Coronavirus: International Facts and Figures

[Rusty Brookes]

A nice bit of research here:

Chloroquine/SARS study doesn’t prove hydroxychloroquine works against COVID-19

CLAIM: A 2005 study that found that “Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread” proves that hydroxychloroquine is effective against COVID-19. AP’S ASSESSMENT: False. The study does not prove that the malaria drug hydroxychloroquine is effective against...

apnews.com

 

[yebiga]

Pretty sure they didn’t have the right sized organite pyramid positioned over the earth-energy line running under the lab. There’s only so much you can do under those horrendous conditions. Not even a Reiki attunement would counter that.

Are you punch drunk? Les has buried you in a tomb of data. Unable to respond you begun to hallucinate. Just wear the muzzle.

 

[Upgrayedd]

You don't appear to be very good at following, Sweden could claim 15,000 deaths via covid and if that was the case they would have roughly around 15,000 deaths over and above the all cause mortality rate, simply point out where the 5/6,000 Swedish covid deaths are, surely in a pandemic we would look at the graphs and they would stand out like a sore thumb as the other Nordic nations had very few covid deaths.



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I replied to a different graph where it just shows deaths, which was crap as it has really nothing to do apart from covid related deaths. a 5000 spike in terms of 10m is a drop in the ocean, of course it wont stick out like a sore thumb

0-64 years, So it's skewering deaths where the virus is most deadly, in the older population, again, absolute crap chart without context of what it's showing.

Your posting charts which are pretty ******* crap in terms of context.

 

[Monkey King]

Stephen Hahn, the commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), on Thursday declined to take a definitive stance on whether people should take hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for the coronavirus, instead saying that decision should be made between a doctor and a patient.

FDA chief: Hydroxychloroquine use a decision between doctor and patient

Stephen Hahn, the commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), on Thursday declined to take a definitive stance on whether people should take hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for t…

thehill.com

Lol. He said the exact same thing when asked about using surface disinfectants internally

 

[BigPond101]

Look at the death graph of all these countries Italy, France, Sweden, it's completely leveled off for months. Basically after corona picks off the most vulnerable 0.00001 % of the population it peters out. It's up to the Australian government to protect these people and open the rest of the country

 

[Rusty Brookes]

Look at the death graph of all these countries Italy, France, Sweden, it's completely leveled off for months. Basically after corona picks off the most vulnerable 0.00001 % of the population it peters out. It's up to the Australian government to protect these people and open the rest of the country

First thing - 0.00001% of the population of Italy would equal 6 deaths - they're at 35,000+ deaths.

Secondly what impact did it have on essential medical staff?

An Italian sacrifice to the COVID-19 epidemic

As reported by Newsweek magazine on 4 April 2020 [1], coronavirus has killed over 100 doctors and nurses around the world, nearly half of whom are reported to be in Italy. This report, however, underestimated the size of the problem. To date, 151 doctors and more than 40 nurses have died in...

erj.ersjournals.com

Thirdly, Italy and France went through extensive lockdown to achieve that lower death rate.

Fourth, the UK and the US have lifted restrictions and, bang up goes the death and infection rate.

Fifth, a short tight lockdown can achieve significant results - have a look at New Zealand.

 

[BigPond101]

Spain and Italy have now released detailed figures on deaths from covid19. If you are under 50, you have more chance of dying from a shark attack than covid19. If you are under 40 there is statistically no chance of you dying of covid19. And these are in hardest hit countries with overrun hospitals

I said months ago at the start of this pandemic in the main thread - no healthy person under 40 will ever die of corona virus in Australia

Therefore every dollar spent locking them down is taking away from money that should be spent locking down aged care homes and disabilty centres, where sadly one 30 year old has died in Melbourne because of the government was busy enforcing total lockdown

The ironic thing is if you oppose lockdown they say "You want the elderly to die." But people like me opposing lockdown would save all the elderly and disabled by putting all the money towards caring for them

