Conspiracy Theory Coronavirus #3: Vaccines

[maryjames]

Australia has had many deaths by the covid vaccine but what do other countries do..

Italy and Norway join Denmark in suspending use of AstraZeneca vaccine

Italy and Norway have joined Denmark and a host of other European countries in suspending the use of AstraZeneca's vaccine today over fears it could cause blood clots.

www.dailymail.co.uk

These countries must be anti vaxxes ..

For the people going on and on and on and on about thinking everyone is anti vaxx..

 

[armpit]

QLD Vaccine used safe components of the HIV virus to develop the Vaccine, which caused the positive HIV tests.
The Vaccine was not causing HIV infections, so this was not an example of ADE.

Thanks.

 

[Seedsman_]

wasn’t it the most obvious approach given how we tackle flu with a Vaccine each year.

I am not disputing that rather, I’m criticising the messaging as it prompted unrealistic expectations of what the vaccine was going to offer people.

 

[Evolved1]

So anti-vaxers also want lockdowns removed do they? They reckon neither should happen?

Do you have any idea what would happen if all of us thought like that, and we just opened up fully with zero vaccinations?

Our entire health system would be overwhelmed in months, and even at a 0.5 percent fatality rate, literally a hundred thousand people would die here in Australia alone.

Would you take a vaccine, and suffer lockdowns to stop an army of terrorists coming to Australia to kill 100,000 people?

Where did you get the 0.5% fatality rate from?

 

[Seedsman_]

Silver bullet got me thinking. What if we tell everyone that the vaccine only killed vampires?

Then Van Helsing would be out of a job. Think of small business man!

We're all going to catch it.

The vaccines have proven themselves in reducing hospitalizations, ICU and deaths. There is a direct correlation between those numbers going down as vaccination rates go up, regardless of the rates of infection.

I’m not arguing the efficacy of the vaccines, rather the perceived invincibility people were told that they would have.

 

[GuzzLG]

No, there were lockdown orders in place all over the USA, States shutting down, mask orders and so forth.

They werent as strict as ours, hence why you saw ICUs and Morgues at (above) capacity, and mass graves in NYC.

They've also had a strong vaccination program.

Same as the UK.

You guys are talking about totally opening up (none of that at all). No mask orders, no vaccines, no lockdowns. Just let the virus rip and see what happens.

Our hospitals would be overwhelmed and overflowing within months, (meaning non COVID patients would be f’ed), we would run out of ventilators and drugs and treatment of COVID (which saves lives) and we would have a catastrophe on our hands.

Same s**t. Different year.

2013

Hospitals scramble to prevent crisis in NHS's 'toughest ever' winter

NHS deputy chief executive says service 'pulling out all the stops' to deal with impact of bad weather, flu and vomiting bug

www.theguardian.com

2014

NHS could be 'overwhelmed' by people with long-term medical conditions

One of health service's most senior figures warns there needs to be a serious rethink of how patients are cared for

www.theguardian.com

2015



2016

NHS hospitals now so overwhelmed patients could die, says top doctor

The warning from doctors in acute care comes after the NHS admits it missed almost all key targets in January – its worst-ever set of figures

www.theguardian.com

2017

Overstretched hospitals face winter flu crisis, doctors warn | NHS | The Guardian

A&E departments risk ‘grinding to a halt’ as number of patients waiting more than 12 hours for treatment soars

amp.theguardian.com

2018

N.H.S. Overwhelmed in Britain, Leaving Patients to Wait (Published 2018)

For years, budget cuts at the National Health Service have left hospitals stretched over the winter. This time, it is under the highest strain in decades.

www.nytimes.com

2019

NHS ‘overwhelmed despite best efforts of staff’

NHS England has published NHS performance statistics for February, which show that the service is continuing to struggle under pressure.

www.pharmatimes.com

You’re paralysed by fear and propaganda. It’s unbecoming of a grown man. Don’t be a coward.

 

[Evolved1]

Would you want to know before you banged someone if they had HIV?

Should the law require them to tell you?

I'd rather go raw into someone with covid than hiv. Which would you choose?

 

[No SPIN]

I am not disputing that rather, I’m criticising the messaging as it prompted unrealistic expectations of what the vaccine was going to offer people.

The Delta virus which is causing the current havoc was not around at the time, so I don’t know they can be blamed retrospectively for messaging on a Vaccine, never specifically designed to target the Delta strain.
Govt can be blamed for incompetence on a lot of issues but I don’t see this as one of them,

 

[Seedsman_]

QLD Vaccine used safe components of the HIV virus to develop the Vaccine, which caused the positive HIV tests.
The Vaccine was not causing HIV infections, so this was not an example of ADE.

A mate of mine knows someone at CSL And they said the vaccine from Queensland was the best of the lot but the spike protein from the HIV virus causing false positives spooked the authorities so they canned it.

