2018 Draft thread

[Viceregal]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

Not to be contentious just enquiring ... if we put Browny at the peak of his powers into our current forward line how much difference would it make without changing our current midfield personnel compared to if we put Aker at the peak of his powers into our current midfield rotation and kept our current forward line?

edit - noting that this is the draft thread and no one is going to be at the peak of their powers but conceptually still interested

 

[SizeMatters]

Talking to a bloke from work who is Thomas Berrys uncle, reckons that Thomas is a lot better footballer than his brother Jarrod (Lions).
He also said that he is pretty relaxed & laid back until he gets onto the field, then he has a bit of mongrel about him (which we are lacking at the moment) he also has a ton of pace (which we are also lacking)
Only downside is, he is an inside mid & we have an abundent of them, also this bloke has SFA knowledge of AFL.

 

[Billy Puller]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

Good to see you're still around Jason

 

[SizeMatters]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

thought you passed. Welcome back.

 

[M Malice]

Not to be contentious just enquiring ... if we put Browny at the peak of his powers into our current forward line how much difference would it make without changing our current midfield personnel compared to if we put Aker at the peak of his powers into our current midfield rotation and kept our current forward line?

edit - noting that this is the draft thread and no one is going to be at the peak of their powers but conceptually still interested

Hard one V, Browny in this year would make a substantial difference IMO, we are getting the ball inside and around the F50 more often than in the previous few years, we just can't consistently take marks in that area of the ground.

Aker could just weave around a few and shoot from just outside 50 on his left or right and slot it himself, no need for a power forward.

 

[BuntonRules]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

In every bit of footage I have seen of him, I have not seen a pack mark. All with separation and whilst undoubtedly a huge talent I wonder if he will get that much room at the top.

 

[M Malice]

In every bit of footage I have seen of him, I have not seen a pack mark. All with separation and whilst undoubtedly a huge talent I wonder if he will get that much room at the top.

Yep, more a Nick Riewoldt type, I think he'll take his share of pack marks though.

 

[Lionsrbest2]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

He can only take a strong pack mark if we can get it to him. That’s exactly why the midfield is so so important.
No midfield , forwards may as well sit in the stands.

 

[jjami15]

Well as long as we don't stuff up a draft like the Cleveland Browns we will do alright!

 

[cubansombrero]

I think we need a key forward, but I'm not convinced a Riewoldt type is what we're looking for (though you wouldn't say no if he fell in your lap). The way I see it, Beams, Rich, Zorko, M Robbo and Christensen will all be around for a few more years while the kids develop. Those kids include McCluggage, Berry, Bailey and Rayner, plus Starcevich and Cox who will take longer but you'd expect to be good mids as well. Then we also have Mathieson, Keays, Bastinac and Lester (plus potentially Lyons) who will maintain pressure on selection and have shown that they can do enough at AFL level to be competitive even if none of them are stars. That's a pretty good base for a midfield, especially if we can nail some later picks in the draft and bring in a few FAs/trades to round out the depth.

On the other hand, our tall forwards consist of Hipwood, Walker and McStay (when he's not needed down back). I also have high hopes for Ballenden and Wooller, but neither of them is a sure thing. A top end draft pick who could develop into a contested marking specialist in the forward 50 would go a long way to alleviating the pressure on Hipwood and providing more opportunities for guys like Taylor and Cameron to capitalise when the ball does come to ground. Someone who plays more like Cameron (GWS) or Tom Lynch (the GC one).

 

[trikster]

Well as long as we don't stuff up a draft like the Cleveland Browns we will do alright!

NOBODY can stuff up a draft like the Browns!! Baker Mayfield is NOT the best QB in the draft and Ward at 4 was a big reach.

Any-hoo, what games like today show is that we should probably just draft the best player available irrespective of need still.

 

[Lionsrbest2]

Hard one V, Browny in this year would make a substantial difference IMO, we are getting the ball inside and around the F50 more often than in the previous few years, we just can't consistently take marks in that area of the ground.

Aker could just weave around a few and shoot from just outside 50 on his left or right and slot it himself, no need for a power forward.

