Class Warfare

[Ratts of Tobruk]

Good lord.

The above chat about what contemporary businesses do pretty much confirms a few people's suspicions about how many BF regulars don't work! But let's be generous and assume a fair few 'work from home'.

 

[kwikfix]

If a wage earner wishes to claim some sort of tax deduction for any work-related expenses, they are expected to provide receipts/invoices/documentation, and rightly so. But when it comes to business....particularly big businesses (especially Multinationals)....they hire teams of lawyers and accountants to muddy the waters. If big business want to make absurd deductions, or just not pay any tax to begin with - can we ask them questions? Good Lord, no....that would be too invasive. The way big businesses dodge tax and dictate terms to our Governments is beyond a joke. And the Government departments that oversee these regulations and any potential fraud/misconduct are next to useless. Just take a look here for an example:



If Multinationals want to take their business elsewhere, but still sell to Australia, no problem - just slap a huge Tariff on any goods they sell to us. Simple. It isn't Communism, it's common sense. I can guarantee you our local businesses that have to compete with these greedy corporations won't be complaining.
If there's one thing that we need to put an end to that would help sort out this ridiculous mess, it's this:

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2016/05/23/4465448.htm

 

[Ratts of Tobruk]

Not bad for Murray. He didn't do the childish thing of blaming it on the poor, like so many right-wingers do. He is a bit childish in pretending not to know what public servants do, or what rules they fly under, and of course the criticism about Labor is ridiculous, seeing as they're the ones who bring in asset-tests yet Murray claims they would use such ideas as a scare tactic.

He also missed one thing out of saying it's about "spending and avoidance in the tax system". "Avoidance in the tax system" is a euphamism for revenue.

 

[Generalissimo]

So if someone wants corporations and billionaires to pay their taxes, or wants to be able to buy a home, or wants the environment protected for the sake of their kids, that's class warfare.

But getting young people to work for a pittance (or nothing at all), sending debt collectors after poor people over nonexistent debts, and permanently imprisoning refugee children in tropical gulags, that's somehow not class warfare. Riiiiight.

 

[Rear Admiral]

I've never heard of this bloke before, but an outstanding video.

If you want to find the people that are doing all this tax-dodging.....start with the top earners ($$$), then work your way down. Those on low incomes don't get so much as a brass razoo, when it comes to tax cuts. Those at the bottom are struggling to get by from week to week, let alone consider any investments.

If you want to put an end to this nonsense that's mentioned in this video (or at least most of it), start with getting rid of Negative Gearing and the insane reductions in CGT (Capital Gains Tax). That may not get rid of all the rorts in the public service that were stated in this video, but it'll sure-as-schitt go a long way toward getting middle/upper income Australians to start paying their fair share of Tax. This tax-dodging arse-hattery we're seeing now is a direct result of the Howard-Costello Government "reforms", and now we're reaping the bullschitt that those idiots sowed. To those that spruik Howard/Costello as "our saviours" - they were riding the wave of the mining boom, where they were throwing money around like drunken sailors in a brothel....except they were doing it via ridiculous tax cuts to high-5/6-figure salary earners.
I once saw a program where a big part of the discussion focused on income and distribution of wealth. What this one panelist said absolutely hit the nail right on the head:

"Capital accrues."

It's the most obvious things that are standing right in front of us that slip under the radar. What people don't understand is that an economy....any economy....is finite, in terms of how much money there is to go around. So the more any one group accumulates, the less there is for other people - plain and simple. And because of the fact that Capital accrues - when people get rich, our current system allows these people to use their accumulated wealth to accumulate even more wealth, leaving more and more people destitute. I don't blame the people who use this system to their advantage, as they're acting within the law. But the d*ckheads that put this legislation in place should be hauled before the Courts for what they've done. The only grander piece of economic idiocy was the Baby Bonus, by none other than "guess who?" - The Right and Honourable John Winston Howard.