 

[Malifice]

Sweden must be hiding the 55,000 deaths out of their 11 million people.

Sweden also has 60 percent fully vaccinated, and has had restrictions in place as well. Remember, I'm talking zero restrictions and zero vaccinations.

Lets image everyone in Oz was as selfish as you blokes.

In any event, Sweden is currently sitting on 1 million cases, and 15,000 deaths out of 10 million.

To extrapolate that to Australias population, if we had have followed Sweden we would be at 2.5 million cases, and 40,000 deaths.

So our measures have so far saved 39,000 Aussie lives.

 

[Evolved1]

Have our resident leftie nutjobs heard of the lambda variant?

 

[Evolved1]

Sweden also has 60 percent fully vaccinated, and has had restrictions in place as well. Remember, I'm talking zero restrictions and zero vaccinations.

Lets image everyone in Oz was as selfish as you blokes.

In any event, Sweden is currently sitting on 1 million cases, and 15,000 deaths out of 10 million.

To extrapolate that to Australias population, if we had have followed Sweden we would be at 2.5 million cases, and 40,000 deaths.

So our measures have so far saved 39,000 Aussie lives.

Old people die all the time. We accept 5,000 deaths every year from flu.

How many deaths are you willing to accept from covid?

How much disruption to the education and mental health of our youth are you willing to sacrifice to give our elderly another few years of existence in a nursing home?

 

[No SPIN]

A mate of mine knows someone at CSL And they said the vaccine from Queensland was the best of the lot but the spike protein from the HIV virus causing false positives spooked the authorities so they canned it.

yes that’s correct.
Its a hard one because the anti Vaxxers would have a had field day building Conspiracies around the HIV components.

 

[Shane Heard]

No, there were lockdown orders in place all over the USA, States shutting down, mask orders and so forth.

They werent as strict as ours, hence why you saw ICUs and Morgues at (above) capacity, and mass graves in NYC.

They've also had a strong vaccination program.

Same as the UK.

You guys are talking about totally opening up (none of that at all). No mask orders, no vaccines, no lockdowns. Just let the virus rip and see what happens.

Our hospitals would be overwhelmed and overflowing within months, (meaning non COVID patients would be f’ed), we would run out of ventilators and drugs and treatment of COVID (which saves lives) and we would have a catastrophe on our hands.

that’s all valid stuff and good intentions

however …there’s no way in hell I’m injected some unknown concoction into my blood stream on the basis that everyone is taking it

I have no qualms about anyone taking the jab of this stuff. No judgment or ridicule..no lectures or speeches on free right to choose what you put in your body

just don’t tell me I’m jeopardising the whole of mankind when you yourself and every other punter out there has no idea definitively what exactly this s**t is

and no ..taking the word of “ health experts “ just doesn’t cut the mustard I’m afraid

 

[Seedsman_]

The Delta virus which is causing the current havoc was not around at the time, so I don’t know they can be blamed retrospectively for messaging on a Vaccine, never specifically designed to target the Delta strain.
Govt can be blamed for incompetence on a lot of issues but I don’t see this as one of them,

I’ll agree to disagree on this one.

 

[Malifice]

Where did you get the 0.5% fatality rate from?

Current best estimate, using IFR (deaths per million infections):

0–17 years old: 20 (0.02 percent)
18–49 years old: 500 (0.05 percent)
50–64 years old: 6,000 (0.6 percent)
65+ years old: 90,000 (9 percent)

COVID-19 Pandemic Planning Scenarios | CDC

If the disease was left to run rampant:

1 in 6000 or so infected people aged 0-17 die.
1 in 2000 or so infected people aged 18-49 die.
1 in 200 or so infected people aged 50-64 die.
1 in 10 or so infected people aged 65+ die.

 

[Shane Heard]

Old people die all the time. We accept 5,000 deaths every year from flu.

How many deaths are you willing to accept from covid?

How much disruption to the education and mental health of our youth are you willing to sacrifice to give our elderly another few years of existence in a nursing home?

there was plenty of opportunity for governments to lock down and secure nursing homes

but they didn’t ..why? because they’re incompetent morons

Dan Andrews will forever be blamed for letting 100s of elderly die because of failed procedures

 

[zill]

Have our resident leftie nutjobs heard of the lambda variant?

I think this is being kept on ice for the time being, need to keep something in reserve for when the state of emergency needs to be extended again.

 

[Steele13]

Sweden also has 60 percent fully vaccinated, and has had restrictions in place as well. Remember, I'm talking zero restrictions and zero vaccinations.

Lets image everyone in Oz was as selfish as you blokes.

In any event, Sweden is currently sitting on 1 million cases, and 15,000 deaths out of 10 million.