Hi there Jason. ditto as per the others ,good to see you back. When I refer to midfield I mean A grade talent that can spear passes onto our forwards chest. From what I have seen and experienced our movement into the forward line in most cases is poor to say the least. We are lacking polish ,highly skilled players.i.e. Elite kicking skills putting it down the throats of our forwards would. Be nice to see. Welcome Back!!!!

 

[Simba Moyo]

I would love Izak Rankine but Jack Lukosius is the man we need. We desperately need a strong pack marking key forward.

Is Lukosius a big pack mark taking forward? From the albeit limited vision I've seen from him, he's an absolute workhorse but wouldnt say an elite mark

Regardless he still looks like a genuine future star. Rankine likewise is also a freak.

 

[Keays2myBeamas]

Hi there Jason. ditto as per the others ,good to see you back. When I refer to midfield I mean A grade talent that can spear passes onto our forwards chest. From what I have seen and experienced our movement into the forward line in most cases is poor to say the least. We are lacking polish ,highly skilled players.i.e. Elite kicking skills putting it down the throats of our forwards would. Be nice to see. Welcome Back!!!!

I agree. But it's elite skills out of the backline, and elite hands to get out of congestion - not merely delivery inside 50, that is needed. When good fast kicking skills are executed out of the backline, the mids have time and space to kick into the forward line, and the forward line isn't flooded, so the forwards have space to lead, and we tend to hit them, we're actually not that bad at the delivery inside 50. But more often than not we find ourselves forced to bomb it high because:
a) ball movement out of the backline was too slow/imprecise, the midfield is flooded, the mids are under pressure, they don't execute handball/evasive skills well enough to alleviate the pressure, and they are forced to kick under immense pressure
b) ball movement out of the backline is too slow/imprecise, so the forward line is flooded, there is no room for leads/short passes, and so there is no choice but the bomb it to the contest

Scoring from back half stoppages can be far more fluid than scoring from forward half stoppages because the forward line isn't flooded. The easiest way to kick goals is by executing the all or nothing kick from the back flank into the centre square without turning it over. This is what we were doing in 2016 under Leppitsch - and we were so bad at executing the kick inside that we conceded 130pts per game, but we also scored very well and had a very "efficient" forward line, purely because of the way the ball was coming in.

Priorities for the draft should be more Hodge/Witherden types for the backline. And look for mids with elite ability to handball their team out of traffic. Rockliff was very good at this. Bastinac is underrated as well. Drafting KPPs and ruckman with high picks, who take 7 years to develop, is a sure fire way to sink a club - especially when free agency occurs after 8 years. Elite kicking/handballing comes naturally - it doesn't take 7 years of senior football to develop, you just need 1 or 2 years to get your confidence up and body ready. Rankine would be a fantastic asset, and could play off a wing. Walsh doesn't look damaging enough with ball in hand, but there is still a year of football to go. Lukosius has the luxury of space in the forward 50 in a good SANFL team. He would be an asset for a great AFL team, but will struggle at the Lions/Carlton for his first 3-5 years, which will be a shame to see.

 

[Lionsrbest2]

I agree. Iorward line, and the forward line isn't flooded, so the forwards have space to lead, and we tend to hit them, we're actually not that bad at the delivery inside 50.

Scoring from back half stoppages can be far more fluid than scoring from forward half stoppages because the

develop, you just need 1 or 2 years to get your confidence up and body ready. Rankine would be a fantastic asset, and could play off a wing.

He would be an asset for a great AFL team, but will struggle at the Lions/Carlton for his first 3-5 years, which will be a shame to see.

Rankine would be a fantastic asset, and could play off a wing.

orward line, and the forward line isn't flooded, so the forwards have space to lead, and we tend to hit them, we're actually not that bad at the delivery inside 50. But more often than not we find ourselves forced to bomb it high because:
a) ball movement out of the backline was too slow/imprecise

