Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 3 * Coroner's Hearings Concluded

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 2

Criminal charges:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on FF *Guilty Overturned on Appeal
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on FM *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Please type names out in full for those who are not covered by suppression orders.

For those covered by suppression orders, please use the following to indicate:

WT - William Tyrrell
FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter
FPs - Foster Parents

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
FA - Frank Abbott
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
CCR - Cobb and Co Road
GO - Geoff Owens
One even reduced bike riding to - BR
COG - Consciousness of guilt. Like WHO KNEW?

 

[Kurve]

Any of you in here holding what you believe is evidence and refer to it as through discussions, should post it rather than provoke others in here with the suggestion you've got it but won't share.

Thanks - Kurve

Take note thanks Grassy_Knoll

 

[GraceE]

You were going to update after you spoke to Insp Laidlaw, remember? We are still waiting. I think you have not spoken to him at all, instead speaking to another member of the team who took your details down and said "thank you". Am I right?

That is true, so why haven't they found anything?

Homicide? That is a big stretch from where the Police thinking was, about covering up an accidental fall.
Are you now saying you have evidence of homicide?

IMO, there is zero doubt the coroner will return a finding of:
1. William most likely deceased, on 12th Sep 2014, or very soon after.
2. Place of death - unknown
3. Manner of death - unknown
4. Persons responsible if not accidental death - unknown.

The report will also be critical of the Police investigation.

The inspector has given good detail on shadows and high sun direction by season. I have touched on it too. In essence the argument is that the photos have a shadow direction at 90 degrees to what’s expected on suncalc recreations at 9.37. That is a massive disparity alone and most definitely raises serious questions regarding truth of the photos. Have we collectively misinterpreted the direction? There was a very good diagram that showed the direction at 9.37 suncalc graph overlayed on the house with compass directional indicators. It should be parallel with floorboards at 9.37 and it simply isn’t to my eye. You have to imagine forensic people will resolve this either way. The answer may very well determine the sec 319 fate

 

[winyhill]

I have never seen SFR or Craddock describe publicly what they believe to be the actual sequence of events:
Who was where exactly? What vehicles and people came and went from Benaroon? Even down to what time William actually 'disappeared'. (Was it ~10am or ~10.30am? for example).
I don't even know how SFR can rock up to a coronial inquest without this.

Seems incredible that they dont have more "established proven facts". I dont think the Police were ready in 2019 for an inquest. And they still weren't ready in 2024 for the last sittings.

Three different lead investigators. 12 years. No timeline.

 

[winyhill]

The cups of tea is a direct reference to the FM statement from 2016. Reading between the lines, Craddock brings it up because her statement is not plausible.

I am not sure you can infer what Craddock believes. He is not there to prosecute a defendant. He was there to illicit a response in order to clarify.

That is true, but why would anyone know to the minute, when they finished their tea, when they got up to put the kettle on for another one, when they poured another one.

I have had two cups since I got up and about to get a third, but I couldn't tell you the times. Why would I know that?

She obviously was not aware that she was going to require an alibi.

 

[winyhill]

The inspector has given good detail on shadows and high sun direction by season. I have touched on it too. In essence the argument is that the photos have a shadow direction at 90 degrees to what’s expected on suncalc recreations at 9.37. That is a massive disparity alone and most definitely raises serious questions regarding truth of the photos. Have we collectively misinterpreted the direction? There was a very good diagram that showed the direction at 9.37 suncalc graph overlayed on the house with compass directional indicators. It should be parallel with floorboards at 9.37 and it simply isn’t to my eye. You have to imagine forensic people will resolve this either way. The answer may very well determine the sec 319 fate

Sorry, I dont understand what you are getting at here? Did Laidlaw say that the direction is wrong? Did you actually speak with him?

 

[Inspector Small]

Somebody mentioned dogs/puppies . I don’t think they are humans. I think they are photos of dogs.

This looks like a stacked image imho. Where one image is stacked on top of another. I have confirmed that this is present in all the photos on the internet I can find.

One image is from the photograph and the second is from the reflection on the surface of the screen that was photographed.

You can definitely see the edge of each photo.

