2003 Draft Re-done.

[GrandBlue]

If the 2003 draft was re-done, who would the top 10 picks be? Looking at the list, I see that a lot of late players ended up getting more games than a lot of the early ones so you better be browsin through the list.

For the sake of the topic, I added a Poll in relevance as well. Who got the better deal? Essendon or St. Kilda?.

 

[__aria__]

jeez just had a look through and there is only a handful of decent players in that draft

anyways ill have a go at a top 10 including father son

1 Cooney
2 Fisher
3 Stanton
4 H Shaw
5 McLean
6 Tuck
7 Adcock
8 Waters
9 Sylvia
10 Walker

its late so i probably missed someone

 

[Quinz]

A very weak draft that one turned out to be.

I'm pretty happy that we managed to get Waters and Butler out of it, plus Nicoski on the rookie list.

Richmond got a few nice picks late with Andrew Raines and Shane Tuck.

 

[GrandBlue]

A very weak draft that one turned out to be.

I'm pretty happy that we managed to get Waters and Butler out of it, plus Nicoski on the rookie list.

Richmond got a few nice picks late with Andrew Raines and Shane Tuck.

I agree, the draft was weak but a top 10 list would be interesting because most of the top 10 picks in the draft were duds and most of the later ones turned out better.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Based on both talent and future potential.

1. Cooney
2. Fisher
3. Shaw
4. McLean
5. Stanton
6. Foley
7. Drummond
8. A.Davey
9. Adcock
10. Waters

Something like that, very crap draft, chucked a few from the rookie draft in aswell, I assume they were all eligible.

As to the other question... Its pretty much Fisher and Clarke vs Stanton and Lovett, while I think our boys will do more combined this year, Fisher is a class above and gives Stkilda the nod.

 

[Quinz]

Cooney
Fisher
Heath Shaw
McLean
Stanton
Adcock
Waters
Raines
Tuck
Sylvia

Something like that. I'm hoping Sam Butler will be up there soon, but he hasn't played much in the past two seasons.

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

1. Cooney
2. Fisher
3. Shaw
4. Tuck
5. Stanton
6. McLean
7. Adcock
8. Waters
9. Rischitelli
10. Mundy

 

[cAsEy_18]

Foley is #2 behind Cooney if rookies are allowed.

 

[GrandBlue]

Foley is #2 behind Cooney if rookies are allowed.

Wrong year.

 

[bradrowe#32]

Why is Fisher in front of Shaw?

 

[__aria__]

something to do with the fact that he is a far better player

 

[Smyth94]

Why is Fisher in front of Shaw?

lol.

 

[smiddaz123]

When Shaw was at his best he was better than Fisher, but that stopped when he started being tagged and got suspended. Fisher is currently ahead of him, but not by a long way, and that can easily change.

1- Cooney
2- Fisher
3- Shaw
4- Tuck
5- McLean

Clear top 5 for me.

 

[Smyth94]

Cooney
Fisher
Heath Shaw
McLean
Stanton
Adcock
Waters
Raines
Tuck
Sylvia

Something like that. I'm hoping Sam Butler will be up there soon, but he hasn't played much in the past two seasons.

H Shaw too high IMO

Both Stanton and McLean are superior footballers.

 

[Smyth94]

When Shaw was at his best he was better than Fisher, but that stopped when he started being tagged and got suspended. Fisher is currently ahead of him, but not by a long way, and that can easily change.

1- Cooney
2- Fisher
3- Shaw
4- Tuck
5- McLean

Clear top 5 for me.

I'm sorry but when H Shaw started to get some attention and I mean close attention he went to water.

Stanton, McLean and Tuck are better footballers, and they deal with tags.

 

[smiddaz123]

I'm sorry but when H Shaw started to get some attention and I mean close attention he went to water.

Stanton, McLean and Tuck are better footballers, and they deal with tags.

Stanton is a god awful kick. Shaw is better both defensively and offensively than Stanton, not a chance. Stanton is top 10 probably, due to the weakness of the draft.

Getting tagged in the backline is completely different to being tagged in the midfield as well, it's far harder to shake in the backline since you're required to be accountable as well.

Added to that, Shaw still plays a vital role even when not getting lots of possessions. When all you notice is that his dream team points have gone down, then 'Shaw went to water' tends to be popular opinion.

Malthouse was more than happy to sacrifice Shaw's possession stats as long as he continued to perform defensively, which he did, and rebound primarily through other outlets such as Clarke.

He's a quality player, and stats watchers and dream team watchers wont see this. Football watchers will.

 

[hellfire]

I'm sorry but when H Shaw started to get some attention and I mean close attention he went to water.

Stanton, McLean and Tuck are better footballers, and they deal with tags.

They deal with midfield tags, yes. And I'm not sold on Stanton dealing with a tag as it is. Shaw has to deal with being tagged across half-back. He can't break the tag through sheer running capacity nor ball-winning ability around stoppages, because he's there to shut-down his man first, and provide rebound second.

