AFL's longterm future

[Tigez 4 Life]

The onus is obviously on the AFL to start matching Soccer in terms of investment to secure future generations of AFL players, it is also on the AFL to start working out how to bring back the excitement of a game that flows freely, finding a way to reduce the amount of players at a stoppage is a good start, sick of seeing just about every player in both teams within 30 meters of a stoppage

 

[no orange peeler]

I have to say I'm a passionate richmond and afl supporter. But I'm from a soccer background and I have played all my life.

Soccer is growing rapidly in this country but I don't think it will ever be the number 1 sport. The afl really need to start developing and investing in grass roots in this country. The facilities, the coaching is absolutely piss poor and you only get thru to the top level with your own personal talent and hard work.

Now let's look at soccer in Europe, and almost every club in the top leagues have an outstanding junior programme. Kids who get identified as early as 6 or 7 years old with potential get signed up by clubs. They get coached by professional coaches, they have amazing facilities, and most of all they have the opportunity to become the best they can. Time and time again clubs like Ajax from holland keep producing really good players that come thru the soccer academies.

Careful dont mention academies

 

[no orange peeler]

What the AFL needs is a richmond premiership... the excitement that would evoke would be unfathomable. Im not just saying that because i am a richmond fan. I was talking about this to a couple of Geelong supporting mates who both said it and both brought it up.

 

[Tiger23]

Agree in part, the game must invest in the game, no doubt.

But what made footy the great game is that blokes in their 20s and 30s would play the game with love and passion without any prospect of "making it" thru any academy or stream into AFL. The little kids dream of being a superstar but grow to love the game, grow up, have their own kids and the cycle endures.

Turn the game into shit at the highest level and be buggered if blokes will run around D grade amateurs to set up at stoppages and rotate 20 times thru the bench. Drag me after I kick a goal. **** off!!
They talk about speccies, miracle goals, the occasional punch on and live for next week when they try it on again with their mates.

That's a good point mate, the game at the top needs to be cleaned up.

But don't think we are producing enough talent with the system we currently have in place. I'm sure we have all played with guys at school or in clubs that were guns but as they got to 15, 16 or 17 they stopped thru either seeing no avenues to get to the top level or partying or whatever other reasons. Now imagine there was a top line youth and academy system in place for players from 6 thru to 16. With education, top training facilities, top coaching (and not Johnnys dad taking the team for drills). We have to step up, and Im telling you it all starts with grass roots. Boys will start learning about being a professional at young ages and learning about discipline and all other aspects but also nurturing there potential and talent.

 

[Tomnat Tigers]

Not sure you can point to a lack of highlights or low scoring games as a reason as for why the game has began to stagnate and soccer is advancing simply due to the fact that most soccer games you're lucky to see multiple goals scored. Sure with soccer there is a lot of excitement every time theres the possibility of a goal scoring opportunity but thats due to the low scoring nature of soccer whereas in a game of aussie rules you can just respond to the opposition kicking a goal by kicking one yourself which obviously isn't as simple in soccer. Furthermore similar theories apply such as getting as many men behind the ball to defend and then counter attacking once you've won control of the ball again and of course some teams do it better than others.

Moreover the standard of the A league is laughable and might be considered alright provided you haven't been exposed to the standard of play found in the big leagues such as the EPL. Whilst in terms of attendances if I had kids and was concerned by them being exposed to poor behaviour at a sporting event (like so many mothers these days) soccer certainly wouldn't be the code I would pick. Sure AFL games have plenty of swearing but if someone behaves inappropriately (constant swearing/abuse) they are more likely to be called out for doing so then at a soccer game.

In saying this the AFL should be doing more to provide better facilities to keep kids playing the game regardless of their ability. I know a number of guys I played with in my juniors (U10's) stopped playing as they couldn't stand the cold and shitty conditions of mud heap ovals, which although not a big issue the older you get, in your younger days where games go for 40 minutes early on a saturday morning there are better things you could be doing for 5-8 weeks of the year.

 

[Livonski]

I wasn't comparing it to soccer.

I was comparing footy to footy (when it was great!)

 

[Koze]

This was a debut post on the main board. Worth a read...

Hello. I have been an AFL fan for three seasons now even though I have never been to Australia. I watch the game each week now but have never posted on here before because I am still new to the game. I reckon though as someone 'outside looking in' I have something to contribute here. Might I also add that I have been an Everton Football Club supporter for over 25 years.

I can understand why you might think football/soccer is a threat to AFL but I really don't think that it is! The reason being is that football actually has a multitude of major problems that you will not notice until you become a real fan (and preferably one in Western Europe).

Here in England football is being run into the ground. We have the strongest structure in the world (five professional leagues/~100 clubs) yet many of our clubs are struggling to stay alive. Money is being thrown at players who really do care sod all about the team, professional clubs have nearly gone out of business because of these actions, the players live in La La Land and have little connection with fans now, some clubs are now being run by rich Asians and Arabs who see the club as nothing more than a vanity project or a way of extracting cash. Last year one Thai-owner of Cardiff City Football Club (founded 1899) actually changed the teams colours from blue to red because "Thai people like red"! No I am not joking. The transition from 'football club' to 'sports business' has not gone unnoticed and European soccer is leading the pack. The biggest problem that football has? The big clubs are becoming huge and the small clubs are becoming mere trampolines. In the major four leagues (England/Spain/Germany/Italy) even as late as the 1980s there was genuine competition. Now it is clear who is going to win. It is the same teams year after year - "he who spends the most wins". I hear Carlton fans and St Kilda fans and Western Bulldogs fans on here wondering "when is it going to be our year?". Do you know what? All three clubs have a greater chance of winning the AFL 2016 than Everton have of winning the Premier League 2015/2016. Even the bookies will agree. As a young man in England I can say without a doubt that as each year passes football loses more and more fans. Why bother when Chelsea or City or United have it sewn up?