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Spain and Italy have now released detailed figures on deaths from covid19. If you are under 50, you have more chance of dying from a shark attack than covid19. If you are under 40 there is statistically no chance of you dying of covid19. And these are in hardest hit countries with overrun hospitals

I said months ago at the start of this pandemic in the main thread - no healthy person under 40 will ever die of corona virus in Australia

Therefore every dollar spent locking them down is taking away from money that should be spent locking down aged care homes and disabilty centres, where sadly one 30 year old has died in Melbourne because of the government was busy enforcing total lockdown

The ironic thing is if you oppose lockdown they say "You want the elderly to die." But people like me opposing lockdown would save all the elderly and disabled by putting all the money towards caring for them

the issue with this is the logistics. my MIL lives with us. Are me and my wife joining your lockdown, or is she being kicked out of our house?

most people with disabilities do not live in supported accommodation. are you locking down the families for those people too?

and then you have the people recovering from cancer, and other pre-existing illnesses that effect immune systems. again, are their families (parents or their children) also being locked down?

and if you add in people with heart and respiratory conditions and diabetes, all of which are factors that significantly increase risk of death, you end up having a third of the nation in lockdown - and that doesnt include the people they share housing with.

and how are you locking these people down? voluntary home detention has been a joke, with 25% of melbournians ignoring it. Are you ankle monitoring millions of people? Nailing/welding doors shut? or doing what some people here have suggested, and turn some rural cities into ghettos where we would ship all these at risk people?

the idea of quarantining these at risk peoples hasnt been done because its not palatable, its because its cost prohibitive given the millions of people it would impact

 

[RunningBounce]

Spain and Italy have now released detailed figures on deaths from covid19. If you are under 50, you have more chance of dying from a shark attack than covid19. If you are under 40 there is statistically no chance of you dying of covid19. And these are in hardest hit countries with overrun hospitals

I said months ago at the start of this pandemic in the main thread - no healthy person under 40 will ever die of corona virus in Australia

Therefore every dollar spent locking them down is taking away from money that should be spent locking down aged care homes and disabilty centres, where sadly one 30 year old has died in Melbourne because of the government was busy enforcing total lockdown

The ironic thing is if you oppose lockdown they say "You want the elderly to die." But people like me opposing lockdown would save all the elderly and disabled by putting all the money towards caring for them

Of course you understand that plenty of people under 40 in Spain and Italy died because hospitals weren't functioning, right? It just won't be on the death certificate as COVID-19.

The lockdown and all the measures that affect the economy are about maintaining a functional health system as much as they are about protecting the folk at risk from C19.

 

[BigPond101]

Of course you understand that plenty of people under 40 in Spain and Italy died because hospitals weren't functioning, right? It just won't be on the death certificate as COVID-19.
100
The lockdown and all the measures that affect the economy are about maintaining a functional health system as much as they are about protecting the folk at risk from C19.

Actually there are no excess deaths in under 40s in for Spain and Italy compared to previous years, and young people were given priority in the overflooded hospitals so "plenty of people under 40" havn't died. That's just false. Extra old people died because of the hospital system being overwhelmed, all the more reason to put more money into caring for them rather than locking down everyone

And the guy two posts above, your argument seems to be, we can't properly lock down 10 % of the population so lets lockdown 100 %. That just doesnt make sense to me. You talk about the difficulty of the situation with your MIL, but if we took some of the billions and billions wasted and put it towards cases like your family it seems to me we would have a better chance of a good solution. Just my opinion

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Actually there are no excess deaths in under 40s in for Spain and Italy compared to previous years, and young people were given priority in the overflooded hospitals so "plenty of people under 40" havn't died. That's just false. Extra old people died because of the hospital system being overwhelmed, all the more reason to put more money into caring for them rather than locking down everyone

And the guy two posts above, your argument seems to be, we can't properly lock down 10 % of the population so lets lockdown 100 %. That just doesnt make sense to me. You talk about the difficulty of the situation with your MIL, but if we took some of the billions and billions wasted and put it towards cases like your family it seems to me we would have a better chance of a good solution. Just my opinion

the issue is math. you need to find alternate accommodation, catering, medical, and every other support - for 8-10 million people. add then the security to endorse their detainment, and you are looking at costs which will dwarf what is happening now

 

[foxdog50]

Thoughts?