We're copying America, where we're a decade or so behind where they are as an economy. If we don't massively rejig our economy, this is what we're heading for in decades to come:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1699767/

I can hardly wait.

https: // youtu.be/je21moJbMhg

 

[DaRick]

We're copying America, where we're a decade or so behind where they are as an economy. If we don't massively rejig our economy, this is what we're heading for in decades to come:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1699767/

I can hardly wait.

https: // youtu.be/je21moJbMhg

I would also add that Australia ATM is shooting for something like this:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/

So basically, they're going for a dumbed-down, uneducated, poverty-stricken populace who will swallow any swill, no matter how much it goes against their own interests.

 

[Rear Admiral]

I would also add that Australia ATM is shooting for something like this:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/

So basically, they're going for a dumbed-down, uneducated, poverty-stricken populace who will swallow any swill, no matter how much it goes against their own interests.

Absolutely 101% spot on . This is mainly because Australia is without a doubt the #1 country in the world, when it comes to APATHY. We live by the attitude:

"Yeah, whatever....she'll be right mate ."

But it won't be right, at least not for the vast majority of us. In the US, Europe, and pretty much every developed country other than Australia (and many poorer countries that are trying to step up)....people write to their politicians and take to the streets. There are a few of us Aussies that do this, but in general, sweet f*ck all Aussie citizens step up. There are heaps of public action/petitioning organisations, and they do make a difference - you only need to do an Internet search. The problem is, too many people forever repeating the same bullsh*t like:

"Oh, there's nothing we can do.....nothing will ever change."

People just use those sorts of comments as an excuse for their own apathy and laziness. When lots of people write to their MP's to make a change or they'll get voted out....you'd better believe they sit up and take notice. But this government banks on the very fact that most Aussies are exactly like you mentioned in your post above.

I'm looking forward to the day when the government tries to take away Medicare and Centrelink....if they succeed in that, then we'll see chaos in the streets like nothing this world has ever seen. Perhaps then people will scratch their head and realise it's worth writing to their MP's.

 

[Rear Admiral]

Agree, the VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers.

-vs-

I would think it would be hard to find a large scale company that doesn't have a corporate social responsibility aspect.

Yes, they are there to make money but they have to also attract, hire and retain people.

Agreed, personally will happily pay money to help others upskill and be educated. I work for a large Australian national company (just recently expanded overseas), they've paid for my diploma's. For others they've paid for degrees and MBA's. Big business has the resources to do this so I believe their is a good opportunity in medium and small business go 50/50 in education costs with government .

No offence meant....

But what you've said in the first quote at the top pretty much contradicts what you've mentioned in the next three quotes.

If most Aussie businesses and government departments were making the effort to train and up-skill our own population, we wouldn't need to sort out the absolute mess of our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies. But the exact opposite is true.

Australia's current Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker legislation is an absolute joke. Granted, there are some positions that cannot be filled locally (particularly jobs that require multilingual workers), but these represent the vast minority. I've lost count of the number of businesses (both big and small) that I've walked into where an enormous proportion of the staff are not Australian-born; our service industries are absolutely flooded with foreign workers. We're bringing in foreign workers by the truckload, all because it's bl**dy well cheaper for our businesses. Why?

1. They often pay foreign workers less.
2. Foreign workers rarely join Unions and don't ask questions, as they're terrified of being deported.
3. In the rare instances Aussie workers do lack the skills to fill a very small proportion of jobs in Australia, our businesses and our government don't want to fork out the money to train/up-skill our own population. Instead, they'd rather import ready-to-go workers off the shelf, often for much lower wages.

If an Australian business advertises jobs, and a number of Australian applicants apply for those jobs, there is no assurances or legislation in place (that I'm aware of) that assures those applicants are considered before the business turns to foreign applicants. To make matters worse, I've heard from some foreign workers that many Australian businesses advertise directly overseas, without advertising in Australia.

While I utterly despise racism and openly embrace multiculturalism, what's going on with our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies is beyond ridiculous. Just after WW2 (and earlier), there was good reason to have high levels of immigration, but those days are long, long gone. You only need to do an Internet search to see how much of a joke our Foreign Visa Worker policies are.