But hey is it right to compare England and Australia? Of course not. So lets look at Ireland or France or even Denmark or the Netherlands. Ireland is a country that SHOULD really be football mad right? The English Premier League on their doorstep, conducted through the English language. Well actually wrong. Professional football doesn't even exist in Ireland. Their top league is struggling to stay afloat. Gaelic games and even rugby union are much more popular in that country. Of course some people support Premier League clubs but they are not in the hearts of the Irish like the GAA is. Unlike Australia, football has had decades of opportunity to batter the Irish but it hasn't. In fact the all-powerful life-sucking Premier League probably has had more of a negative influence on Irish football than a positive one. I was surprised by this at first but after living in Ireland for two years I realised why this was the case.

What about France? A nation that has won the World Cup, hosted the World Cup, and who even has two clubs owned by filthy rich billionaires (Paris and Monaco - might I add: Monaco spent £150 MILLION POUNDS in 2013 yet get average crowds of 8,000; their rich Russian billionaire wants them to win the Champions League soon). Yet despite all this football is even losing traction in France. Southern France still loves it's rugby union, and Ligue 1 still struggles financially. Probably the best example of how football continues to kill itself domestically is in the Netherlands. Unfortunately despite being a football mad country the Netherlands does not have the population to support a league like Germany or Spain does. Decades ago clubs like Ajax (1995) and Eindhoven (1988) used to win the Champions League. Now, despite still producing great talent, no club of The Netherlands will ever win the CL and they are used by the bigger clubs for poaching players. The Dutch domestic league has suffered because of this degradation. Smaller countries like Denmark and Norway and Scotland especially have seen this too. Scotland used to be a great football nation but is now a complete basketcase that struggles to uphold a professional league.

The idea that the A League will breeze into Australia is in my opinion laughable. You talk about Australia getting more marquee players but my God it will surely be a long time before it gets even one marquee player? To be the best in football you have to play Champions League, which means you have to play for one of the 10-15 clubs that play Champions League year in year out. Australia will NEVER have that draw. All I see is a bunch of has-beens who don't give a stuff about Australia nor the A League, coming over to Australia to beef up their pension packet. Is this really what the Australian public want? Even Brazil and Argentina struggle domestically because they struggle to keep hold of their players, so I really don't think A-League has a chance. Australian fans of the AFL will know that they are witnessing the best in their sport, week in week out, A League fans will only ever get to see fifth rate players week in week out. Apparently the A League is now the 99th best football league in the world...

To be honest it baffles me why so many people in Melbourne went to see the football. Here in England it is known by all football fans that these 'international matches' are simply there to make $$$$$$$. Manchester City doesn't give a stuff about Australia, heck it barely gives a stuff about Manchester. It is a business decision dressed up as a sporting contest. Manchester City have maxed out the revenue that they can get in the UK (population 60 million) so they will jet off to Japan, Australia, Thailand, China etc to try and make some more. The money made from the Melbourne public will then go into a new players back pocket next year. That's how football now works. I do hope that Australians who watch these matches don't genuinely think that these clubs actually care... It may look like it on their Facebook page but they really don't! I wouldn't want you Australians to be duped by them, but a 100,000 crowd sounds like you are!

The only two changes you might see concern the World Cup and kids participation. One of the reasons football is so popular is because you can play it in the Sahara desert, the Brazilian rainforest, or a Canadian park in freezing temperatures. It requires no money to play (like ice hockey for example). Women can play, 4 years old can play, even 60 year old men can play. Football will always be the most popular sport for participation because of that. In my secondary school people who liked sports played rugby, cricket AND football; the ones who hated sport just played football. In fact I believe even in Australian schools football/soccer is No. 1 and I have heard that it will soon be No. 1 in the United States too (not sure how true that is but it wouldn't surprise me). I personally don't think football/soccer has had much effect on our Olympic, cricket, rugby union or rugby league teams being internationally competitive. The other change concerns the World Cup. Any nation that gets into that competition will see interest in that competition (and thus soccer) skyrocket. If I were the AFL I would accept that. Here in England, when people don't even care for football, they will still watch England getting whooped in the World Cup. It was the same for Korea, Costa Rica, Ireland, Serbia, Iran etc. Whatever cricket and rugby union like to think, the football World Cup and the Olympics are the only true worldwide events and so it is no surprise that they ignite national pride and passion. Even my Mother watches the World Cup and she doesn't even understand all the rules of football/soccer. It does not necessarily mean that soccer will do well domestically because of all this. If I were the AFL I would celebrate Australia being in any soccer World Cup. Heck I would tell footy fans that they could watch the WC soccer match on the big screen before/after the AFL game at the MCG if the two ever clash with regards to times. Learn to live with it. It only comes round every 4 years and hey you might not even qualify next time!