I have to say a brilliant post. WOW. agree with so many points you raised.
Nunan was a massive fan of skill and speed so to my dad ,something fitzroy unfortunately at the end when Nunan was coach the club did not have a lot of. I loved Nunan for his tactical nous, honesty and frankness he was inspirational.
I want players like rankine and Hill@ the club if we can get 2 picks with in the top 10.
I acknowledge we need a lot ,absolutely ,agree,and it is very valid, rebounding of backline is important as it helps set up our attack but the mids need to also help and support our backline and cannot afford to be lazy. I have suggested a couple of players recently as HBF that are attacking rebounding defenders.Targeting FA, uncontracted players that r A grade talent would be the icing on the cake.
The mids need to be versatile and be able to play in multiple positions to help with team flexibility. great point by yourself.
I understand and realise that old cliche is true ,Rome was not built in a day. So despite the loses I am still upbeat about our future and firmly believe that famous proverb is true for us ,i.e. we will reap what we sow. By laying the foundations now, sucess will happen in a few years from now.Thats what I truly believe,although there are no guarantees in life. We are building towards that ultimate goal and the next few drafts are critically important along with FA and uncontracted players. It is very easy as supportrs to be disheartened by the losses but everything has to be put into context and looked at in terms of the bigger picture.

Hips is getting hammered and remarks that he is not a true full forward are corrrect. Some Fans have unrealistic expectations on Hips, a very young player still. He needs urgent support from another young forward but from one who has been in the system several years and is A grade talent.Hips at CHF by some on this board is where I believe he needs to be. You know obviously who I want at FF,Lynch.

People suggesting that we trade next years 1st rounder are absolutely wrong in my book. I am about trading players or a mixture of both player and latter draft picks so long as it does not include our 1st rounder.

I know it is subjective,but my take ,(I know your view is different) on inside 50’s is that overall we are poor,and bombing it in far to often for my liking. Which is not fair at all to Hips as others have suggested and I agree with wholeheartedly. Passes need to be lace out to our teammates in the foward line.

Really enjoyed your post ,I thought it was fantastic. Thanks

 

[Dodongo]

Dodongo is still firmly in the Lukocius camp

 

[Dodongo]

NOBODY can stuff up a draft like the Browns!! Baker Mayfield is NOT the best QB in the draft and Ward at 4 was a big reach.

Any-hoo, what games like today show is that we should probably just draft the best player available irrespective of need still.

Dodongo disagrees with you there. Dodongo always had Mayfield as the best QB.

1. Mayfield
2. Rosen
3. Darnold
4. Jackson
5. Rudolph
6. Allen

Dodongo thinks Allen will be a complete bust and Jackson could be as high as 2 in a few years but Dodongo will say no more as this is not the thread.

 

[trikster]

Dodongo thinks Allen will be a complete bust and Jackson could be as high as 2 in a few years but Dodongo will say no more as this is not the thread.

Hence why I threw in a token draft related comment in mine

 

[jjami15]

Is Lukosius a big pack mark taking forward? From the albeit limited vision I've seen from him, he's an absolute workhorse but wouldnt say an elite mark

Regardless he still looks like a genuine future star. Rankine likewise is also a freak.

He isn't that contested marking beast but over works his man by nous and run. He does double grab from time to time. He is being given the Riewoldt tag which is dangerous (as he was an absolute star in retrospect) but he also shows elements of Gunston as well. All in all he would be a massive upgrade on our list if we were to draft him.

Rankine would be a fantastic asset, and could play off a wing.

orward line, and the forward line isn't flooded, so the forwards have space to lead, and we tend to hit them, we're actually not that bad at the delivery inside 50. But more often than not we find ourselves forced to bomb it high because:
a) ball movement out of the backline was too slow/imprecise

I have to say a brilliant post. WOW. agree with so many points you raised.
Nunan was a massive fan of skill and speed so to my dad ,something fitzroy unfortunately at the end when Nunan was coach the club did not have a lot of. I loved Nunan for his tactical nous, honesty and frankness he was inspirational.
I want players like rankine and Hill@ the club if we can get 2 picks with in the top 10.
I acknowledge we need a lot ,absolutely ,agree,and it is very valid, rebounding of backline is important as it helps set up our attack but the mids need to also help and support our backline and cannot afford to be lazy. I have suggested a couple of players recently as HBF that are attacking rebounding defenders.Targeting FA, uncontracted players that r A grade talent would be the icing on the cake.
The mids need to be versatile and be able to play in multiple positions to help with team flexibility. great point by yourself.
I understand and realise that old cliche is true ,Rome was not built in a day. So despite the loses I am still upbeat about our future and firmly believe that famous proverb is true for us ,i.e. we will reap what we sow. By laying the foundations now, sucess will happen in a few years from now.Thats what I truly believe,although there are no guarantees in life. We are building towards that ultimate goal and the next few drafts are critically important along with FA and uncontracted players. It is very easy as supportrs to be disheartened by the losses but everything has to be put into context and looked at in terms of the bigger picture.