I'm not saying that no Australian businesses educate/upskill any of their employees, as I'm certain that some of them do. But if you look at the overall trend, it's pretty rare that our businesses do this. If you disagree, then why then do our "VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers"?

What it boils down to is the simple fact that most Australian businesses could not give a rat's a.r.s.e about anything except their own bottom line, and any notions of "social responsibility" are pretty much public relations lip service, and little else.

 

[Rear Admiral]

Deposits are a bit different though. While they don't directly stimulate the economy they are the cheapest source of finance for lenders, and therefore (if banks were asctually competitive) for borrowers including small business and primary producers. In that respect they stimulate the economy indirectly. Yet, we tax income on deposits as income tax with no deductions (which is fair enough, and in some ways is a tax on wealth as they higher deposit the higher the tax by potentially going into the next bracket for some of those earnings).

I understand what you're saying above....but don't understand what you're saying in this second part below -

High property, and leasing, prices do not. Yet, we give big tax breaks to this.

The last bit below? Huge issue. Monumentous.

The tax base is a big issue, and wealth may be a part of that. The shifting of corporate revenues offshore, and tax free revenue for non-charitable works of non-profits, are others.

 

[Rear Admiral]

At no point in my life have I pre funded my education. Either government paid or my work place paid.

Then you would be one of the very, very few and privileged.

HECS? That isn't a big warm and fuzzy gift; it still means you have to pay....once you're earning over a threshold level.

 

[Power Raid]

-vs-







No offence meant....

But what you've said in the first quote at the top pretty much contradicts what you've mentioned in the next three quotes.

If most Aussie businesses and government departments were making the effort to train and up-skill our own population, we wouldn't need to sort out the absolute mess of our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies. But the exact opposite is true.

Australia's current Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker legislation is an absolute joke. Granted, there are some positions that cannot be filled locally (particularly jobs that require multilingual workers), but these represent the vast minority. I've lost count of the number of businesses (both big and small) that I've walked into where an enormous proportion of the staff are not Australian-born; our service industries are absolutely flooded with foreign workers. We're bringing in foreign workers by the truckload, all because it's bl**dy well cheaper for our businesses. Why?

1. They often pay foreign workers less.
2. Foreign workers rarely join Unions and don't ask questions, as they're terrified of being deported.
3. In the rare instances Aussie workers do lack the skills to fill a very small proportion of jobs in Australia, our businesses and our government don't want to fork out the money to train/up-skill our own population. Instead, they'd rather import ready-to-go workers off the shelf, often for much lower wages.

If an Australian business advertises jobs, and a number of Australian applicants apply for those jobs, there is no assurances or legislation in place (that I'm aware of) that assures those applicants are considered before the business turns to foreign applicants. To make matters worse, I've heard from some foreign workers that many Australian businesses advertise directly overseas, without advertising in Australia.

While I utterly despise racism and openly embrace multiculturalism, what's going on with our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies is beyond ridiculous. Just after WW2 (and earlier), there was good reason to have high levels of immigration, but those days are long, long gone. You only need to do an Internet search to see how much of a joke our Foreign Visa Worker policies are.

I'm not saying that no Australian businesses educate/upskill any of their employees, as I'm certain that some of them do. But if you look at the overall trend, it's pretty rare that our businesses do this. If you disagree, then why then do our "VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers"?

What it boils down to is the simple fact that most Australian businesses could not give a rat's a.r.s.e about anything except their own bottom line, and any notions of "social responsibility" are pretty much public relations lip service, and little else.

I'm sure if you sat around a board table you would know that wasn't true. I'm not suggesting there aren't shit employers but the majority of people on this planet have a kind heart.

If you have a shit employer, can I suggest you look for a job with a smaller business, with a smaller high performance team with a growth agenda.