The immigration factor may have a role to play but I can't say much about that. I disagree completely with the philosophy of 'multiculturalism' and believe that the recent rate of immigration into England has had a negative effect on the country. I am not sure of it's effect on sport here. You would think that the African/Carribean immigrants would all like football, and the Indian/Asian immigrants would all like cricket but it is not quite like that simple. One thing I would say is that apparently Rugby League (a sport with a very white fanbase imo) is struggling in it's traditional heartland of Yorkshire because western and southern Yorkshire in particular have seen huge numbers of immigrants from India/Pakistan who apparently do not see the appeal of 'rough and tumble northern' Rugby League. Bradford is one example. But I don't know how accurate this is because I don't follow League much. Australia could be totally different, I really don't know.

It is bizarre because most people on this Big Footy forum moan and moan about the AFL but when I first watched the sport I was refreshed by just how damn good it is and by how well it is run. You guys have a country of just 23 million people spread over thousands of miles and yet you have a world class sporting competition in the AFL. The impression I get from players is that they genuinely care about the sport, and most of them for the club they play for. The fans for AFL come out in HUGE numbers and seem passionate in the stadiums. There is a striking array of fans too. More kids, women, and elder people than I am used to seeing at sports matches. The players are professional and dedicate their lives to their sport but don't live in Cloud Cuckoo Land like soccer players do on £200,000 a week. Even the moaning about club owners and directors is NOTHING like what you get here with soccer. Some of you might like to have a rich Russian or Arab take over your club but trust me it will probably do more harm than good. As far as I know, no AFL club knows what it's like to be some foreigners play-toy run like a dictatorship. Also some people lament the fact that AFL is only played in Australia (not internationally like football) but don't you see, that should be used as an advantage - it should be considered a positive not a negative. Even the two new teams - Gold Coast and West Sydney - they have been implemented well in my opinion and shows the ambition and unity that the AFL has. Comparing it to that other Australian league the NRL or the soccer leagues up here (who put club over sport) this is a real revelation! You should be proud and thankful of the sport you have, you genuinely should be. Most importantly on the pitch AFL is an exciting game, with the athletic players on the pitch needing to master a variety of skills (kicking, bouncing, handballing, obstructing, marking etc) and this impresses most first-time viewers (like myself a few years ago).

I think AFL has a very bright future and looking from the outside I think the game is being run well.

Football I feel is a juggernaut that seems to be eating itself up. I reckon Australia has nothing to fear, as the focus increasingly becomes stuck to the Champions League. I do still love Everton - there is too much history there - but I am one of the many people who are becoming disillusioned.

This is my opinion anyway, but I hope it's shed some light. Goodday."

 

[mattt]

It's Australian Rules. The token Gaelic games aside, it's only a national game... and in NSW and QLD, second to League and Union.

I think the appeal of soccer is that it's a truly international game - literally played everywhere; the talent pool is limitless, so is the $$$ and audience. Ronaldo and Messi are rock stars with the pay packet and lifestyle to match. Does this inspire kids to follow one code over another?

(edit: posted at the same time as the epic, but very valid post above. Kinda contradicts it!)

 

[SpudsLoveChild]

This was a debut post on the main board. Worth a read...

Hello. I have been an AFL fan for three seasons now even though I have never been to Australia. I watch the game each week now but have never posted on here before because I am still new to the game. I reckon though as someone 'outside looking in' I have something to contribute here. Might I also add that I have been an Everton Football Club supporter for over 25 years.

I can understand why you might think football/soccer is a threat to AFL but I really don't think that it is! The reason being is that football actually has a multitude of major problems that you will not notice until you become a real fan (and preferably one in Western Europe).

Here in England football is being run into the ground. We have the strongest structure in the world (five professional leagues/~100 clubs) yet many of our clubs are struggling to stay alive. Money is being thrown at players who really do care sod all about the team, professional clubs have nearly gone out of business because of these actions, the players live in La La Land and have little connection with fans now, some clubs are now being run by rich Asians and Arabs who see the club as nothing more than a vanity project or a way of extracting cash. Last year one Thai-owner of Cardiff City Football Club (founded 1899) actually changed the teams colours from blue to red because "Thai people like red"! No I am not joking. The transition from 'football club' to 'sports business' has not gone unnoticed and European soccer is leading the pack. The biggest problem that football has? The big clubs are becoming huge and the small clubs are becoming mere trampolines. In the major four leagues (England/Spain/Germany/Italy) even as late as the 1980s there was genuine competition. Now it is clear who is going to win. It is the same teams year after year - "he who spends the most wins". I hear Carlton fans and St Kilda fans and Western Bulldogs fans on here wondering "when is it going to be our year?". Do you know what? All three clubs have a greater chance of winning the AFL 2016 than Everton have of winning the Premier League 2015/2016. Even the bookies will agree. As a young man in England I can say without a doubt that as each year passes football loses more and more fans. Why bother when Chelsea or City or United have it sewn up?

But hey is it right to compare England and Australia? Of course not. So lets look at Ireland or France or even Denmark or the Netherlands. Ireland is a country that SHOULD really be football mad right? The English Premier League on their doorstep, conducted through the English language. Well actually wrong. Professional football doesn't even exist in Ireland. Their top league is struggling to stay afloat. Gaelic games and even rugby union are much more popular in that country. Of course some people support Premier League clubs but they are not in the hearts of the Irish like the GAA is. Unlike Australia, football has had decades of opportunity to batter the Irish but it hasn't. In fact the all-powerful life-sucking Premier League probably has had more of a negative influence on Irish football than a positive one. I was surprised by this at first but after living in Ireland for two years I realised why this was the case.