 

[Rusty Brookes]

Thoughts?

Well it does offer some promise.

It's currently being trialled by Monash and the Doherty Institute (University of Melbourne)

Monash University Continues its Investigation into Ivermectin & Other Novel Therapies as Potential Treatments for COVID-19

Led by Dr. Kylie Wagstaff and team, Monash University, in collaboration with the Doherty Institute, triggered global interest in ivermectin, an FDA-approved marketed anti-parasitic drug, as a potential antiviral for the COVID-19 causative virus, SARS-CoV-2. The team’s preliminary lab work...

www.trialsitenews.com

Well-Respected Australian Researcher: Consider Triple Therapy (Ivermectin, Zinc, Doxycycline) for COVID-19

Thomas Borody MB,BS, BSc (Med), MD PhD, DSc, FRACP, FACP, FACG, AGAF, touts FDA and TGA approved Ivermectin, which he reports to use regularly in his hospital as it evidences positive results for COVID-19 and should be used immediately to fight the pandemic. The developer of the world’s first...

www.trialsitenews.com

Let's see how the drug performs in the various trials.

What I can see is we can ignore conspiratorial idiots claiming the drug is being held back. It hasn't been proven yet to be effective in human subjects - it well may (and let's hope it does) but there are a number of trials across the world looking at how effective the treatment is.

The worry here is people are already self medicating in places like India. People have to remember the vast majority of cases don't result in a death - so proper trials need to be conducted to ensure it is actually doing what it claims in a human population.

 

[RunningBounce]

Actually there are no excess deaths in under 40s in for Spain and Italy compared to previous years, and young people were given priority in the overflooded hospitals so "plenty of people under 40" havn't died. That's just false. Extra old people died because of the hospital system being overwhelmed, all the more reason to put more money into caring for them rather than locking down everyone

And the guy two posts above, your argument seems to be, we can't properly lock down 10 % of the population so lets lockdown 100 %. That just doesnt make sense to me. You talk about the difficulty of the situation with your MIL, but if we took some of the billions and billions wasted and put it towards cases like your family it seems to me we would have a better chance of a good solution. Just my opinion

I'm not comfortable to fill the ICU's with sick oldies and then take my chances if I have an accident and need stitches. I don't want my middle-aged friends and family to wait an extra hour for the ambulance if they have a heart attack mowing the lawn. I'm disturbed that the oldies who did die in New York had to be stored in a refrigated truck in the street. Just because these hypothetical scenarios aren't reflected in the macro-level numbers doesn't mean they don't happen to someone.

We have built a health system to a certain capacity, and if we exceed that, ugly things happen.

We don't have spare aged care nurses waiting around to step in when the ones who are currently staffing our Old Folks Homes get sick - and they would get sick under your proposal. (They're getting sick as it is.) It would take a year to train enough people for that extra capacity, and let's face it. It's a special person who chooses to help elderly people wash themselves for work. Not sure we have crowds of people just waiting to step into that work.

And that's before we get to nurses and doctors.

So let's agree to disagree. And thanks for keeping the argument respectful. Not always the case in here.

 

[Laphroaig]

We don't have spare aged care nurses waiting around to step in when the ones who are currently staffing our Old Folks Homes get sick - and they would get sick under your proposal. (They're getting sick as it is.) It would take a year to train enough people for that extra capacity, and let's face it. It's a special person who chooses to help elderly people wash themselves for work. Not sure we have crowds of people just waiting to step into that work.

