Opinion Commentary & Media VII

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Uncle_Leo said:
Out coach from 2010-2019 decided to disassociate from the term shinboner spirit. He killed it.
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Yep he administered the coup de grâce but how do we get it back?
 

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Liam Boy said:
I understand the impulse to want to do something, anything, to put a stop to this but I just can't see the public awareness campaign model having any effect. The guys doing this stuff aren't rational people and I doubt the kind of social shaming we use to tackle drunk driving is going to impact them at all.

I think an under-discussed aspect of these murders is that almost invariably they happen in the suburbs. In Australia we have a massive problem with urban density in the sense that there's so many public places with almost no people around most of the time, poor streetlight coverage, and public transport that forces people to walk long distances through unlit streets to get home if they don't have access to a car, which is obviously a massive safety issue for young women and other vulnerable groups. People are less likely to try to attack someone and less likely to get away with it when there's people around who could witness it or potentially intervene, and there's less of a window of vulnerability if you can walk to your apartment from the bus stop on the corner, or the local train station that's 2 minutes away.

An actual concrete thing we could do for women's safety, and honestly everyone's wellbeing on a number of levels is to stop building these sparse suburbs and try to convert at least immediate surrounding suburbs into something resembling inner-city housing. Those places are in really high demand because there's not enough places to live that are like that, and the ones we do have are too expensive (tackling the real estate cartel might also help here). Treat it like an infrastructure issue rather than a social one and we might be able to actually do something real about it. We don't really know how to talk psychos out of wanting to murder women but we know how to build safer public living spaces.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the biggest and most pressing issue domestic violence rather than stranger danger? Most of these murders occurring in a well lit living room rather than a dimly lit street.
 
Hearts to hearts said:
Doing something is better than doing nothing. And there’s a chance some boys and men are influenced by what football players say is unacceptable to them. So I’m glad the clubs and players want to say something and trust this commitment to drawing a line will run through their recruitment, selection and behaviour management decisions as well.

But this is way past any kind of awareness campaign having an impact on the level of coercion and violence that’s going on and the frequency of it leading to murder. Governments and courts and police need to get serious about orders, bail, jail, and support for victims.
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Football players as influencers on this is interesting. I'm doing a lot of assumption here but I feel that the Sam Wicks issue at Sydney is a widespread and problematic shared attitude among men in this age group. As I understand it, Wicks has been isolated from teammates after he approached the ex-girlfriend of a teammate at a social gathering. It's as though many men believe they should retain some sort of control over who their ex-partner dates. This feeds into the same sense of entitlement and ownership that a lot of young men have over current and former partners and leads them to being unwilling or unable to accept a relationship breakup. The most extreme response to this situation is violence and murder as we have seen.

I wonder how many men among us on this forum believe that it's unacceptable for a friend to date your ex-partner.
 
Colby Cheer Squad said:
I wonder how many men among us on this forum believe that it's unacceptable for a friend to date your ex-partner.
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Good luck to them - depending on circumstances it might make some social situations a little awkward but that's hardly anything major.
 
Colby Cheer Squad said:
Football players as influencers on this is interesting. I'm doing a lot of assumption here but I feel that the Sam Wicks issue at Sydney is a widespread and problematic shared attitude among men in this age group. As I understand it, Wicks has been isolated from teammates after he approached the ex-girlfriend of a teammate at a social gathering. It's as though many men believe they should retain some sort of control over who their ex-partner dates. This feeds into the same sense of entitlement and ownership that a lot of young men have over current and former partners and leads them to being unwilling or unable to accept a relationship breakup. The most extreme response to this situation is violence and murder as we have seen.

I wonder how many men among us on this forum believe that it's unacceptable for a friend to date your ex-partner.
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Hmmm. No point wearing orange socks or whatever and then players are seen demonstrating medieval attitudes, or clubs (completely hypothetically) being ready to overlook behaviour to get or keep talented players.
 
big_e said:
The vitriol still reserved for Garry Lyon by many people is a good indicator of that.
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My Gary Lyon vitriol is in the zero shits given category - it hasn't impacted me.
 
Val Keating said:
I know that Mick said our training standards did improve after Clarko first came over. Someone from here asked him about it on Twitter and he said (something like, can’t remember exactly) they were training much better.
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I think it’s more a mindset thing than “North train less than the rest”. Just look at X and Comben - also, Wardlaw. These guys are training under the same regime as the rest of the team. Our players need to start a game with clear heads and a very serious intent to attack the ball and the opposition - just like the above mentioned guys. I’d nearly argue that some of our players could do with less physical training and more psychological training. LMac, for a start, looks like a totally frazzled character.
 