 

[GraceE]

Sorry, I dont understand what you are getting at here? Did Laidlaw say that the direction is wrong? Did you actually speak with him?

Read it again. No ambiguity. Multiple people have challenged it with the evidence suncalc graphs house and compass overlays supporting the contention. By all means you can have your own interpretation of shadow direction like everyone else.

It’s not limited to those who “talk to Laidlaw”

 

[GraceE]

Somebody mentioned dogs/puppies . I don’t think they are humans. I think they are photos of dogs.

This looks like a stacked image imho. Where one image is stacked on top of another. I have confirmed that this is present in all the photos on the internet I can find.

One image is from the photograph and the second is from the reflection on the surface of the screen that was photographed.

You can definitely see the edge of each photo.

I don’t see it. The cross metal slat is window to high balcony or sliding door .The cream vertical item I suspect is the pillar to railing on that balcony. Go check. I see no frame nor picture of dogs. The tree is a tree and foliage distorts image

 

[Curious Clues]

That is true, but why would anyone know to the minute, when they finished their tea, when they got up to put the kettle on for another one, when they poured another one.

I have had two cups since I got up and about to get a third, but I couldn't tell you the times. Why would I know that?

She obviously was not aware that she was going to require an alibi.

There is no mention in anything that there was more than one lot of tea made.

There’s also absolutely no suggestion at inquest that FM made 2 cups, 3 cups, 5 cups etc of tea for her and her mother.

The evidence suggests one tea making event and that’s it. Your tea habits are irrelevant

By the way FM has stated that she had hot tea when taking the photos.
So it must have been made just before 9:37 as per her own provided evidence.

 

[winyhill]

Somebody mentioned dogs/puppies . I don’t think they are humans. I think they are photos of dogs.

This looks like a stacked image imho. Where one image is stacked on top of another. I have confirmed that this is present in all the photos on the internet I can find.

One image is from the photograph and the second is from the reflection on the surface of the screen that was photographed.

You can definitely see the edge of each photo.

That was me, Dogs were what my brain saw in that, but I still think they could just be patterns in the shrubbery.

 

[winyhill]

It’s not limited to those who “talk to Laidlaw”

But did you talk to Laidlaw?

 

[GraceE]

That was me, Dogs were what my brain saw in that, but I still think they could just be patterns in the shrubbery.

Are. Zero question. I’ve spent 2000 or more hours inspecting these. Nothing to see in this photo IMO

A collaboration I had with another investigator he raised multiple examples of objects incorrectly claimed as people that were foliage pixel distortions as are these

 

[winyhill]

There is no mention in anything that there was more than one lot of tea made.

There’s also absolutely no suggestion at inquest that FM made 2 cups, 3 cups, 5 cups etc of tea for her and her mother.

The evidence suggests one tea making event and that’s it

Oh, I am sure they had more than one cup. When you say there is no mention of more than one cup, you are talking about the time period after they sat on the back patio, not the whole morning.

 

[Curious Clues]

Oh, I am sure they had more than one cup. When you say there is no mention of more than one cup, you are talking about the time period after they sat on the back patio, not the whole morning.

No I’m talking about the lie she told many people ‘that William went missing while she was inside making tea’.

 

[GraceE]

But did you talk to Laidlaw?

I’ve never claimed to have spoken to him and I’m not going to discuss your suggestion I may have

 

[winyhill]

I’ve never claimed to have spoken to him and I’m not going to discuss your suggestion I may have

You did tell us you were going to. And I did say that you haven't.

I am in no way suggesting you have. Quite the opposite.

 

[GraceE]

You did tell us you were going to. And I did say that you haven't.

I am in no way suggesting you have. Quite the opposite.

Wrong person

 

[Inspector Small]

No I’m talking about the lie she told many people ‘that William went missing while she was inside making tea’.

In the statement I have seen the FM states that she put down a cup of tea to take the roar photo. That tea was made in the two minutes between the first set of three photos and the next two according to the statement.

The reason I posted about Craddock and the cup of tea, is that it’s simply not credible for the FGM to of made the fastest cup of tea in history. It throws serious doubt on the validity of when the photos were taken.

IMHO I think Craddock knows this is untrue.