I know I am coming in at the end. But. Your assumptions are wrong. With the exception of a VERY few, aged care workers are drawn from the same end of the work force / gene pool as sausage packers.

They are not highly educated, highly trained, highly skilled or highly dedicated. They are people who can not get a better job than cleaning up other people's s**t (and turning a blind eye to the systemic neglect of the clients) for $22 an hour with no job security. That's $6 an hour less than somebody who pushes a vacuum cleaner around an office block gets.

Aged care workers are, in fact, the very definition of a disposable and easily replaceable workforce.

Having said all that, I do agree with you that the proposition of locking down only those over a certain age as a solution is ludicrous.

 

[Laphroaig]

Actually there are no excess deaths in under 40s in for Spain and Italy compared to previous years, and young people were given priority in the overflooded hospitals so "plenty of people under 40" havn't died. That's just false. Extra old people died because of the hospital system being overwhelmed, all the more reason to put more money into caring for them rather than locking down everyone

And the guy two posts above, your argument seems to be, we can't properly lock down 10 % of the population so lets lockdown 100 %. That just doesnt make sense to me. You talk about the difficulty of the situation with your MIL, but if we took some of the billions and billions wasted and put it towards cases like your family it seems to me we would have a better chance of a good solution. Just my opinion

You're looking at the wrong end of the pineapple by focusing on deaths.

The people who are spreading the virus through the community are, overwhelmingly, younger adults. More than 3/4 of total Corona cases in Australia have been in the 20-59 age group, with the 20-29 year group having the highest rate of all.

It is a no brainer to work out that if we want to stop the spread becoming totally out of control, you absolutely have to go to the people who are spreading the infection.

As for the triviality of the risk to younger people?

Roughly 6,000 people 18-44 years (4% of total) have died from Covid-19 in the USA, and nearly 40,000 (22%) in the 45 to 64 years group. That's a lot of corpses.

 

[RunningBounce]

I know I am coming in at the end. But. Your assumptions are wrong. With the exception of a VERY few, aged care workers are drawn from the same end of the work force / gene pool as sausage packers.

They are not highly educated, highly trained, highly skilled or highly dedicated. They are people who can not get a better job than cleaning up other people's sh*t (and turning a blind eye to the systemic neglect of the clients) for $22 an hour with no job security. That's $6 an hour less than somebody who pushes a vacuum cleaner around an office block gets.

Aged care workers are, in fact, the very definition of a disposable and easily replaceable workforce.

Having said all that, I do agree with you that the proposition of locking down only those over a certain age as a solution is ludicrous.

I agree to a small extent. Some positions in that industry are not skilled. I'd suggest those positions are analogous to fruit picking. Sure, easy work. So why is there a chronic shortage of labour in horticulture? Not everyone wants to do it and very few have the disposition to stick at it.

Many positions in aged care do require a ticket that takes years of study. Even registered nurses need to do some training before they are qualified to work in aged care. I have one in my family.

I disagree that it's a replacable workforce 1) because that work is not valued and 2) it does require skills.

Feel better after abusing people who do work that you couldn't?

 

[HTT]

Of course you understand that plenty of people under 40 in Spain and Italy died because hospitals weren't functioning, right? It just won't be on the death certificate as COVID-19.

The lockdown and all the measures that affect the economy are about maintaining a functional health system as much as they are about protecting the folk at risk from C19.

A big part of the reason the death rate is much lower for younger people is that they are much more likely to recover from being on a ventilator for days. If you can't get access to a ventilator when you need one, you can be the healthiest person in the world - you're not surviving.

 

[Laphroaig]

I agree to a small extent. Some positions in that industry are not skilled. I'd suggest those positions are analogous to fruit picking. Sure, easy work. So why is there a chronic shortage of labour in horticulture? Not everyone wants to do it and very few have the disposition to stick at it.

Many positions in aged care do require a ticket that takes years of study. Even registered nurses need to do some training before they are qualified to work in aged care. I have one in my family.

