Big Ben

[Fall Out Boy]

First quarter against the hapless Bulls:

8 points on 4-5 shooting, 11 rebounds and 1 assist.

The boy is legit.

 

[MadEagle]

DAMN STRAIGHT!

 

[jod23]

I still think Ron Ron has his nose in front for DPOTY though.

 

[Yze_Magic]

I love Wallace, but he shiould never have won DPOY

Blocked shots dont mean good defense

Artest or Kirilenko will win it this year

 

[thehardaway]

Originally posted by Yze_Magic
I love Wallace, but he shiould never have won DPOY

I swear you get stupider with every post

 

[Fall Out Boy]

Originally posted by thehardaway
I swear you get stupider with every post

Is that possible?

 

[Fall Out Boy]

Originally posted by Yze_Magic
I love Wallace, but he shiould never have won DPOY

Blocked shots dont mean good defense

Obviously missed the enormous rebounding numbers, and freakish steal numbers.

That or you're just an idiot.

 

[thehardaway]

Originally posted by phatandphreaky
Is that possible?

Apparently

 

[Fall Out Boy]

Originally posted by jod23
I still think Ron Ron has his nose in front for DPOTY though.

More then just his nose.

 

[Thewlis Dish]

There's a great article by Marc Stein (oxymoron?) on ESPN about the best defenders, and how the rebounders and shotblockers like Wallace, Duncan, Mutombo always get more credit then perimeter defenders, like Artest, Bowen and Christie. Points out that only once has a perimeter player (GP) won the award in 12 years or something.

I agree, someone like Big Ben is a fantastic help defender, but he doesn't cover nearly as much territory as someone like Artest on the defensive end, and doesn't take the oppositions best scorer every night. he is able to stay down low, move from block to block and concentrate on rebounding and blocking, while the best eprimeter guys will chase all night.

 

[Yze_Magic]

Originally posted by Petrie Dish
There's a great article by Marc Stein (oxymoron?) on ESPN about the best defenders, and how the rebounders and shotblockers like Wallace, Duncan, Mutombo always get more credit then perimeter defenders, like Artest, Bowen and Christie. Points out that only once has a perimeter player (GP) won the award in 12 years or something.

I agree, someone like Big Ben is a fantastic help defender, but he doesn't cover nearly as much territory as someone like Artest on the defensive end, and doesn't take the oppositions best scorer every night. he is able to stay down low, move from block to block and concentrate on rebounding and blocking, while the best eprimeter guys will chase all night.

Exactly


try telling that to PhatandFaggy and theHardaway



they think good numbers equals good defense


So much to learn the little tackers

 

[Fall Out Boy]

Originally posted by Yze_Magic
PhatandFaggy

How very lame, troll boy.

Typical lack of maturity from BigFooty's resident laughing stock.

 

[Portmanteau]

When it all comes down to it, the only stats that really matter, are points (and FG%, i.e. productivity), assists and turnovers. I mean, you don't get a stat for defensive hustle which may make a shot miss, but you get a stat for blocking one. Doesn't tell the whole picture. I know we're talking defense, but today for example, Carmelo pulls off a freakish move to blow past Dice on the baseline, and then the Suns get a break and an open jumper. Those two points are worth exactly the same amount. But there wasn't a stat to show that zero Denver players exerted any pressure on said jumpshot.

Anyway, that is my rant, not entirely relevant to the discussion, but I need to get it off my chest

 

[thehardaway]

Originally posted by Yze_Magic
Exactly
try telling that to PhatandFaggy and theHardaway
they think good numbers equals good defense
So much to learn the little tackers

Yes. I look only at the numbers and nothing else. There is no point me downloading whatever video footage of games I can. No point reading articles on every team. No point listening to games over the Net. No point getting friends to tape the games for me. I know nothing. Thank you for teaching me oh Tragic one. I see the error of my ways. I will not look at Ben Hanlogten's 10 mins per game and 4 points, and think he is not worthy on an average team. I will ignore Big Ben's stats, and ignore the other stuff he does (deflections, altered shots) and not count him as a defensive presence. I will ignore the fact that in 2001 (a year Ron Ron played "only" 55 games) Wallace picked up 96% of the first place votes for DPOTY (as they must be wrong). I will ignore the fact the Detroit is a defensive orientated team that rarely gives up over 100 points.

I have seen the error of my ways. Please show me who in 2001 deserved the DPOTY that Ben "should never have won". I will then agree with your almight knowledge. My sincere apologies to jod23, as apparently we have a new guru

 

[Red_Devil]

Originally posted by phatandphreaky
How very lame, troll boy.

Typical lack of maturity from BigFooty's resident laughing stock.

HAHAHAHAHA, you made yourslef look like the biggest tossa then. How bloody often do you call him Yze_Tragic? Your calling him immature, why don't you take your own advice.

Having said that, I usualy respect the stuff you post on here, unlike Yze's posting. But jeez, could you have been any more hypocritical there?

BTW, does anyone know why Wallace has only played 20 minutes against Toronto? I think he played nearly all of them in the first half, I hope he hasn't gone down with an injury, hopefully there just resting him

Anyone know anything?

Hopefully there just resting him.

 

[Fall Out Boy]

Originally posted by Red_Devil_04
HAHAHAHAHA, you made yourslef look like the biggest tossa then. How bloody often do you call him Yze_Tragic? Your calling him immature, why don't you take your own advice.

Ah, he is well known as Yze_Tragic around here, hardly something i came up with on the spot.

Calling someone tragic is hardly comparable to labelling someone a ******.

Originally posted by Red_Devil_04

BTW, does anyone know why Wallace has only played 20 minutes against Toronto? I think he played nearly all of them in the first half, I hope he hasn't gone down with an injury, hopefully there just resting him

Anyone know anything?

Hopefully there just resting him.

Haven't heard anything, but given how tight the match was, i doubt they would have rested him. Very unusual.

 

[thehardaway]

Ben Wallace was ejected late in the first half for arguing with an official about a call, then lightly kicking the basketball down the court. He became upset when he was called for a charge.

 

[jod23]

Perimeter players dont get enough respect period. GP, Jordan and I think Robertson are the only perimeter guys to have ever won it. Artest though will soon be among those names. He just has to win it this season.

 

[thehardaway]

I don't this guy could have done much more against Atlanta today. Missed a 5x5 by 1 steal

14 pts, 15 boards, 5 assists, 4 steals 5 blocks