Bevan & NOG

[barry fu]

To slow of body and mind, skills don't help their cause either. The speed of todays game has passed them by, their courage and endeavour cannot be questioned but that is not enough anymore. Sorry lads but your separation certificate is in the mail. Time for Mod to have his chance.

 

[grimlock]

They might just have one footy brain between them. MAYBE.

 

[Jeffers]

Yep. The game has past them both. Doing us a shitload more harm then good.

 

[vonn]

I see we found our new whippin boy. (boys.. or should i say boyZ to get into the whole vonglish thing)

 

[barry fu]

As the famous Monty Python would say. Bring out your dead.
But i'm not dead yet.
Well you are now( THUMP ).

 

[Ed_Gein]

To slow of body and mind, skills don't help their cause either. The speed of todays game has passed them by, their courage and endeavour cannot be questioned but that is not enough anymore. Sorry lads but your separation certificate is in the mail. Time for Mod to have his chance.

I wonder what Brett Kirk would have to say about this! He wouldn't even be on our list if he didn't have the courage and passion he shows!

 

[potatomasher]

I wonder what Brett Kirk would have to say about this! He wouldn't even be on our list if he didn't have the courage and passion he shows!

But he is also a faster kick, a smarter footy player, and a magnificent tackler. His skills are hardly amazing, but they are better than Ablett's and Bevan's.

I was so excited about the changes we'd made to the team until I heard those late inclusions. Huge mistakes.

 

[BarneyBent]

Neither were horrible. NOG did enough to maintain some trade value. Would be useful for a team looking for a tagger. Bevo did OK, not great. I really want Roos to play him as a half forward for a whole match. He DOES make mistakes, so their impact need to be minimised, but he's good overhead for his size, and knows how to use his body. He could really help close down half forward and shut down the rebound off half back, and his occasional blue would not be as damaging up forward. Unfortunately, we just don't quite have the men down back to fully release him forward. Nick Smith is developing, but at the same time Crouch is failing, despite showing his old form a times. We should definitely look at Andrew Hooper or similar come draft time.

 

[liz]

Neither were horrible. NOG did enough to maintain some trade value. Would be useful for a team looking for a tagger. Bevo did OK, not great. I really want Roos to play him as a half forward for a whole match. He DOES make mistakes, so their impact need to be minimised, but he's good overhead for his size, and knows how to use his body. He could really help close down half forward and shut down the rebound off half back, and his occasional blue would not be as damaging up forward. Unfortunately, we just don't quite have the men down back to fully release him forward. Nick Smith is developing, but at the same time Crouch is failing, despite showing his old form a times. We should definitely look at Andrew Hooper or similar come draft time.

I thought Ablett brought some value to the team today - much better than last week. But yes, if we're going to march up the ladder in the next season or two, he's one who either needs to be replaced or improve tenfold.

Bevan, on the other hand, was pretty ordinary. I still rate him as a player and he was very good for most of last season. But confidence wise he must be well down at the moment.

Smith did superbly well as a small defender today but I'm not sure that's his best position long term. He doesn't have the body for it at senior level right now, but in the reserves his work at contests is the most impressive. We need to get him alongside Bird, Hannebury et al at centre bounces in the teams of 2011 onwards.

 

[Ed_Gein]

Smith did superbly well as a small defender today but I'm not sure that's his best position long term. He doesn't have the body for it at senior level right now, but in the reserves his work at contests is the most impressive. We need to get him alongside Bird, Hannebury et al at centre bounces in the teams of 2011 onwards.

Perhaps a Kirk type role ensues after Kirk retires perhaps? I think Smith is terrific and could suit the role Kirk does at the moment very well. Great defensively and can use the ball well when he has it.

 

[SM]

Bevan didn't do too much today, and not sure why he was brought back in for Pyke.

 

[bungee]

To slow of body and mind, skills don't help their cause either. The speed of todays game has passed them by, their courage and endeavour cannot be questioned but that is not enough anymore. Sorry lads but your separation certificate is in the mail. Time for Mod to have his chance.

Sheeesh, a bad game and it's 'shoot the man'. Bevan is one of the bravest bastards I've ever seen. Sheer guts. He's also a very good footballer when his game's on.

Both he and NOG put their bodies on the line every time they play. They cop a punishing load of injuries for doing it but, when fully fit, they're both handy inclusions in the team.