 

[DaRick]

Absolutely 101% spot on . This is mainly because Australia is without a doubt the #1 country in the world, when it comes to APATHY. We live by the attitude:

"Yeah, whatever....she'll be right mate ."

But it won't be right, at least not for the vast majority of us. In the US, Europe, and pretty much every developed country other than Australia (and many poorer countries that are trying to step up)....people write to their politicians and take to the streets. There are a few of us Aussies that do this, but in general, sweet f*ck all Aussie citizens step up. There are heaps of public action/petitioning organisations, and they do make a difference - you only need to do an Internet search. The problem is, too many people forever repeating the same bullsh*t like:

"Oh, there's nothing we can do.....nothing will ever change."

People just use those sorts of comments as an excuse for their own apathy and laziness. When lots of people write to their MP's to make a change or they'll get voted out....you'd better believe they sit up and take notice. But this government banks on the very fact that most Aussies are exactly like you mentioned in your post above.

I'm looking forward to the day when the government tries to take away Medicare and Centrelink....if they succeed in that, then we'll see chaos in the streets like nothing this world has ever seen. Perhaps then people will scratch their head and realise it's worth writing to their MP's.

I agree that Australians are too apathetic and easy-going for their own good. This particularly applies to the younger generations, who IMO have had it worse than the boomers in many respects. Most boomers at least came of age during a time of full employment, whereas the job market for Gen X and particularly Y has been considerably worse.

Others are just ignorant. I used to be like this. I once voted LNP simply because the ALP at the time were completely dysfunctional. Only later did I realise what a folly that was.

However, my own brother's rather futile experiences RE complaining to his local member have persuaded me that only groups of people working together can really make a difference, not the actions of a few independent-thinking lone wolves.

The question is, how would we persuade people to team up? Educating them about the issues might help to a degree. We also need to explain to them what will probably happen to them or their children if they don't try and change the status quo and work from there. Invariably some would dismiss you, but a few might listen.

Maybe we need to target people whom have already been disenfranchised because they can relate more personally to the effects of a bad economy - maybe professionals who've been laid off and forced to work at a Centrelink-subsidised job* (like my father in the mid-90's).

*On another note, I find it despicable that companies and corporations should effectively be allowed to lean on Centrelink by not paying their employees enough to live on. You also see this crap in America with companies like Walmart and McDonalds (who used to tell their employees how to get on welfare ).

 

[Rear Admiral]

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/txt/s4176764.htm

Download: http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/vodcast/qanda_2015_ep05.mp4

From the Transcript:

MIRIAM MARGOLYES: No, of course you've got to tax people and I don't understand why people are so frightened of being taxed. People like me who earn more than most others, we've got to pay taxes. I'm on your side. I vote for you but I want to see a bit more courage and spunk from you. The reason why everybody - why money is not trickling down, Rae, is because we live in a capitalist system and capital accrues and that's why and it may not be palatable to everybody but that is the reason and so you have to fight that by stringent taxes. I'm prepared to pay. I have never denied paying taxes. I have never avoided taxes. I don't go in for any of the schemes. We have to - if you earn, you've got to pay and that keeps Australia nice and clean and healthy and gives people decent education and that's what you've got to do. Put up the taxes.

TONY JONES: We’re talking about intergenerational inequity. And, of course, if you were of a generation that had a cheap house that became a very expensive house, you now have the equity to buy investment properties and, of course, that’s what’s happening. Most of the properties now are being bought by investors in this huge boom at the moment. Do you think something should be done about that?

-------

What Miriam stated above is spot on. Sort out that sh*t above, then you'll fix most of what Paul Murray is talking about in that video.

 

[Power Raid]

The only organisations that I have been involved with that don't have a strong community focus and a desire to give back was the ADF. Every other entity focuses on employee well being, family well being and community.

I know not every entity is like that but I dare say the majority are very keen to be socially responsible.

.......the PM

Firstly in reply to your PM, thanks.

