Collingwood's 1990 flag

[pavilion103]

I started following footy in the mid 1990's, so I don't know much in depth before that period. I've heard a lot about the Hawks period of dominanace, the Eagles in the early 90s and the Cats. I've heard very little about the Pies.

Just wondering if the 1990 flag was a surprise (similar to Hawks 2008), or if they were thereabouts for a little while? If not the Hawks, then which flag would it be most likened to since (if any)?

 

[Wokko]

Collingwood's team in 1990 should've been the beginning of something like WCE or Hawthorn of the early 90's but a premiership hangover of epic proportions and the death of one of, if not THE best player in the team ended up leading to a slide down the ladder into the worst period of our history.

In 1990 the consensus was Collingwood couldn't beat Hawthorn (like Geelong this year) but they were eliminated in the finals and we never faced them so, unlike this year... who really knows.

 

[JonoNash]

if not THE best player in the team ended up leading to a slide down the ladder into the worst period of our history.

That is pretty much it. He was Collingwood's onfield general & their spiritual leader.

We had a hangover in 1991 but in 1992 we finished equal top on the ladder. Missed Millane greatly in that finals series.

As for 90', it was a lot like Geelong this year. Through a combination of things, we were running out games in September & the draw killed Essendon as they rested players in Rd 22 & they were underdone, a lot like Collingwood this year.

 

[Hump 17]

It would be fair to say there were a heap of no names running around for Collingwood. Hardly one of the better premiership teams.

 

[Jentleman Geff]

Another question that could be asked is what happened to Hawthorn in 1990?

Could have had four in a row.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Another question that could be asked is what happened to Hawthorn in 1990?

Could have had four in a row.

Yeah..

 

[doppleganger]

It would be fair to say there were a heap of no names running around for Collingwood. Hardly one of the better premiership teams.

Prob a fair call...in that because they didn't have any further success that names failed to develop.

Millane won the Leigh Matthews medal in 1990
G.Wright came 2nd in the Brownlow
Daicos came 2nd in the Coleman

The pies were right up their in the individual awards that season.

 

[Gone Critical]

That is pretty much it. He was Collingwood's onfield general & their spiritual leader.

We had a hangover in 1991 but in 1992 we finished equal top on the ladder. Missed Millane greatly in that finals series.

As for 90', it was a lot like Geelong this year. Through a combination of things, we were running out games in September & the draw killed Essendon as they rested players in Rd 22 & they were underdone, a lot like Collingwood this year.

As a Collingwood supporter I loved Millane but sometimes dying early does elevate your stocks. Collingwood had 3 stand out players in the 1990 team

Gavin Brown
Peter Daicos
Tony Shaw

Millane, McGuane, Wright and Morwood probably filled the next places

Tony Shaw was the on field general and spiritual leader. He was a standout in this area. Brown was the young leader of the team as much by example as anything. He became a very good captain in his own right

Millane was probably the equivalent of Dipper in the Hawks side of that era. Now the Hawks were an indisputably better side than Collongwood at the time and their champs were all time greats so I am not saying Millane was as good as Dipper but he filled the same role in the team. The below would be an apt description of them

One of the big names in the team without being in the absolute top group. A fearsome competitor loved by his teammates for his fearlessness. However a bit of a loose cannon who isn't captaincy material

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Stand by what I posted.

Kerrison Berwick
Russell Francis
Manson
Turner
Gayfer
Stacavich
Christian

Hardly a list of game greats there. Still won so I dont see the problem.

Indeed.

 

[Shane Hird]

I left the ground 10mins into the last qrt..worst day of my life.

And I got spat on as we left (standing room area Punt Rd end) by drunken Pie ferals!

We were flat, Collingwood and WC had a draw in the Prelim and we twiddled our thumbs for 2 weeks waiting of the GF.

The Raging Bull was unbelievable that day off half-back for Collingwood...too good.

And Gavin Brown getting his lights punched out by Terry Daniher (after Brown belted K.Sporn) fired them up even more..

 

[doppleganger]

Stand by what I posted.

Kerrison Berwick
Russell Francis
Manson
Turner
Gayfer
Stacavich
Christian

Hardly a list of game greats there. Still won so I dont see the problem.

Russell and Francis in particular were good players, both were All Australian.