Look, the purpose of playing young players is to dig out some who may be ready for seniors, it's not to throw out the old team and put in a team of kids. NOG negates other players well and gets a bit of the ball himself. He's a bit like Ben Matthews, whom so many criticised yet Goodes himself named him in the top 22 Swans players of all time ! Not flash, not always clean but unselfish, hard as nails and doing the team thing. That's what got us a flag.

 

[barry fu]

Sheeesh, a bad game and it's 'shoot the man'. Bevan is one of the bravest bastards I've ever seen. Sheer guts. He's also a very good footballer when his game's on.

Both he and NOG put their bodies on the line every time they play. They cop a punishing load of injuries for doing it but, when fully fit, they're both handy inclusions in the team.

Look, the purpose of playing young players is to dig out some who may be ready for seniors, it's not to throw out the old team and put in a team of kids. NOG negates other players well and gets a bit of the ball himself. He's a bit like Ben Matthews, whom so many criticised yet Goodes himself named him in the top 22 Swans players of all time ! Not flash, not always clean but unselfish, hard as nails and doing the team thing. That's what got us a flag.

I for one am certainly not questioning their courage or commitment, just their overall game. Kirk, B1,Teddy, Jack amoungst others also show this quality of putting themselves in harms way for the swans, but more than that part of a players game is needed. As you say One bad game yes, but bookend by many others over a period not just of late. A bad quater it's possible for the team to recover but a whole game, usely it is not so. Ben Matthews was a fine footballer in his right role and Goodes duly put him in his team but could find no place for either NOG or Bevan as i think can the swans afford too in the overall scheme of things. The baby an the bath water are certainly not in question only Bevan and NOG's overall value too the team and the capacity to help us achieve our next flag.

 

[Swans120]

Smith and Shaw are quite capable of taking the smaller defenders for the time being (even if long term Smith's role will be in the middle) which takes away the real need for Bevo to play down there. I'm a huge fan of Bevo, one of my favourites, and i really wanna see him play consistently up forward. He was getting quite a bit of the ball down back early today and looked pretty good really. But i think the forward line is the place for him atm.

NOG wasnt horrible at all today really, was interesting seeing him play up forward, hasnt done that since he first came in to the senior team in about '02-'03. Unfortunately i dont see a great future in the team for him, so i'd rather see a young player get an opportunity in his stead. Assuming injuries do not hit them over the last few weeks, Schmidt, Laidlaw, Thornton, DOK (to give him a chance to show himself). Even guys like Moore and Mal i would prefer to see in the seniors team. I know it is harsh on a guy like Ablett who has given his all for us and was a member of our flag, but he is not adding enough to the team for a senior player to constitute holding his spot, IMO.

 

[MushroomRocket]

if bevan cant play on small forwards then throw him in the middle and make him tackle tackle tackle.

dempster should never have been traded he would done a better job than bevan. maybe move a rookie like brabazon to half back and see what happens.

bevan is too slow but he can still win clearances and that will take a bit of pressure away from jude bolton

 

[Dangas]

Yer NoG is past it

 

[disgruntled goat]

Sheeesh, a bad game and it's 'shoot the man'. Bevan is one of the bravest bastards I've ever seen. Sheer guts. He's also a very good footballer when his game's on.

Both he and NOG put their bodies on the line every time they play. They cop a punishing load of injuries for doing it but, when fully fit, they're both handy inclusions in the team.

Look, the purpose of playing young players is to dig out some who may be ready for seniors, it's not to throw out the old team and put in a team of kids. NOG negates other players well and gets a bit of the ball himself. He's a bit like Ben Matthews, whom so many criticised yet Goodes himself named him in the top 22 Swans players of all time ! Not flash, not always clean but unselfish, hard as nails and doing the team thing. That's what got us a flag.

Loyalty is one thing, but you can't keep playing blokes in seniors just because they're brave. I reckon I'd be brave enough to have a crack at AFL football, but I'd be a shit player, not to even mention the utter lack of fitness.

Bevan and Ablett have been remarkably brave soldiers for the club, but Ablett has not played a full four quarters of good football for a long time, and Bevan's form has faded in the past few weeks.

Essendon sent a club legend in Scott Lucas back to seconds; Nic Stevens is in Carlton's twos. Both are paying for poor form, as is Buchanan at Sydney now.

I believe Bevan still has heaps to offer, but might need a stint in seconds to fire him up.

Unfortunately, I don't know if Ablett will be able to get back to any worthwhile senior standard.