What about France? A nation that has won the World Cup, hosted the World Cup, and who even has two clubs owned by filthy rich billionaires (Paris and Monaco - might I add: Monaco spent £150 MILLION POUNDS in 2013 yet get average crowds of 8,000; their rich Russian billionaire wants them to win the Champions League soon). Yet despite all this football is even losing traction in France. Southern France still loves it's rugby union, and Ligue 1 still struggles financially. Probably the best example of how football continues to kill itself domestically is in the Netherlands. Unfortunately despite being a football mad country the Netherlands does not have the population to support a league like Germany or Spain does. Decades ago clubs like Ajax (1995) and Eindhoven (1988) used to win the Champions League. Now, despite still producing great talent, no club of The Netherlands will ever win the CL and they are used by the bigger clubs for poaching players. The Dutch domestic league has suffered because of this degradation. Smaller countries like Denmark and Norway and Scotland especially have seen this too. Scotland used to be a great football nation but is now a complete basketcase that struggles to uphold a professional league.

The idea that the A League will breeze into Australia is in my opinion laughable. You talk about Australia getting more marquee players but my God it will surely be a long time before it gets even one marquee player? To be the best in football you have to play Champions League, which means you have to play for one of the 10-15 clubs that play Champions League year in year out. Australia will NEVER have that draw. All I see is a bunch of has-beens who don't give a stuff about Australia nor the A League, coming over to Australia to beef up their pension packet. Is this really what the Australian public want? Even Brazil and Argentina struggle domestically because they struggle to keep hold of their players, so I really don't think A-League has a chance. Australian fans of the AFL will know that they are witnessing the best in their sport, week in week out, A League fans will only ever get to see fifth rate players week in week out. Apparently the A League is now the 99th best football league in the world...

To be honest it baffles me why so many people in Melbourne went to see the football. Here in England it is known by all football fans that these 'international matches' are simply there to make $$$$$$$. Manchester City doesn't give a stuff about Australia, heck it barely gives a stuff about Manchester. It is a business decision dressed up as a sporting contest. Manchester City have maxed out the revenue that they can get in the UK (population 60 million) so they will jet off to Japan, Australia, Thailand, China etc to try and make some more. The money made from the Melbourne public will then go into a new players back pocket next year. That's how football now works. I do hope that Australians who watch these matches don't genuinely think that these clubs actually care... It may look like it on their Facebook page but they really don't! I wouldn't want you Australians to be duped by them, but a 100,000 crowd sounds like you are!

The only two changes you might see concern the World Cup and kids participation. One of the reasons football is so popular is because you can play it in the Sahara desert, the Brazilian rainforest, or a Canadian park in freezing temperatures. It requires no money to play (like ice hockey for example). Women can play, 4 years old can play, even 60 year old men can play. Football will always be the most popular sport for participation because of that. In my secondary school people who liked sports played rugby, cricket AND football; the ones who hated sport just played football. In fact I believe even in Australian schools football/soccer is No. 1 and I have heard that it will soon be No. 1 in the United States too (not sure how true that is but it wouldn't surprise me). I personally don't think football/soccer has had much effect on our Olympic, cricket, rugby union or rugby league teams being internationally competitive. The other change concerns the World Cup. Any nation that gets into that competition will see interest in that competition (and thus soccer) skyrocket. If I were the AFL I would accept that. Here in England, when people don't even care for football, they will still watch England getting whooped in the World Cup. It was the same for Korea, Costa Rica, Ireland, Serbia, Iran etc. Whatever cricket and rugby union like to think, the football World Cup and the Olympics are the only true worldwide events and so it is no surprise that they ignite national pride and passion. Even my Mother watches the World Cup and she doesn't even understand all the rules of football/soccer. It does not necessarily mean that soccer will do well domestically because of all this. If I were the AFL I would celebrate Australia being in any soccer World Cup. Heck I would tell footy fans that they could watch the WC soccer match on the big screen before/after the AFL game at the MCG if the two ever clash with regards to times. Learn to live with it. It only comes round every 4 years and hey you might not even qualify next time!

The immigration factor may have a role to play but I can't say much about that. I disagree completely with the philosophy of 'multiculturalism' and believe that the recent rate of immigration into England has had a negative effect on the country. I am not sure of it's effect on sport here. You would think that the African/Carribean immigrants would all like football, and the Indian/Asian immigrants would all like cricket but it is not quite like that simple. One thing I would say is that apparently Rugby League (a sport with a very white fanbase imo) is struggling in it's traditional heartland of Yorkshire because western and southern Yorkshire in particular have seen huge numbers of immigrants from India/Pakistan who apparently do not see the appeal of 'rough and tumble northern' Rugby League. Bradford is one example. But I don't know how accurate this is because I don't follow League much. Australia could be totally different, I really don't know.

