absolutely disgusting!
Shame on the ABC!

In Australia we can arrest people for suggesting Israel are committing genocide, meanwhile our own tax payer funded media pisses all over our own country, reporting something that someone thinks might have been able to happen.

We protect Israel and then allow this vile, disgusting rhetoric about Australia. Shame on the ABC!

You seem upset.

I hope you don't find out about Howard's Chinese gas give-away, or Menzies arming Japan, or Murdoch's antisemitism towards Monash, you might bust your boiler.

Did you know the Murdoch family has sponsored organisations to replace Monashs name and replace it with Murdoch's?

Really makes you think.

 

[PenskeFile]

Comparing two British colonies in the 18th century is quite reasonable.

The British experience in North America definitely informed their conduct here, with a move from franchise colonies to direct crown rule.


You seem upset.

I hope you don't find out about Howard's Chinese gas give-away, or Menzies arming Japan, or Murdoch's antisemitism towards Monash, you might bust your boiler.

Did you know the Murdoch family has sponsored organisations to replace Monashs name and replace it with Murdoch's?

Really makes you think.

Howard and Murdoch are two of the most horrible Australians of my lifetime. But that doesn’t invalidate my contempt for the ABC’s disgusting reporting on this. The ABC seems to be an important cog in the culture war machine

Edit: and Murdoch is a raging Zionist who was photographed many times with Ghislaine Maxwell, to me it seems laughable to try and call him an antisemite (which is just a bullshit word that means nothing these days)

 

[Cyclops]

Howard and Murdoch are two of the most horrible Australians of my lifetime. But that doesn’t invalidate my contempt for the ABC’s disgusting reporting on this. The ABC seems to be an important cog in the culture war machine

Edit: and Murdoch is a raging Zionist who was photographed many times with Ghislaine Maxwell, to me it seems laughable to try and call him an antisemite (which is just a bullshit word that means nothing these days)

Sir Keith Murdoch characterised Monash as a "pushy jew" and tried to get him sacked.

The family seems to be carrying on the vendetta, even though both men have been dead for decades.

I have to say its probably good youre unaware of all this of your anger threshold is so low.

 

[PenskeFile]

Sir Keith Murdoch characterised Monash as a "pushy jew" and tried to get him sacked.

The family seems to be carrying on the vendetta, even though both men have been dead for decades.

I have to say its probably good youre unaware of all this of your anger threshold is so low.

Ok, I didn’t know you were referring to Keith Murdoch. In any case you have only brought Murdoch (and Howard) into the thread as a distraction away from the ABC’s dishonest (yet again) reporting. Just because the Murdoch empire is pretty awful doesn’t give the, tax payer funded, ABC carte Blanche to act as dishonestly as it likes.

You don’t know what my anger threshold is.

 

[Mofra]

A little bit of history

Smallpox epidemic

1789: Smallpox breaks out in Sydney

www.nma.gov.au

 

[Cyclops]

Ok, I didn’t know you were referring to Keith Murdoch. In any case you have only brought Murdoch (and Howard) into the thread as a distraction away from the ABC’s dishonest (yet again) reporting. Just because the Murdoch empire is pretty awful doesn’t give the, tax payer funded, ABC carte Blanche to act as dishonestly as it likes.

You don’t know what my anger threshold is.

You don't know what my Murdoch fact threshold is.

 

[zill]

Here's a video about the new hate speech laws. I wonder if big footy might possibly be designated a hate group, based on the prevalence of anti-Semitic rhetoric that gets bandied about here.