 

[doppleganger]

As a Collingwood supporter I loved Millane but sometimes dying early does elevate your stocks. Collingwood had 3 stand out players in the 1990 team

Gavin Brown
Peter Daicos
Tony Shaw

Millane won the Leigh Mathews award in 1990, and came 2nd in the Copeland.

He was a stand-out.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

They were thereabouts in 1988 and 1989 without winning a final, losing two finals in 88 and one in 89.

Had a sensational midfield and a strong albeit workmanlike defense. Not much up forward but Peter Daicos was a one man forward line in 1990 along with Gavin Brown.

The big difference between the teams of 88-89 and 90 were simply the emergence of Damien Monkhorst and the recruitment of Tony Francis and Scott Russel, both ready made rovers.

A long way from the worst premiership side ever. Not the best either, but good enough that year and very worthy.

 

[Gone Critical]

Millane won the Leigh Mathews award in 1990, and came 2nd in the Copeland.

He was a stand-out.

He was one of the best in the team but he wasn't quite to the level of Diacs Shaw and Brown.

As in my analogy Dipper was fantastic, won a Brownlow, state player, BOG in 78 GF etc but he rates below Dunstall, Brereton and Matthews for instance.

 

[Oliver09]

Essendon were the best side of the H&A season in 1990, beating Collingwood twice, once reasonably easily early in the year & in a close one late in the year. We had top spot sealed going into the last round so Sheedy rested a few blokes so he could get all 4 Danihers playing in the same team in the last round. This wouldn't have been such a bad thing but for the draw that West Coast & Collingwood had in the first week of finals which meant by the time we got to play again we hadn't played a game for 3 weeks, some players a month. On top of that we had injuries to Mark Harvey & Derek Kickett who by the time they played in that first final hadn't played for 6-7 weeks. We went in to that finals series underdone through no fault of our own as you don't plan for a drawn final!! Collingwood had all the momentum going into the 2nd semi & beat us quite easily & it just snowballed from there. We beat WC easily enough in the prelim but in the GF everything went right for Collingwood, not much did for Essendon. Even in the aftermarth Daniher got 1 of the most unjust suspensions in the history of the AFL/VFL, sure he did whack Brown & Starchervich but 11 weeks worth? Brown copped it for a reason. In hindsight Essendon might've been better off trying to draw the prelim final to throw Collingwood out of whack, would've been a high risk strategy though. The rules were changed for the next year so drwan finals had overtime but it was a year to late for Essendon.

Tim Watson was captain that year & he really feels it was the 1 that got away. We may have missed out on that 1 but would we have got 93 if we had've won 90? I reckon we would've had a few blokes still hanging around that were playing simply because they were premiership players & the likes of Hird, Misiti, Mercuri, Fletcher, Calthorpe would've had to wait a bit longer for their chance. It balanced out in the end, although it was a bitch to lose the drought breaker to Collingwood. They had a few players who'd been around for a long time & played in losing GFs such as Shaw & Daicos so they probably deserved 1 in the end.

Collingwood were a good side that year, won 16-17 games in the H&A season but the whole Hawthorn thing is overdone. Hawthorn did flog them late in the year but it was almost the loss they had to have. If you listen to Dermie you'd think all Hawthorn had to do to beat Collingwood was turn up & they would go on & win the flag that year. What he neglects to mention is that Essendon well & truly had Hawthorns measure that year & there was a good reason why Hawthorn finshed 5th, its because they weren't that good that season.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Another question that could be asked is what happened to Hawthorn in 1990?

Could have had four in a row.

Same thing that happened to them in 1984, 1985 and 1987............you cant win them all, its just impossible.

 

[JonoNash]

He was one of the best in the team but he wasn't quite to the level of Diacs Shaw and Brown.

As in my analogy Dipper was fantastic, won a Brownlow, state player, BOG in 78 GF etc but he rates below Dunstall, Brereton and Matthews for instance.

Yeah, nah.

Millane was a regular state player from 86' to 90' & was getting games ahead of Hawkins, Flower & co in his position (wing) before he got suspended in Hobart. Shaw hadn't played a state game since 84'.

No player had an onfield prescence like Millane & he was far more skilled than Shaw.

 

[Jentleman Geff]

Same thing that happened to them in 1984, 1985 and 1987............you cant win them all, its just impossible.