It is bizarre because most people on this Big Footy forum moan and moan about the AFL but when I first watched the sport I was refreshed by just how damn good it is and by how well it is run. You guys have a country of just 23 million people spread over thousands of miles and yet you have a world class sporting competition in the AFL. The impression I get from players is that they genuinely care about the sport, and most of them for the club they play for. The fans for AFL come out in HUGE numbers and seem passionate in the stadiums. There is a striking array of fans too. More kids, women, and elder people than I am used to seeing at sports matches. The players are professional and dedicate their lives to their sport but don't live in Cloud Cuckoo Land like soccer players do on £200,000 a week. Even the moaning about club owners and directors is NOTHING like what you get here with soccer. Some of you might like to have a rich Russian or Arab take over your club but trust me it will probably do more harm than good. As far as I know, no AFL club knows what it's like to be some foreigners play-toy run like a dictatorship. Also some people lament the fact that AFL is only played in Australia (not internationally like football) but don't you see, that should be used as an advantage - it should be considered a positive not a negative. Even the two new teams - Gold Coast and West Sydney - they have been implemented well in my opinion and shows the ambition and unity that the AFL has. Comparing it to that other Australian league the NRL or the soccer leagues up here (who put club over sport) this is a real revelation! You should be proud and thankful of the sport you have, you genuinely should be. Most importantly on the pitch AFL is an exciting game, with the athletic players on the pitch needing to master a variety of skills (kicking, bouncing, handballing, obstructing, marking etc) and this impresses most first-time viewers (like myself a few years ago).

I think AFL has a very bright future and looking from the outside I think the game is being run well.

Football I feel is a juggernaut that seems to be eating itself up. I reckon Australia has nothing to fear, as the focus increasingly becomes stuck to the Champions League. I do still love Everton - there is too much history there - but I am one of the many people who are becoming disillusioned.

This is my opinion anyway, but I hope it's shed some light. Goodday."

I'll wait for this to come out on video

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

I can handle games like yesterday.
In fact I enjoy it.
But there aren't many games I do enjoy.
I don't neccasarily enjoy high scoring uncontested footy either.
But some of the games are just putrid.
Richmond v Carlton hands down worse game I've ever seen.
Just scrums of players going nowhere.
The game was over umpired yesterday but you know what I didn't mind so much because it kept the game moving.
Didn't allow for constant rolling scrums and kept the ball moving.
I wonder if that was a directive?
If so stick with it I say.
Players will adjust accordingly.

The over saturation of the game is the main thing I reckon.
It's just everywhere 24/7 and has lost its magic for that reason.

 

[timper12]

As bad as footy is these days, soccer is even more dogshit.

 

[timper12]

This was a debut post on the main board. Worth a read...

Hello. I have been an AFL fan for three seasons now even though I have never been to Australia. I watch the game each week now but have never posted on here before because I am still new to the game. I reckon though as someone 'outside looking in' I have something to contribute here. Might I also add that I have been an Everton Football Club supporter for over 25 years.

I can understand why you might think football/soccer is a threat to AFL but I really don't think that it is! The reason being is that football actually has a multitude of major problems that you will not notice until you become a real fan (and preferably one in Western Europe).

Here in England football is being run into the ground. We have the strongest structure in the world (five professional leagues/~100 clubs) yet many of our clubs are struggling to stay alive. Money is being thrown at players who really do care sod all about the team, professional clubs have nearly gone out of business because of these actions, the players live in La La Land and have little connection with fans now, some clubs are now being run by rich Asians and Arabs who see the club as nothing more than a vanity project or a way of extracting cash. Last year one Thai-owner of Cardiff City Football Club (founded 1899) actually changed the teams colours from blue to red because "Thai people like red"! No I am not joking. The transition from 'football club' to 'sports business' has not gone unnoticed and European soccer is leading the pack. The biggest problem that football has? The big clubs are becoming huge and the small clubs are becoming mere trampolines. In the major four leagues (England/Spain/Germany/Italy) even as late as the 1980s there was genuine competition. Now it is clear who is going to win. It is the same teams year after year - "he who spends the most wins". I hear Carlton fans and St Kilda fans and Western Bulldogs fans on here wondering "when is it going to be our year?". Do you know what? All three clubs have a greater chance of winning the AFL 2016 than Everton have of winning the Premier League 2015/2016. Even the bookies will agree. As a young man in England I can say without a doubt that as each year passes football loses more and more fans. Why bother when Chelsea or City or United have it sewn up?

But hey is it right to compare England and Australia? Of course not. So lets look at Ireland or France or even Denmark or the Netherlands. Ireland is a country that SHOULD really be football mad right? The English Premier League on their doorstep, conducted through the English language. Well actually wrong. Professional football doesn't even exist in Ireland. Their top league is struggling to stay afloat. Gaelic games and even rugby union are much more popular in that country. Of course some people support Premier League clubs but they are not in the hearts of the Irish like the GAA is. Unlike Australia, football has had decades of opportunity to batter the Irish but it hasn't. In fact the all-powerful life-sucking Premier League probably has had more of a negative influence on Irish football than a positive one. I was surprised by this at first but after living in Ireland for two years I realised why this was the case.

What about France? A nation that has won the World Cup, hosted the World Cup, and who even has two clubs owned by filthy rich billionaires (Paris and Monaco - might I add: Monaco spent £150 MILLION POUNDS in 2013 yet get average crowds of 8,000; their rich Russian billionaire wants them to win the Champions League soon). Yet despite all this football is even losing traction in France. Southern France still loves it's rugby union, and Ligue 1 still struggles financially. Probably the best example of how football continues to kill itself domestically is in the Netherlands. Unfortunately despite being a football mad country the Netherlands does not have the population to support a league like Germany or Spain does. Decades ago clubs like Ajax (1995) and Eindhoven (1988) used to win the Champions League. Now, despite still producing great talent, no club of The Netherlands will ever win the CL and they are used by the bigger clubs for poaching players. The Dutch domestic league has suffered because of this degradation. Smaller countries like Denmark and Norway and Scotland especially have seen this too. Scotland used to be a great football nation but is now a complete basketcase that struggles to uphold a professional league.