To extrapolate that to Australias population, if we had have followed Sweden we would be at 2.5 million cases, and 40,000 deaths.

So our measures have so far saved 39,000 Aussie lives.

That's a simplistic way of looking at it. Sweden averages around 90,000 deaths per year. Sometimes more, sometimes less. Last year was 97,000, so an increase of just over 7%. A bit of a spike, not catastrophic. Similar to rates of death from the early 2010s. As harsh as it sounds, a lot of those dead by the look of it were likely to die anyway. Australia at that percentage increase is an extra 14,000 deaths. A fair few, not catastrophic, likely not many people would even notice in a population of 25 million. Is that worth disrupting people's lives to this degree? Creating debt that will take generations to pay? I don't think it is. I know you're in Perth. A little 5 day lockdown here and there, no big deal. But I'm telling you despite what you've heard, our long lockdown last year ruined some people. Call it soft if you like, but it was a nightmare for some. And I've no doubt some in Sydney are feeling the pinch too.

 

[Shane Heard]

Current best estimate, using IFR (deaths per million infections):

0–17 years old: 20 (0.02 percent)
18–49 years old: 500 (0.05 percent)
50–64 years old: 6,000 (0.6 percent)
65+ years old: 90,000 (9 percent)

COVID-19 Pandemic Planning Scenarios | CDC

If the disease was left to run rampant:

1 in 6000 or so infected people aged 0-17 die.
1 in 2000 or so infected people aged 18-49 die.
1 in 200 or so infected people aged 50-64 die.
1 in 10 or so infected people aged 65+ die.

absolute rubbish stats that take no account of pre existing conditions

 

[GuzzLG]

Sweden also has 60 percent fully vaccinated, and has had restrictions in place as well. Remember, I'm talking zero restrictions and zero vaccinations.

Lets image everyone in Oz was as selfish as you blokes.

In any event, Sweden is currently sitting on 1 million cases, and 15,000 deaths out of 10 million.

To extrapolate that to Australias population, if we had have followed Sweden we would be at 2.5 million cases, and 40,000 deaths.

So our measures have so far saved 39,000 Aussie lives.

Lol okay.

If you are even granted all that you’re looking at like 20,000 deaths a year and half of those would have died anyway. So something like 100,000 baseline deaths becomes 110,000 or so with that extra 10,000 median age like 85.

Personally I think that doesn’t warrant Australian having to change from a free country to a medical dictatorship.

 

[Evolved1]

Current best estimate, using IFR (deaths per million infections):

0–17 years old: 20 (0.02 percent)
18–49 years old: 500 (0.05 percent)
50–64 years old: 6,000 (0.6 percent)
65+ years old: 90,000 (9 percent)

COVID-19 Pandemic Planning Scenarios | CDC

If the disease was left to run rampant:

1 in 6000 or so infected people aged 0-17 die.
1 in 2000 or so infected people aged 18-49 die.
1 in 200 or so infected people aged 50-64 die.
1 in 10 or so infected people aged 65+ die.

Ok thanks. I think your 0.5% stat is misleading tbh.

I prefer to view the stats in terms of years lost against total life expectancy. Let's be honest here, we're sacrificing the best years of our young people to save our elderly; most of our elderly would prefer to take their chances with covid than forgo contact with their children and grandchildren, or even worse, cause their grandchildren to lose out in education and social welfare.

 

[maryjames]

The 27 year old death in Sydney by what the government said was a covid death but the day before according to this article
Was negative to any covid symptoms and his family had a history of heart problems.

Wonder if they injected him after he got the clear from covid..

Liverpool man in his 20s who died from COVID identified

A Liverpool man who died with COVID-19 has been identified by the Daily Telegraph as 27-year-old forklift driver Aude Alaskar.

www.skynews.com.au

 

[Malifice]

How many deaths are you willing to accept from covid?

I want COVID deaths, ICU and hospitalizations to be at a manageable level, so the infected can get the best possible care, without jeopardizing the health care of others. Whatever figure that is.

The current figures of 2,000 deaths probably presupposes a manageable number of ICU intakes and hospitalization's figure of around that level.

No-one is arguing for zero deaths. This COVID thing is here for good now. For the rest of our lives, and odds are more than one of us blokes posting in this thread die from it.

How much disruption to the education and mental health of our youth are you willing to sacrifice to give our elderly another few years of existence in a nursing home?

Enough time to get the population 80 percent vaccinated, and protect those people, who havent worked their entire lives just to be left to choke to death on their own pus so you can have a holiday in Bali.

 

[Malifice]

I prefer to view the stats in terms of years lost against total life expectancy. Let's be honest here, we're sacrificing the best years of our young people to save our elderly

How so?

Literally the only thing I cant do in WA right now is leave the country for less than 3 months.