I disagree that it's a replacable workforce 1) because that work is not valued and 2) it does require skills.

Feel better after abusing people who do work that you couldn't?

Do you feel better abusing someone who points out an uncomfortable truth?

Focusing on the very few exceptions, which I had already mentioned, and having a tantie on their behalf does not change the overarching fact.

If the work was valued and skilled, then the base rate for a person with up to 4 years experience would be a damn sight more than $22 and hour.

And yet, unlike fruit picking - which is a dreadful analogy to use in comparison to almost anything - aged care homes don't have a great deal of trouble filling the majority drone positions. Far more likely to be running shifts with all bottom feeders and nobody skilled or qualified in charge. They are more difficult to acquire, and it's cheaper if you don't try too hard to get them.

 

[Puddy]

Do you feel better abusing someone who points out an uncomfortable truth?

Focusing on the very few exceptions, which I had already mentioned, and having a tantie on their behalf does not change the overarching fact.

If the work was valued and skilled, then the base rate for a person with up to 4 years experience would be a damn sight more than $22 and hour.

And yet, unlike fruit picking - which is a dreadful analogy to use in comparison to almost anything - aged care homes don't have a great deal of trouble filling the majority drone positions. Far more likely to be running shifts with all bottom feeders and nobody skilled or qualified in charge. They are more difficult to acquire, and it's cheaper if you don't try too hard to get them.

So a job that requires study and a months unpaid placement is A unskilled worker. You wear a suit to work, get paid alot of money to sit and essentially do nothing doesn't mean you have skills.

If you make a simple mistake in aged care, people die. You grow to love the residents as you see them more than your own family. Suggesting aged care workers are bottom feeders due to low pay is very disrespectful

 

[BigPond101]

China is completely done with covid19

 

[Looney]

Here is another factor no one seems to talking about. Every time a virus infects a new host, it mutates a little bit. most of the times its harmless, but as the virus rapidly spreads to new hosts, It increases the odds of the virus mutating into a new strain that is much deadlier than the previous. All the vaccines that the world is working on will be useless and would have to start from scratch again.

Covid19's behavior is eerily similar to the Spanish Flu over a 100 years ago. It originally only affected infants and elderly, but only when the virus mutated, it killed anywhere between 50 - 100 million people in one year. That was when earth's population was less than 2 billion. So if history were to repeat itself, we're in big trouble.

 

[Chief]

China is completely done with covid19

Or they think they are.

 

[3KZ is Football]

“No President, with the exception of Abraham Lincoln, has done more for testing than I have. They say I could be better than Lincoln, I don’t know, but the television ratings for me catching the Chinese Flu, dont forget that they never should have let it escape and there will be consequences, beautiful consequences for us, not for them, but my television ratings have set records never before seen and Lincoln, he was a great President, so they say, but his television ratings were terrible after he was assassinated. We have people, very good, smart people looking at that assassination and they say, this is what my top people, people who are so top, you know who they are, involved ANTIFA and they are going to try to destroy our suburbs, because Sleepy Joe didn’t stop them when they assassinated Lincoln. Crazy Bernie and Pocahontas stopped him, because they are running the Democrats, not Sleepy Joe and they are going to destroy our suburbs and stop NASCAR and take your guns and bibles and make you listen to REM. They are from Athens, Georgia a great University town, I could have studied there, because I am a very stable genius, nobody writes about that, and a great State, beautiful State, they voted for me when I was running against Crooked Hillary, but one day REM will just a disappear because they say “everybody hurts” that’s what my top people tell me, but that is fake news, because I don’t hurt and I have the Wuhan Plague from China.”

 

[The 747]

So it seems maybe the great Swedish strategy - amusing that an incredibly left wing country has become the darling of the alt-rigtht - is not going so well:

Sweden COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Sweden Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Guess this strategy did not cause COVID to die off in Sweden. Welp.