The idea that the A League will breeze into Australia is in my opinion laughable. You talk about Australia getting more marquee players but my God it will surely be a long time before it gets even one marquee player? To be the best in football you have to play Champions League, which means you have to play for one of the 10-15 clubs that play Champions League year in year out. Australia will NEVER have that draw. All I see is a bunch of has-beens who don't give a stuff about Australia nor the A League, coming over to Australia to beef up their pension packet. Is this really what the Australian public want? Even Brazil and Argentina struggle domestically because they struggle to keep hold of their players, so I really don't think A-League has a chance. Australian fans of the AFL will know that they are witnessing the best in their sport, week in week out, A League fans will only ever get to see fifth rate players week in week out. Apparently the A League is now the 99th best football league in the world...

To be honest it baffles me why so many people in Melbourne went to see the football. Here in England it is known by all football fans that these 'international matches' are simply there to make $$$$$$$. Manchester City doesn't give a stuff about Australia, heck it barely gives a stuff about Manchester. It is a business decision dressed up as a sporting contest. Manchester City have maxed out the revenue that they can get in the UK (population 60 million) so they will jet off to Japan, Australia, Thailand, China etc to try and make some more. The money made from the Melbourne public will then go into a new players back pocket next year. That's how football now works. I do hope that Australians who watch these matches don't genuinely think that these clubs actually care... It may look like it on their Facebook page but they really don't! I wouldn't want you Australians to be duped by them, but a 100,000 crowd sounds like you are!

The only two changes you might see concern the World Cup and kids participation. One of the reasons football is so popular is because you can play it in the Sahara desert, the Brazilian rainforest, or a Canadian park in freezing temperatures. It requires no money to play (like ice hockey for example). Women can play, 4 years old can play, even 60 year old men can play. Football will always be the most popular sport for participation because of that. In my secondary school people who liked sports played rugby, cricket AND football; the ones who hated sport just played football. In fact I believe even in Australian schools football/soccer is No. 1 and I have heard that it will soon be No. 1 in the United States too (not sure how true that is but it wouldn't surprise me). I personally don't think football/soccer has had much effect on our Olympic, cricket, rugby union or rugby league teams being internationally competitive. The other change concerns the World Cup. Any nation that gets into that competition will see interest in that competition (and thus soccer) skyrocket. If I were the AFL I would accept that. Here in England, when people don't even care for football, they will still watch England getting whooped in the World Cup. It was the same for Korea, Costa Rica, Ireland, Serbia, Iran etc. Whatever cricket and rugby union like to think, the football World Cup and the Olympics are the only true worldwide events and so it is no surprise that they ignite national pride and passion. Even my Mother watches the World Cup and she doesn't even understand all the rules of football/soccer. It does not necessarily mean that soccer will do well domestically because of all this. If I were the AFL I would celebrate Australia being in any soccer World Cup. Heck I would tell footy fans that they could watch the WC soccer match on the big screen before/after the AFL game at the MCG if the two ever clash with regards to times. Learn to live with it. It only comes round every 4 years and hey you might not even qualify next time!

The immigration factor may have a role to play but I can't say much about that. I disagree completely with the philosophy of 'multiculturalism' and believe that the recent rate of immigration into England has had a negative effect on the country. I am not sure of it's effect on sport here. You would think that the African/Carribean immigrants would all like football, and the Indian/Asian immigrants would all like cricket but it is not quite like that simple. One thing I would say is that apparently Rugby League (a sport with a very white fanbase imo) is struggling in it's traditional heartland of Yorkshire because western and southern Yorkshire in particular have seen huge numbers of immigrants from India/Pakistan who apparently do not see the appeal of 'rough and tumble northern' Rugby League. Bradford is one example. But I don't know how accurate this is because I don't follow League much. Australia could be totally different, I really don't know.

It is bizarre because most people on this Big Footy forum moan and moan about the AFL but when I first watched the sport I was refreshed by just how damn good it is and by how well it is run. You guys have a country of just 23 million people spread over thousands of miles and yet you have a world class sporting competition in the AFL. The impression I get from players is that they genuinely care about the sport, and most of them for the club they play for. The fans for AFL come out in HUGE numbers and seem passionate in the stadiums. There is a striking array of fans too. More kids, women, and elder people than I am used to seeing at sports matches. The players are professional and dedicate their lives to their sport but don't live in Cloud Cuckoo Land like soccer players do on £200,000 a week. Even the moaning about club owners and directors is NOTHING like what you get here with soccer. Some of you might like to have a rich Russian or Arab take over your club but trust me it will probably do more harm than good. As far as I know, no AFL club knows what it's like to be some foreigners play-toy run like a dictatorship. Also some people lament the fact that AFL is only played in Australia (not internationally like football) but don't you see, that should be used as an advantage - it should be considered a positive not a negative. Even the two new teams - Gold Coast and West Sydney - they have been implemented well in my opinion and shows the ambition and unity that the AFL has. Comparing it to that other Australian league the NRL or the soccer leagues up here (who put club over sport) this is a real revelation! You should be proud and thankful of the sport you have, you genuinely should be. Most importantly on the pitch AFL is an exciting game, with the athletic players on the pitch needing to master a variety of skills (kicking, bouncing, handballing, obstructing, marking etc) and this impresses most first-time viewers (like myself a few years ago).