As per the comment being over the top, I can only comment on my experience. Before I go into the negative, I loved my time in the ADF. The ADF provided me a ticket out of Adelaide, a free haircut, bought time to understand what I wanted out of life, paid OK money and an opportunity to travel the world to bang chicks. The last item reflects where my head was at and what was important to me back then.

The ADF was also supportive of training, education and development in words but not action. I had to scratch bite and cheat to get what common sense and fairness should deliver.

Sadly where it falls down in the ADF is jealous, lazy and ignorant management systems.

An example of the lunacy in management was a mechanic (stoker) wanted time off to be there for his first born. His management rejected his leave application despite having 5 stokers more than ships requirements and the ship's trip was only a three day sea trial. Management said he needed to harden up and think about what would happen in the time of war.

Fortunately the ship's crew supported the stoker and put grease in the propeller casing meaning we turned back to port after an hour at sea. FTR The resultant damage, laid the ship up for 9 months and ultimately the ship was decommissioned because of the damage.

I faired a little better but the above highlights how you had to manipulate the system to achieve common sense.

The other stand out issue is the ADF actively seeked to ensure their training programs were not recognised by civilian authorities or if they were, they were looked down upon as inferior.

but a least is was good for banging chicks.

 

[Power Raid]

I agree that Australians are too apathetic and easy-going for their own good. This particularly applies to the younger generations, who IMO have had it worse than the boomers in many respects. Most boomers at least came of age during a time of full employment, whereas the job market for Gen X and particularly Y has been considerably worse.

Others are just ignorant. I used to be like this. I once voted LNP simply because the ALP at the time were completely dysfunctional. Only later did I realise what a folly that was.

However, my own brother's rather futile experiences RE complaining to his local member have persuaded me that only groups of people working together can really make a difference, not the actions of a few independent-thinking lone wolves.

The question is, how would we persuade people to team up? Educating them about the issues might help to a degree. We also need to explain to them what will probably happen to them or their children if they don't try and change the status quo and work from there. Invariably some would dismiss you, but a few might listen.

Maybe we need to target people whom have already been disenfranchised because they can relate more personally to the effects of a bad economy - maybe professionals who've been laid off and forced to work at a Centrelink-subsidised job* (like my father in the mid-90's).

*On another note, I find it despicable that companies and corporations should effectively be allowed to lean on Centrelink by not paying their employees enough to live on. You also see this crap in America with companies like Walmart and McDonalds (who used to tell their employees how to get on welfare ).

For me the answer is in this post. The Libs are shit, Labor are shit and the alternatives are even shittier.

The idea of a movement is also shit, just look at the corrupt unions. Religions are also a movement and other than beheading people or rooting kids, depending on the religion of choice, they don't seem to have addressed the issue.

I'm also not a big advocate of going it alone, as the reality is "any one person" is useless in the scheme of building anything great.

The answer is then obvious...........surround yourself with good people and get great mentors.

 

[WCE1987]

Then you would be one of the very, very few and privileged.

HECS? That isn't a big warm and fuzzy gift; it still means you have to pay....once you're earning over a threshold level.

HECS is the best loan you'll ever have in only raises with CPI, and then comes out pre-tax
FWIW I don't think I did anything special all I did was TAFE which was tax deductible as it related to my job, stay in my work place (generic retail business) as they had training opportunities to study certified Certificates and Diplomas, went to UNI via Mature age entrance to get a double degree and slapped it on HECS.

 

[WCE1987]

-vs-

No offence meant....

But what you've said in the first quote at the top pretty much contradicts what you've mentioned in the next three quotes.

If most Aussie businesses and government departments were making the effort to train and up-skill our own population, we wouldn't need to sort out the absolute mess of our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies. But the exact opposite is true.

Australia's current Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker legislation is an absolute joke. Granted, there are some positions that cannot be filled locally (particularly jobs that require multilingual workers), but these represent the vast minority. I've lost count of the number of businesses (both big and small) that I've walked into where an enormous proportion of the staff are not Australian-born; our service industries are absolutely flooded with foreign workers. We're bringing in foreign workers by the truckload, all because it's bl**dy well cheaper for our businesses. Why?

