Cricket Discussion - Part 1

[1954]

Whatevs m8... Another 68 for Zakky yesterday !

I'm going to have to rename you the tonkster.

 

[Zakk Wylde]

50 over cricket is dead.

 

[edgie]

Noooooooooooooooo!

Sent from my Lumia 800 using Tapatalk

 

[Papa G]

50 over cricket is dead.

Yep. It'll be women's 20/20 as far as the eye can see. The future has arrived.

 

[Jakksynn]

Really hope 50 over cricket doesn't die. It's the best of both worlds. Some of the best cricket I've seen has come from ODI's.

 

[Hellgood]

It's not dead. Just needs to be more appropriately fixtured.

 

[chiwigi]

Found some quotes from that game -

'It's been a rollercoaster ride,' she said. 'This is a step up from the cricket I've played with the Walmley men's team in Birmingham, and sometimes you want to refresh yourself with other challenges.'

'The pace of the bowling was what I'd expect, but the main difference is that I spent 90% of my time standing back.'
'In women's cricket, I stand back for Katherine Brunt and the first few overs from Anya Shrubsole, but the rest of the time I'm standing up to the stumps.'


Karen Rolton, one of Australia's all time best players wasn't overly crash hot when she consistently played B and C Grade district cricket for Port Adelaide against the men.

Men's District sides would slaughter the Australian women.

I don't understand why being female would make this the case.
Cricket is the perfect type of sport for unisex teams.
Being a wicket keeper or a spinner doesn't require a penis, nor should good batting.

 

[chiwigi]

You could swim in the river of misogyny about women in sport just in this thread alone.

Come on guys, lift your shit.

Sport is a difficult one for equality as it is inherently unequal. The aim of most sports is to be physically more dominant than your opponent using a combination of speed and strength with some skill thrown in to differentiate. It is beyond any reasonable argument that men possess these abilities to a degree that women cannot ever achieve.

So what we are left with are female dominated sports and male dominated sports. I don't think anyone is reasonably critical of women having the right to play footy, but when it is sold to us as a product a discerning fan is entitled to question the quality of the product and the need for such a product.

 

[Lagooner]

I don't understand why being female would make this the case.
Cricket is the perfect type of sport for unisex teams.
Being a wicket keeper or a spinner doesn't require a penis, nor should good batting.

When you consider that some of the greats have been short people (Tendulkar, Lara) there's no physical reason why women couldn't become elite at batting. I think it's more of a development/opportunity issue.

Elite fast bowling on the other hand does require certain physical characteristics that women (and the majority of men) simply just don't have.

 

[chiwigi]

When you consider that some of the greats have been short people (Tendulkar, Lara) there's no physical reason why women couldn't become elite at batting. I think it's more of a development/opportunity issue.

Elite fast bowling on the other hand does require certain physical characteristics that women (and the majority of men) simply just don't have.

Exactly, there must be a place in cricket to break that barrier.

 

[bomberclifford]

When you consider that some of the greats have been short people (Tendulkar, Lara) there's no physical reason why women couldn't become elite at batting. I think it's more of a development/opportunity issue.

Elite fast bowling on the other hand does require certain physical characteristics that women (and the majority of men) simply just don't have.

Our best ever bowler was an immature fatboy with a diet you could cater for with a Chrisco heat'n'eat hamper.

The ability to spin the ball as he did was not based on superior male strength or fitness.

 

[Papa G]

Agree to disagree on that Bomber. There's a fair bit of strength involved even in spin bowling. The fizz Warne could get on the ball was absolutely amazing and if you ever watched up close his deliveies were surprising quick. The pace Warne bowled was not dissimilar to many of the women coming off the long run.

 

[bomberclifford]

Agree to disagree on that Bomber. There's a fair bit of strength involved even in spin bowling. The fizz Warne could get on the ball was absolutely amazing and if you ever watched up close his deliveies were surprising quick. The pace Warne bowled was not dissimilar to many of the women coming off the long run.

Must have been all the pies with chips building up the strength in his rotator cuff.

 

[Lagooner]

Our best ever bowler was an immature fatboy with a diet you could cater for with a Chrisco heat'n'eat hamper.

The ability to spin the ball as he did was not based on superior male strength or fitness.

I pacifically menchend ferst boweling bomber learn 2 red gosh!

 

[1954]

Agree to disagree on that Bomber. There's a fair bit of strength involved even in spin bowling. The fizz Warne could get on the ball was absolutely amazing and if you ever watched up close his deliveies were surprising quick. The pace Warne bowled was not dissimilar to many of the women coming off the long run.