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I’ve watched the Q&A with Clarkson and Viney. Only so much they can say, given our rank position. However, they did deal with the McGuane article in a coherent way. In effect it’s really just the understandable “noise” that comes your way when you’re in the “crap” zone. There’s so much navel gazing that plays out in the media that sucks us all in. Ultimately, the very fact that we’re stone, motherless last with zero points and 57% says everything that needs to be said.
 
Caracas said:
I’ve watched the Q&A with Clarkson and Viney. Only so much they can say, given our rank position. However, they did deal with the McGuane article in a coherent way. In effect it’s really just the understandable “noise” that comes your way when you’re in the “crap” zone. There’s so much navel gazing that plays out in the media that sucks us all in. Ultimately, the very fact that we’re stone, motherless last with zero points and 57% says everything that needs to be said.
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Yeah it's an entirely valid argument - the team on the bottom of the ladder lacks talent and skills on match day so of course you will see the same lack on the training track. We are not talking about the intensity or the effort at training but simply the skill level that obviously... OBVIOUSLY matches what we see in games because that is the limitation of the team at the moment.
 
What we are seeing now is the result of years worth of mismanagement and the job of rectifying that isn't just a wave of the magic wand. It's from a history of poor standards being the norm and changing that culture is a massive challenge. I think they've put all the things in place from an off-field standpoint to enable that change, but ultimately it's down to the individual. From a player perspective, you have to want to do it personally, nobody can make you. Nobody.

Pretty fair response in the Q&A overall.
 
Grogg said:
ultimately it's down to the individual. From a player perspective, you have to want to do it personally, nobody can make you
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We can get rid of those who don't want to do it as soon as practicable. Buy in or GTFO.
 
It's pretty clear from Clarkson's press conferences and the Q&A that the current football department views last year as the beginning of the rebuild, which makes sense because they did strip the list back to being the youngest in the competition. It sucks, but this is what happens when a club completely hecks its original attempt at a rebuild. We just kinda have to hope that they actually get it right this time.
 
tricknologist said:
It's pretty clear from Clarkson's press conferences and the Q&A that the current football department views last year as the beginning of the rebuild, which makes sense because they did strip the list back to being the youngest in the competition. It sucks, but this is what happens when a club completely *s its original attempt at a rebuild. We just kinda have to hope that they actually get it right this time.
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This 100% 1 year into rebuild.
 
Grogg said:
What we are seeing now is the result of years worth of mismanagement and the job of rectifying that isn't just a wave of the magic wand. It's from a history of poor standards being the norm and changing that culture is a massive challenge. I think they've put all the things in place from an off-field standpoint to enable that change, but ultimately it's down to the individual. From a player perspective, you have to want to do it personally, nobody can make you. Nobody.

Pretty fair response in the Q&A overall.
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Glad Todd pointed out that Clarko, Viney, Adcock and Clarke have been through this build before.
Also, Thursfield at Tigers as well would've seen how that list was built as well having lived it.
 
tricknologist said:
It's pretty clear from Clarkson's press conferences and the Q&A that the current football department views last year as the beginning of the rebuild, which makes sense because they did strip the list back to being the youngest in the competition. It sucks, but this is what happens when a club completely *s its original attempt at a rebuild. We just kinda have to hope that they actually get it right this time.
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Yeah, half arsing the first attempt has set us back a decade pretty much, but I'm optomistic we've got the right people in place now to see it through properly. That's gonna suck for us as fans tbf. I'll keep buying mymembership, which is pretty much just a donation anyway as I don't get to go to games anymore, but it's gonna test the rusted on core to the very limit, particulary the poor souls who do get to the games.
 
Grogg said:
Yeah, half arsing the first attempt has set us back a decade pretty much, but I'm optomistic we've got the right people in place now to see it through properly. That's gonna suck for us as fans tbf. I'll keep buying mymembership, which is pretty much just a donation anyway as I don't get to go to games anymore, but it's gonna test the rusted on core to the very limit, particulary the poor souls who do get to the games.
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Crowds are going to be the issue though. I can see below 10k vs interstate teams.

There is just no motivation to watch up play at the minute.
 
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