Edited to add what I have been shown. Edited to remove statements

 

[GraceE]

In the statement I have seen the FM states that she put down a cup of tea to take the roar photo. That tea was made in the two minutes between the first set of three photos and the next two according to the statement.

The reason I posted about Craddock and the cup of tea, is that it’s simply not credible for the FGM to of made the fastest cup of tea in history. It throws serious doubt on the validity of when the photos were taken.

IMHO I think Craddock knows this is untrue.

The gap between the 4th and 5th photo is only 15 seconds I recall. If that’s when it was purported it’s impossible.

Boiling water can take a few minutes and making tea and handling it time also. This is a major flaw then in testimony

The total duration was 2’39” from start to finish it would take longer

This could well be a proved lie.

 

[winyhill]

In the statement I have seen the FM states that she put down a cup of tea to take the roar photo. That tea was made in the two minutes between the first set of three photos and the next two according to the statement.

The reason I posted about Craddock and the cup of tea, is that it’s simply not credible for the FGM to of made the fastest cup of tea in history. It throws serious doubt on the validity of when the photos were taken.

IMHO I think Craddock knows this is untrue.

Edited to add what I have been shown.

Has that statement ever been released by SFR or by the coroner? I would like to get a copy of it.

 

[Jim Cricket]

There's nothing there that says FGM made the tea between photos. Another crock, lie.

 

[GraceE]

Seeing as there's no evidence of this statement by FM put up - I mean we don't need evidence from proven bs artists like Insp Tiny - I'll suggest the statement is yet another crock or it could just be misreporting or misinterpretation. She may have put down the cup of tea to take the series of pictures, not the roar one specifically. But I'll go with crock given previous history. Regardless of that, I don't think minutiae like this matters at all. If he ran around the corner and disappeared she was doing something. As always it's people trying to make something out of nothing.

And your opinion is important or relevant because?

A lie proven as so in testimony is significant despite your claim it’s not.

Chris Dawson had 7 lies which were the total basis of his case sending him to jail. A lie which directly questions veracity of the time sequence of photos is a MAJOR thing. Why? Because it once again undermines the 9.37 and photos.

 

[Jim Cricket]

And your opinion is important or relevant because?

A lie proven proven as so in testimony is significant despite your claim it’s not.

Chris Dawson had 7 lies which were the total basis of his case sending him to jail. A lie which directly questions veracity of the time sequence of photos is a MAJOR thing. Why? Because it once again undermines the 9.37 and photos.

Actually Tiny edited his post to provide some sort of evidence - evidence that doesn't prove his point - while I was typing that up so I deleted the comment.

The supposed lie, which doesn't appear to be a lie, doesn't affect the time sequence of anything. It doesn't tell us that FGM started and finished making the tea and served it between photos.

 

[GraceE]

Steeping time for black Tea is 3’ to 5’.

Again the total time was 2’39”. Then you have to hand the cup over and return to camera. Impossible. Can’t quite recall the gap between 3 and 4 but vaguely recall 2’ so steeping Tea taking 3’ making Tea another 1.5’. Handing it over and picking camera up again focusing and snapping another 1.5’ . 6’ total. Didn’t happen. It’s a lie.

That’s before you get to WT having 3 shirts on but only 2 at 15” later without any help from Mum.

 

[Jaydon12]

There is no mention in anything that there was more than one lot of tea made.

There’s also absolutely no suggestion at inquest that FM made 2 cups, 3 cups, 5 cups etc of tea for her and her mother.

The evidence suggests one tea making event and that’s it. Your tea habits are irrelevant

By the way FM has stated that she had hot tea when taking the photos.
So it must have been made just before 9:37 as per her own provided evidence.

Funny because didn’t they report at the last inquest that the FM was asked why she told 9 friends and family members she went inside to make a cup of tea when he disappeared. So then by her own account - close to 10.30am. Was that her second cup of tea? lol
Yet in previous interviews in her own words, she tells us she was sitting chatting with FGM when he jumped off the deck, ran around the corner and vanished forever.
And you’re right - also mentions a cup of tea while taking the photo. Where was the FGM’s cup? Not on the side table.
Seems to me someone may be reliving a pleasant tea time had by all from another time