I think AFL has a very bright future and looking from the outside I think the game is being run well.

Football I feel is a juggernaut that seems to be eating itself up. I reckon Australia has nothing to fear, as the focus increasingly becomes stuck to the Champions League. I do still love Everton - there is too much history there - but I am one of the many people who are becoming disillusioned.

This is my opinion anyway, but I hope it's shed some light. Goodday."

can we get a tl;dr for this please?

 

[CotchNCo]

As bad as footy is these days, soccer is even more dogshit.

Both sports are great. I don't think footy is in as bad a state as people are mentioning here. Soccer will never overtake footy but it will continue to increase in popularity, which is fine.

Both sports can and will co-exist in the future.

 

[TiggerMan22]

can we get a tl;dr for this please?

We have it great with AFL. Players actually care about their clubs, all clubs have genuine chances for premierships, players actually interact with fans.
Soccer is all money driven, only a few clubs really have a chance for a premiership, players dont interact with or care about fans, clubs are run as business and owners only care about money.

Still worth a read. Only takes 2-3 mins. Shows that we still have it really good with AFL compared to other sports.

 

[Madtiger2006]

The game looks fine on tv. You can't even tell how many players are in the 50 and the game looks like it flows and scores are decent. I think the op just can't be bothered altogether. Major cop out. We do need to reduce the numbers in the 50 though for the viewers at the game. Must be a rule to keep the 6 backs(attacking team) and 6 forwards(opposition) out of the 50 at all times. Recruit 3 linesman for each end of the 50m arc. 12 linesman all up for each game. At one 50m where there are 3 linesman, 1 would take batch and chap, 1 would take Rance and hunt and the other would take Vlas and Houli while keeping an eye on rotations of any of these players. As for soccer, of course parents want their kids to play the safer sport

 

[TigerImposter]

I watched half of the first quarter yesterday and then turned off the TV to mow the lawn and walk the dog. Like most here I have followed Richmond all my life and played footy to my mid 20's, yet the first quarter was my breaking point. 36 players within 50m of the ball, endless contests and zero excitement. I have had enough. I nearly gave up last year after the first Sydney game but still stuck fat, however until the AFL shakes this game up I am over it and will only watch us play freer flowing teams. For the first time in my life I have something to be excited about with Richmond (was born in '81) except I am not.
Some of the issues are:
In only 5 games this year have both teams scored over 100 points
Lowest average scores since the 60's
Too much dilution of talent with 18 teams. This has seen more Athletes play who can get to contests, tackle, harrass but little else causing more stoppages and stopping the best players playing with flair
More turnovers and clangers than ever before due to the number of below AFL players playing
Expansion teams that will never ever make it, yet big clubs like ours are expected to subsidise them in perpetuity
Poorly run clubs like bulldogs and North get bailed out continually. No matter how many mistakes they make off the field, all at the expense of the well run
Politicisation of the AFL around left wing causes (Green round, Recognise round, boing Adam Goodes etc)
In my view it can all be sheeted home to 2 people Dometriou and Fitzpatrick and the cosy relationship between management and board. Seems Gil is sort of trying but cheaper pies ain't going to cut it.
My son and his friends are not interested in AFL. Now it does not worry me but I heard Rohan Connolly report the same thing about his son yesterday on radio. Auskick numbers are declining, crowds are declining and this game has serious issues. The game has ben whored out for TV rights dollars at the expense of its soul and I fear it will eventually have neither. When clubs like Geelong are now over $1 million below budgeted revenues and declining membership, when Brisbane have only 24K members after 25 years, When just 22K people watch 2 of the biggest clubs in the land play on a Friday night...
Appreciate much of this has already been discussed on this board but who else is worried about where AFL will be in 10 or 15 years time?

Fantastic post you have picked all the issues i have with AFL footy.
Grass roots footy is much more fun and entertaining.It's more like what VFL once used to be and you can touch the sacred turf and talk to players and coaches plus have a kick on the ground with the kids.
AFL footy is so boring now as you have stated and this is why I go three times a year.
With soccer's growth in Australia the AFL is at risk of no longer being the number one attraction.In Coburg alone three clubs have folded only to be replaced by soccer teams.The Moreland Zebras are booming from young boys and girls right up to seniors.
Auskick finished last week which was one month earlier this year(ffs) so i'm taking the boys to join up with the zebras i'm over it as soccer goes on almost all year round and his mates are playing soccer.We got 9 weeks of footy we felt like we weret scammed

 

[Tzatziki_Man]

I think for the first time in this games history, zones need to be considered. Forward players from one club can't enter the forward line of another, vice Versa, there must always be 4 players in both teams forward half at all times. Things like this could really stop the congestion around stoppages.

 

[Mr Magic]

I have to say I'm a passionate richmond and afl supporter. But I'm from a soccer background and I have played all my life.

Soccer is growing rapidly in this country but I don't think it will ever be the number 1 sport. The afl really need to start developing and investing in grass roots in this country. The facilities, the coaching is absolutely piss poor and you only get thru to the top level with your own personal talent and hard work.

Now let's look at soccer in Europe, and almost every club in the top leagues have an outstanding junior programme. Kids who get identified as early as 6 or 7 years old with potential get signed up by clubs. They get coached by professional coaches, they have amazing facilities, and most of all they have the opportunity to become the best they can. Time and time again clubs like Ajax from holland keep producing really good players that come thru the soccer academies.