1. They often pay foreign workers less.
2. Foreign workers rarely join Unions and don't ask questions, as they're terrified of being deported.
3. In the rare instances Aussie workers do lack the skills to fill a very small proportion of jobs in Australia, our businesses and our government don't want to fork out the money to train/up-skill our own population. Instead, they'd rather import ready-to-go workers off the shelf, often for much lower wages.

If an Australian business advertises jobs, and a number of Australian applicants apply for those jobs, there is no assurances or legislation in place (that I'm aware of) that assures those applicants are considered before the business turns to foreign applicants. To make matters worse, I've heard from some foreign workers that many Australian businesses advertise directly overseas, without advertising in Australia.

While I utterly despise racism and openly embrace multiculturalism, what's going on with our Immigration and Foreign Visa Worker policies is beyond ridiculous. Just after WW2 (and earlier), there was good reason to have high levels of immigration, but those days are long, long gone. You only need to do an Internet search to see how much of a joke our Foreign Visa Worker policies are.

I'm not saying that no Australian businesses educate/upskill any of their employees, as I'm certain that some of them do. But if you look at the overall trend, it's pretty rare that our businesses do this. If you disagree, then why then do our "VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers"?

What it boils down to is the simple fact that most Australian businesses could not give a rat's a.r.s.e about anything except their own bottom line, and any notions of "social responsibility" are pretty much public relations lip service, and little else.

VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers"?

That was in reference to graduates programs for example. As a good way to get employees skilled is through grad programs, but because these are also high 457 in business's there is limited grad positions. My wife recently finished nursing at UNI and got onto a graduates program, however there were more students then graduates programs and a lot of hospitals have foreign nurses. So we need to get better at phasing in the Australian nurses and phasing out the foreign workers.

The other was in reference to the choices people are making for entering the work force, and what retains people in the work force. When we get feedback done on what employees want they ask for more training and community involvement. So our business has increased training opportunities, and will actively participates in the community so that we retain our workforce. Personally, if my work didn't train me or didn't have have good corporate social responsibility i would leave.

 

[Rear Admiral]

VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers"?

That was in reference to graduates programs for example. As a good way to get employees skilled is through grad programs, but because these are also high 457 in business's there is limited grad positions. My wife recently finished nursing at UNI and got onto a graduates program, however there were more students then graduates programs and a lot of hospitals have foreign nurses. So we need to get better at phasing in the Australian nurses and phasing out the foreign workers.

The other was in reference to the choices people are making for entering the work force, and what retains people in the work force. When we get feedback done on what employees want they ask for more training and community involvement. So our business has increased training opportunities, and will actively participates in the community so that we retain our workforce. Personally, if my work didn't train me or didn't have have good corporate social responsibility i would leave.

Simply put, we need to change Australia's legislation so that businesses stop using cheap overseas labour and are prepared to train more Aussie citizens, when required. There was a particular program I watched where this particular issue was specifically mentioned briefly and I hope to find. If a business allegedly lacks skilled applicants, the answer is simple: employ local applicants and train them.

Everyone speaks from their own experiences, but you made one particular comment here:

Personally, if my work didn't train me or didn't have have good corporate social responsibility i would leave.

This may be an option for you, or for certain members of the community (and I strongly admire your stance)....but in some parts of Australia (namely Tasmania and SA), this is not as easy as it sounds, nor is simply relocating an option for many people - they just can't afford it. And more the point, many businesses know this and treat their employees with utter contempt and disrespect, knowing they would be struggling to find employment elsewhere.

When people are in a section of the economy that's doing well (either geographically or in type of job), typically they can cite a whole host of positive circumstances, and I wish those people all the best with it. But in areas where the economy is not doing well, it's a whole different ball game. In some places there are highly qualified tertiary graduates working as dish washers in restaurants and hotels, just as an example. I'm not saying you're altogether wrong, not at all. But there are lots of situations and circumstances out there that are drastically different to the one you mentioned.