Heath Shaw in full-flight is an extremely damaging player who is clearly top 4 from that draft for me.

 

[Smyth94]

Stanton is a god awful kick. Shaw is better both defensively and offensively than Stanton, not a chance. Stanton is top 10 probably, due to the weakness of the draft.

I would've agreed with you two seasons ago but that is just plain wrong. Stanton whilst not in the same class as a Judd/Kerr/Black has improved his kicking immensley.

Better defensively? You'd hope so considering Shaw is primarily a defender - but that didn't stop Stanton from averaging almost double Shaw's tackles per game.

Better offensively? You've got to be joking? More goals, more inside 50's, more goals contributed.

They deal with midfield tags, yes. And I'm not sold on Stanton dealing with a tag as it is. Shaw has to deal with being tagged across half-back. He can't break the tag through sheer running capacity nor ball-winning ability around stoppages, because he's there to shut-down his man first, and provide rebound second.

Heath Shaw in full-flight is an extremely damaging player who is clearly top 4 from that draft for me.

Can I ask you a question? Why doesn't Shaw play in the middle? If he's getting tagged across half-back, he should be pushing into the midfield to get himself more involved in the game. Honestly I just don't think he has the tank to do so and that's another thing Stanton has over Shaw - elite endurance.

If Stanton is struggling in the middle he will work through half-back to attempt to beat his tag and this has provided him with good results.

 

[mdc]

Stanton, McLean and Tuck are better footballers, and they deal with tags.

....

 

[smiddaz123]

Better offensively? You've got to be joking? More goals, more inside 50's, more goals contributed.

Oh smart one. Pick out stats that a defender would contribute pretty much 0 to. Way to not be bias....

How about we don't base our opinions on stats?

How about we base it on the fact Stanton is a terrible kick, whereas Shaw is a far better kick and makes better decisions.

Little tip. There is more to being good offensively than having pretty inside 50 stats or whatever.

 

[mi_hrvati]

I would've agreed with you two seasons ago but that is just plain wrong. Stanton whilst not in the same class as a Judd/Kerr/Black has improved his kicking immensley.

Better defensively? You'd hope so considering Shaw is primarily a defender - but that didn't stop Stanton from averaging almost double Shaw's tackles per game.

Better offensively? You've got to be joking? More goals, more inside 50's, more goals contributed.



Can I ask you a question? Why doesn't Shaw play in the middle? If he's getting tagged across half-back, he should be pushing into the midfield to get himself more involved in the game. Honestly I just don't think he has the tank to do so and that's another thing Stanton has over Shaw - elite endurance.

If Stanton is struggling in the middle he will work through half-back to attempt to beat his tag and this has provided him with good results.

just nit picking but judd is far away from an elite kick.

 

[smiddaz123]

Can I ask you a question? Why doesn't Shaw play in the middle? If he's getting tagged across half-back, he should be pushing into the midfield to get himself more involved in the game. Honestly I just don't think he has the tank to do so and that's another thing Stanton has over Shaw - elite endurance.

If Stanton is struggling in the middle he will work through half-back to attempt to beat his tag and this has provided him with good results.

Or instead you could read my post properly and see where I answered that.

 

[mdc]

Can I ask you a question? Why doesn't Shaw play in the middle? If he's getting tagged across half-back, he should be pushing into the midfield to get himself more involved in the game. Honestly I just don't think he has the tank to do so and that's another thing Stanton has over Shaw - elite endurance.

His skill-set is suited to being a defender. Excellent 1-on-1, terrific overhead for his size, reads the play well, runs off his opponent with ease (unless that opponent happens to be a decoy tagger).

In the midfield, you need to win the ball at ground level, make quicker decisions, etc...not things that Shaw does well.

 

[whelan=legend]

1. Cooney
2. McLean
3. Fisher
4. Stanton
5. Shaw
6. Tuck
7. Sylvia
8. Adcock
9. Waters
10. Walker

 

[hellfire]

Can I ask you a question? Why doesn't Shaw play in the middle? If he's getting tagged across half-back, he should be pushing into the midfield to get himself more involved in the game. Honestly I just don't think he has the tank to do so and that's another thing Stanton has over Shaw - elite endurance.

If Stanton is struggling in the middle he will work through half-back to attempt to beat his tag and this has provided him with good results.

Because, as I clearly stated, he is a defender first. His job is to stop his man, and if his man drags him out of the play in order to curb Heath's influence, then he has basically done his job just by being so dangerous! Why would he need to break a tag when playing as a defender, when we have great rebound coming from the likes of Clarke, Goldsack, O'Brien and Maxwell anyway?

As for Stanton working across half-back to break his tag, that's totally different and you know it (or you're a little slow). A midfielder playing behind the ball is totally different to a defender breaking a tag. Opposition players tagging Shaw run away from the play in order to take Shaw out of the game, Shaw follows because he is a defender. Stanton doesn't have the same responsibility as a midfielder.