Yeah, but they made grand finals those years. From 83-91 they only missed one grand final, and arguably that miss was when they were at their strongest, between 88-91. Just wonder why they finished fifth that year.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

My over-riding memory of the time was they were a good side that were expected to go on to greater things, as are most premiership winners, but breaking what was probably football’s most famous drought went to their heads (can’t really blame them) and they were never the same again.

I think culturally for the club it was just the biggest “release valve” reaction you could imagine, the biggest (and most feral!) club that had come so close so many times over 30 years, and then to finally do it… the place just exploded, and didn’t clean itself up for quite a while.

They were a good side, a deserving premier, wouldn’t pay attention to the people who list their bottom five players as evidence they weren’t that good… you could do it with practically any premiership side. Unless it’s a super-powerful multi-flag era like Brisbane or Geelong, there’s usually a few blokes who don’t go onto much, and five or ten years later people don’t rate or remember them. They just happened to be in the 22 (or 20 or 21) that year, did their jobs and held their spots, every team needs reliable workhorses, and those players were just that for that year.

 

[Thommo 42]

As a Collingwood supporter I loved Millane but sometimes dying early does elevate your stocks.

Millane was 26 and in his peak. He was voted by his peers at the MVP that year, his death robbed us of a great, it didn't elevate his stocks at all.

Hawks were the best side and belted us by 90 odd points late in the year, at that time I thought our hopes were gone. Someone else knocked them out for us and the rest is history.

We were desperately unlucky in 1992 and remained competitive.

 

[Falchoon]

Not much up forward but Peter Daicos was a one man forward line in 1990 along with Gavin Brown.

Dyerism?

It's interesting looking at the ages of that team, only 2 over 30 and the youngest 5 all turned into very good players, they should have been in their prime for another 3-4 years. There's no doubt the hangover was well deserved and was a big one, but it definitely cost them.

Who's idea was no Plugger?

 

[Oliver09]

My over-riding memory of the time was they were a good side that were expected to go on to greater things, as are most premiership winners, but breaking what was probably football’s most famous drought went to their heads (can’t really blame them) and they were never the same again.

I think culturally for the club it was just the biggest “release valve” reaction you could imagine, the biggest (and most feral!) club that had come so close so many times over 30 years, and then to finally do it… the place just exploded, and didn’t clean itself up for quite a while.

They were a good side, a deserving premier, wouldn’t pay attention to the people who list their bottom five players as evidence they weren’t that good… you could do it with practically any premiership side. Unless it’s a super-powerful multi-flag era like Brisbane or Geelong, there’s usually a few blokes who don’t go onto much, and five or ten years later people don’t rate or remember them. They just happened to be in the 22 (or 20 or 21) that year, did their jobs and held their spots, every team needs reliable workhorses, and those players were just that for that year.

I thought they got the best out of themselves & 1 flag would be it. Daicos & Shaw were at the end so it was the last roll of the dice for them, they didn't have much in the way of key forwards & other than Russell, Francis, Brown, Crosisca, Wright & Monkhurst were a pretty old team. Those 6 I named were good players but you would never base a future premiership team around them, the next 8-10 years at Collingwood proves that. That team that won that year got everything out of themselves that year & with a bit of luck, which most premiership teams need, they took it out.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Yeah, but they made grand finals those years. From 83-91 they only missed one grand final, and arguably that miss was when they were at their strongest, between 88-91. Just wonder why they finished fifth that year.

Injury from memory, plus form. Got knocked out in the finals my Melbourne, if i recall correctly.

They actually smashed Collingwood by 76 points in Round 20. Pies went on to win the next two home and away games by 80+ points each, and after the drawn game won the replay and semi final easily. So the Hawthorn loss (and the narrow Essendon loss the week before) were the launching pad for Collingwoods 1990 premiership.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I thought they got the best out of themselves & 1 flag would be it. Daicos & Shaw were at the end so it was the last roll of the dice for them, they didn't have much in the way of key forwards & other than Russell, Francis, Brown, Crosisca, Wright & Monkhurst were a pretty old team..

It wasnt an old team at all....maybe two players. But it was a team that had many players suffer from career shortening injuries, plus of course a death. Whether those injuries were a result of luck, hangover/poor attitude, or Matthews, or a combination of the three, we will never know.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Who's idea was no Plugger?

Wayne Richardson allegedly didnt want his sons spot in the team put under threat.