 

[Maggie5]

I am not so sure that the problem is just with the various Visas, I think the problem lies more with genuine market testing and the list of categories being too wide.

 

[Rear Admiral]

Broaden the tax base to wealth rather than just wealth creation and suddenly the class warfare disappears

Don't quite follow this one?

 

[Rear Admiral]

The real class warfare is handing over $60-70k PAYE tax every year

You referring to Negative Gearing and cuts to Capital Gains Tax?

 

[Rear Admiral]

and underutilised investments that don't stimulate the economy, like deposits

Internationally the big wealth scam is front running of government investments.

I don't understand those two bits there. Totally lost.

 

[Power Raid]

I don't understand those two bits there. Totally lost.

Front running is where you know what the govt wants to buy.

Currently I know of ministers (overseas) telling families to buy assets. Knowing full well that the government will buy them in 2 years at double the price.

Others scam include uncommercial arrangements and corrupt ballots and tenders with predetermined outcomes.

This is why government should govern and not operate. It is open to too much corruption.


All of these relate to other nations except here in WA we have pre determined tender outcomes to make amends for Roe8. The rigged asset allocation was the now infamous coal affair over east.

 

[Power Raid]

Don't quite follow this one?

If the issue is a wealth divide, why not tax wealth rather than rely too much on taxing wealth creation?

Taxing wealth creation too hard creates a wealth divide as it places a glass ceiling over ordinary people.

The wealthy can afford to be taxed more but a person having a good year or two should not be smashed.

Example: a person has $100m in assets but a net income of $80k after tax minimising pays f all tax

A person who is geared to the hilt running a business with net assets of $50k but earned $400k in his first big pay day year. He pays say $170k tax for this year and then billed a further $170k in advance.

Whether you take his tax as $170k or the actual $340k it is too much compared to someone who is asset rich.

We need a wealth tax to balance out income and consumption taxes.

 

[Rear Admiral]

Agree, the VISAs need to updated and their needs to be a restructure on how we upskill Australian workers.

Populations growth isn't a necessary a bad thing if we have more people hitting retirement age then we need to have more/same amount in the working age we need more workers to generate tax revenue. The bigger issue population density and we need to spread more of the migration to regional towns we're housing is low cost.

Back in the 50's you could easily get into un-skilled work, that just is not the case anymore and we need to have more intelligent and capable work force through either secondary education or apprenticeships. High school into the workforce is just not going to be enough anymore.

All the businesses I've worked in all have genuine effort to improve the communities they themselves and their workers live in. It would be of no benefit to a business negatively impact their company to such an extent that it would stop consumerism.

IMO Drugs have a way bigger problem on our Centrelink system and prison system than Foreign Workers and Immigration

Australia is a very fast country we can take in more people, we just to find the right mix and pace of immigration

Have a read here:

http://www.rossgittins.com/2010/05/does-economy-depend-on-population.html

"The PC [Productivity Commission] found that 'the distribution of these benefits varies across the population, with gains mostly accrued to the skilled migrants and capital owners. The incomes of existing resident workers grow more slowly than would otherwise be the case'."


http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-...th-can-make-us-worse-off-20150704-gi57fx.html

"And what little growth the commission could find was appropriated by the new arrivals."
"It's simple: when you increase the population while leaving our stock of household, business and public capital unchanged, you "dilute" that capital. You have less capital per person, meaning you've automatically reduced the productivity of labour."

The bigger issue population density and we need to spread more of the migration to regional towns we're housing is low cost.

In one particular show on TV, Ross Gittins talked about exactly what you mentioned re: population density and migrants "supposedly" being sent to smaller towns. Great in theory, but can't be enforced, and what ends up happening is that virtually all migrants end up jamming into our capital cities.

The bottom line is, the only benefit of more and more immigration is to large businesses and property owners and developers. To the majority of the population? Not one bit of an upside. Nil.