I think soccer increasing growth and attractiveness as a spectator sport is being overplayed here.


If I was in Melbourne I would have seen the soccer match depending on cost.

A once off just to see Ronaldo in the flesh play.

Would I see it again? Probably not.

Well I flicked though it when they played to see the goals.

Honestly the only reason I watch the EPL at times is mainly due to punting interests.

Soccer on Friday night was pretty boring, actually more boring than Hawthorn and Carlton in the vision I saw.

For about 5-10 minutes I saw all the goals on the TV, half time replays etc.. except the first one and maybe the second and that was enough for me.

But the AFL game needs to go back to what it was whether that means less interchange rotations who knows.


I think there is less footballers and more athletes now which is not helping.


As for Soccer with big money etc.. you have to factor in the debt positions in Europe and USA, things could be very different in 50 years time!

I look at the FIFA politics and really its a sport riddled with politics I want little to do with. Far too power driven for me

 

[Nostradumbass]

I think soccer is being overplayed here.



.

How can a sport be overplayed? If people dos t like there wouldn't be the numbers they have.

Maybe we can get Pele out of retirement and put him in a flank?

 

[Mr Magic]

How can a sport be overplayed? If people dos t like there wouldn't be the numbers they have.

Maybe we can get Pele out of retirement and put him in a flank?

Sorry I did not realise what I was posting different to what I was thinking.

What I meant to post was I think the advance and success of Soccer in Australia, as well as its attractiveness as a spectator sport in Aust., is being overplayed here.

Nevertheless I am in the country sometimes in Canberra and maybe I am too removed from Soccers growth in the capital cities

 

[Nostradumbass]

Sorry I did not realise what I was posting different to what I was thinking.

What I meant to post was I think the advance and success of Soccer in Australia is being overplayed here.

Nevertheless I am in the country sometimes in Canberra and maybe I am too removed from Soccers growth in the capital cities

I doubt it'll take over from Football as the top sport here but I'd say a lot of people given the choice to play in the AFL or one of the top euro soccer leagues strictly from a financial point of view soccer wins hands down. Plus you could get a chance to play in a World Cup as opposed to playing against a few part timers in Ireland.

 

[Mr Magic]

I doubt it'll take over from Football as the top sport here but I'd say a lot of people given the choice to play in the AFL or one of the top euro soccer leagues strictly from a financial point of view soccer wins hands down. Plus you could get a chance to play in a World Cup as opposed to playing against a few part timers in Ireland.

Would not surprise me if many clubs go bankrupt in Europe as well as some basketball teams in USA etc over time.

The money they make just highlights there effect of advertising and how dumb some people are.

In Spain Real Madrid and Barcelona dominate revenue distribution and a lot of these clubs like Chelsea and Manchester City are funded by foreign power structures.

Even Man U had to get stock market investors in in the stock market.


Once the rubber hits the road for a lot of these countries funds will dry up and windfalls will drop off considerably IMO. Some have no idea of the indirect but related debt behind some of these revenues and asset build-ups

I just read that long post from the overseas Everton fan above. Bloody impressive post that was!

 

[smasha]

Can't stand having 30 odd players around the ball at stoppages. You'll get the odd free flowing passage of play but it's nothing like it used to be. I still love Richmond and always will but as a sport it's gone backwards. I absolutely despise the AFL commission, it's one giant incestuous organisation.

I still prefer this to the dark days when I cheered when our players landed one good tackle.

 

[Infamy]

I think for the first time in this games history, zones need to be considered. Forward players from one club can't enter the forward line of another, vice Versa, there must always be 4 players in both teams forward half at all times. Things like this could really stop the congestion around stoppages.

I'd prefer we looked at a bonus premiership point for scoring over 100 points before we look at changing the fundamentals of the game. Not just for the winning side either, if both teams score over 100 then both get a bonus point.
While it probably won't affect the ladder too much, especially for the top teams, it may be the difference for some teams of making the Top 4 or having the more attacking team get into the 8 over one that plays more negative football.

 

[Spagman]

The AFL at its worst is still streets ahead of Australian Soccer and Rugby.

The things i'd like to see addressed are;

Etihad Stadium's crap playing surface.
4:40PM games are a mistake. Bring in a permanent Thursday or Monday game instead and be done with it.
Umpiring has gone downhill. It's time for a massive rethink of how they go about their job and a retraining of all umpires. They need to be invisible, not this grand standing pompous bunch of clowns we have now.
Clarify the rules around holding the ball and incorrect disposal and get f**king consistent on it.
Ban the 3 man up ruck contests immediately.
The Television rights are a joke.
Food & drink prices are still a joke.
GWS may win a flag but will never be a well supported club. Are the other clubs and AFL meant to prop it up forever? Is GWS even financially viable short term, let along long term?
AFL admit that they should have expanded into Tasmania, which they'll never admit to.
Ditch the NAB cup.
Stop the flood, but designated player zones are NOT the answer (maybe?).. This constant sight where players break away but have no targets in front of them - then they have to stop and start kicking sideways - is a joke. Maybe the answer is 4 players always inside the 50m area? I don't know..

What i'd like to see the media do is;

Tone down the arse kissing.
Tone down the boys club mentality on radio and tv.
Keep AFL news to the back page.
Someone to really grow some balls and call the AFL out on issues like this.
Commentators to actually commentate instead of barracking.

That'd do for a start. No drastic, knee jerk reactions are required though I feel.