 

[Swanee]

I think you are being unfair on both players. I've never been a strong supporter of Ablett but I think his game yesterday was ok, not great, but not bad. As for Bevan, i've always been a fan and my opinion hasn't changed. He is couragious, and not all players are super quick. What he lacks there he makes up for in courage. In yesterdays game I remember his attempt to catch one player failed, but that Blues player is one of the quickest on their team. At that stage of the game, all Swans players had run out of legs, not just Bevan.

 

[Bonz]

I think its a bit unfair to compare them both to Buchanan his an outright hack...

And I still rate Bevan I jsut want him played in a forward role his courage is exceptional

NOG had a pretty traumatic start to the year (Family death) and If I recall correctly I think he had an pretty injury interrupted season

 

[damn fool]

Nog's time is up IMO. He hasnt done much for the past 3 years. And he should be in his prime right now.

Bevan is still handy. Like others, a go up forward wouldnt hurt.

 

[Ed_Gein]

Nog's time is up IMO. He hasnt done much for the past 3 years. And he should be in his prime right now.

Bevan is still handy. Like others, a go up forward wouldnt hurt.

In a nutshell i agree. I've always though Ablett was servicable though without being spectacular in any way. One irk i've always had with him though, is when he is in a 'crowded' situation his first intention before he gets the ball is to always slam it on the boot up the field rather than think it through first.

 

[Caj]

Think Ablett's career stats say alot about him

Career Highs
Career Highs
Disposals 28 v Essendon, 5th Aug 2006
Kicks 20 v Essendon, 5th Aug 2006
Handballs 13 v Port Adelaide, 24th May 2009
Marks 8 v Brisbane, 9th Apr 2005
Goals 2 v Port Adelaide, 20th May 2007 *
Tackles 9 v Fremantle, 25th Apr 2009
Hitouts 5 v Geelong, 30th Jun 2007

Despite being a permanent onballer has never had 30 dsiposals in a game, nor has he offered anything offensively with a career high of 2 goals

Before anyone chips in with a comment about his bullocking and defensive work, I point them in the direction of Jude Bolton who plays a similar role yet manages to offer alot more offensively than Ablett ever has

Must be the luckiest bloke on an AFL list regularly getting a game

 

[Swanee]

Think Ablett's career stats say alot about him

Despite being a permanent onballer has never had 30 dsiposals in a game, nor has he offered anything offensively with a career high of 2 goals

Before anyone chips in with a comment about his bullocking and defensive work, I point them in the direction of Jude Bolton who plays a similar role yet manages to offer alot more offensively than Ablett ever has

Must be the luckiest bloke on an AFL list regularly getting a game

The reason - His name is Ablett!

 

[BIGBEZ]

Think Ablett's career stats say alot about him

Career Highs
Career Highs
Disposals 28 v Essendon, 5th Aug 2006
Kicks 20 v Essendon, 5th Aug 2006
Handballs 13 v Port Adelaide, 24th May 2009
Marks 8 v Brisbane, 9th Apr 2005
Goals 2 v Port Adelaide, 20th May 2007 *
Tackles 9 v Fremantle, 25th Apr 2009
Hitouts 5 v Geelong, 30th Jun 2007

Despite being a permanent onballer has never had 30 dsiposals in a game, nor has he offered anything offensively with a career high of 2 goals

Before anyone chips in with a comment about his bullocking and defensive work, I point them in the direction of Jude Bolton who plays a similar role yet manages to offer alot more offensively than Ablett ever has

Must be the luckiest bloke on an AFL list regularly getting a game

Abletts defensive and bullocking work is great and very valuable to our team as is Judes, and im very surprised at comments in this thread, obviously pimple nosed dreamteamers and supercoaches that go by stats and dont understand good old fashioned in and under football!

 

[BarneyBent]

Abletts defensive and bullocking work is great and very valuable to our team as is Judes, and im very surprised at comments in this thread, obviously pimple nosed dreamteamers and supercoaches that go by stats and dont understand good old fashioned in and under football!

I agree with this. The problem is, we have too many defensive bullockers. Kirk, Bolton, Jack, even O'Keefe all play this role (just have a look at O'Keefe's contested possession, clearance and tackle counts this year). Even McVeigh still sometimes plays as an offensively-minded tagger. Ablett doesn't fit into the side anymore, at least not in his traditional role. He has been tried as an extractor, with little success. He has been tried up forward, also with little success. At his best, he is like a wrecking ball, breaking things up and forcing a contest whenever the opposition look like taking possession, even if he's not the one who wins the stat in the end, but there's no room for him in that role any more. What he needs is a trade to a side that DOES need that sort of player.