Hips is getting hammered and remarks that he is not a true full forward are corrrect. Some Fans have unrealistic expectations on Hips, a very young player still. He needs urgent support from another young forward but from one who has been in the system several years and is A grade talent.Hips at CHF by some on this board is where I believe he needs to be. You know obviously who I want at FF,Lynch.

People suggesting that we trade next years 1st rounder are absolutely wrong in my book. I am about trading players or a mixture of both player and latter draft picks so long as it does not include our 1st rounder.

I know it is subjective,but my take ,(I know your view is different) on inside 50’s is that overall we are poor,and bombing it in far to often for my liking. Which is not fair at all to Hips as others have suggested and I agree with wholeheartedly. Passes need to be lace out to our teammates in the foward line.

Really enjoyed your post ,I thought it was fantastic. Thanks

Skill and speed we are lacking but does look like that is the way the game is heading. I think that is a focus with our acquisition of Bailey and Starc who aren't slow by no means at least. At our 1st there will be those available who shows these traits. But it would be great to also get some talent from our second and third. All in all can't wait for the Nationals.

 

[Lionsrbest2]

He isn't that contested marking beast but over works his man by nous and run. He does double grab from time to time. He is being given the Riewoldt tag which is dangerous (as he was an absolute star in retrospect) but he also shows elements of Gunston as well. All in all he would be a massive upgrade on our list if we were to draft him.

Skill and speed we are lacking but does look like that is the way the game is heading. I think that is a focus with our acquisition of Bailey and Starc who aren't slow by no means at least. At our 1st there will be those available who shows these traits. But it would be great to also get some talent from our second and third. All in all can't wait for the Nationals.

There is a song from the 80’s I just can’t get enough.this applies to our recruitment of skill and speed. I mentioned a couple of latter picks with this in mind,who from what I have seen thus far have those attributes. Nunan made it quite clear about skill and especially elite kicking, he was unequivocal about that,so our latter 2nd and 3 rd must display those traits.My dad had to focus on this when doing recruiting tapes but also had to pick out what they did badly. That is why all picks are important but those 2nd and 3rd arounds can be used to either (as part of a trade) get us higher up the pecking order or used in conjunction with a player to net us an A grade talent,then I am all for it. Under no circumstances should we trade our 1st pick though. Matt Balmer mentioned in a piece he wrote, a FF who has awesome talent,for the 2019 draft. The point I am making here is that we need more top end talent so wether it be pick 1 , pick 5 in 2019;it should be off limits.

 

[Lionsrbest2]

Dodongo is still firmly in the Lukocius camp

I would only do this if we get pick 1 and 2 PP. but i doubt that will happen.AFL would never want to help us that way. So at this stage Rankine with 1st pick all the way. I would still want hill though.

 

[luthor]

Not to be contentious just enquiring ... if we put Browny at the peak of his powers into our current forward line how much difference would it make without changing our current midfield personnel compared to if we put Aker at the peak of his powers into our current midfield rotation and kept our current forward line?

edit - noting that this is the draft thread and no one is going to be at the peak of their powers but conceptually still interested

I'm going for the Aker type.

A great mid can make average forwards look good.

I don't believe the opposite applies

 

[Viceregal]

I'm going for the Aker type.

A great mid can make average forwards look good.

I don't believe the opposite applies

Conversely average mids can make a great forward look bad?

 

[Hollow Knight]

I'm going for the Aker type.

A great mid can make average forwards look good.

I don't believe the opposite applies

I reckon Browny made some bog average mids look okay for years.

 

[luthor]

I reckon Browny made some bog average mids look okay for years.

Nah.

Browny owes heaps for the siliver service over the years from guys like......um.......Justin Sherman?