Agreed, Warnie must have had an unbelievably strong wrist to get that amount of fizz and overspin on the ball, for over after over.

Re comparisons between the standard of male and female cricketers, I'm not comparing her to Warne ( obviously ), but the `medium ' pacer who bowled 2 of the last 3 overs in the first innings of the 2nd game on Saturday ( against the Stars? ), off what looked like a 10 - 12 metre run up, was sending down 100-105 kph full tosses and lollipops, that I suspect any regular cricketer of the male variety would have had little trouble smacking out of the park.
There was no movement, there was no dip, she was just putting the ball up there to be hit.

 

[Zakk Wylde]

When you consider that some of the greats have been short people (Tendulkar, Lara) there's no physical reason why women couldn't become elite at batting. I think it's more of a development/opportunity issue.

Elite fast bowling on the other hand does require certain physical characteristics that women (and the majority of men) simply just don't have.

I don't disagree with this.

Women's bowling is the real difference. And unless they are developed batting against men from a young age, the jump at a latter age to start facing bowling that they haven't encountered before will be too hard.

The bowling on the other hand will never be as good.

 

[Papa G]

Yeah but Zoe Goss got Brian Lara out once....

 

[Zakk Wylde]

Yeah but Zoe Goss got Brian Lara out once....

The old adage that anyone can get anyone out.

 

[1954]

I don't disagree with this.

Women's bowling is the real difference. And unless they are developed batting against men from a young age, the jump at a latter age to start facing bowling that they haven't encountered before will be too hard.

The bowling on the other hand will never be as good.

Agreed axeman, the quality of women's bowling is it in a nutshell.

The aforementioned Karen Rolton has a 200 plus not out in a test match, and a 150 plus not out in an ODI.

Her test average was over 50, and her ODI average was more than 40, but I believe her highest score for Port B grade ( against men ), was somewhere in the low 30's.
Someone may be able to supply more info on her career with Port in the district comp, but it doesn't get a mention on her Wikipedia page.

She was obviously an outstanding women's cricketer, but it appears she may have struggled to cope with the hustle and bustle of male bowlers.

 

[1954]

The old adage that anyone can get anyone out.

My best mate put one past Gary Sobers in the Adelaide oval nets many moons ago, but the highest grade he reached was Woodville `C ' grade.

 

[Garibaldi Red]

She was obviously an outstanding women's cricketer, but it appears she may have struggled to cope with the hustle and bustle of male bowlers.

And chirpy keepers

 

[Lagooner]

I don't disagree with this.

Women's bowling is the real difference. And unless they are developed batting against men from a young age, the jump at a latter age to start facing bowling that they haven't encountered before will be too hard.

The bowling on the other hand will never be as good.

Agreed axeman, the quality of women's bowling is it in a nutshell.

The aforementioned Karen Rolton has a 200 plus not out in a test match, and a 150 plus not out in an ODI.

Her test average was over 50, and her ODI average was more than 40, but I believe her highest score for Port B grade ( against men ), was somewhere in the low 30's.
Someone may be able to supply more info on her career with Port in the district comp, but it doesn't get a mention on her Wikipedia page.

She was obviously an outstanding women's cricketer, but it appears she may have struggled to cope with the hustle and bustle of male bowlers.

I guess this ties back into what Zakk mentioned though.

If Rolton developed her game against 140km thunderbolts on a regular basis then she probably would've performed better against men. Like I said in my post above, that's a development/opportunity problem, not a physical one.

You don't need to be a physical powerhouse to be a good batsman (or batswoman ). But you do need good coordination, discipline and reflexes, especially against the quicks.

It's a similar skill set to that of racing car drivers in many respects and women have demonstrated that they are able to compete with men in that arena.

 

[1954]

I guess this ties back into what Zakk mentioned though.

If Rolton developed her game against 140km thunderbolts on a regular basis then she probably would've performed better against men. Like I said in my post above, that's a development/opportunity problem, not a physical one.

You don't need to be a physical powerhouse to be a good batsman (or batswoman ). But you do need good coordination, discipline and reflexes, especially against the quicks.

It's a similar skill set to that of racing car drivers in many respects and women have demonstrated that they are able to compete with men in that arena.

Fair point, if Rolton had been allowed to play against males from a younger age she probably would have been better equipped in later years, and one can only wonder what extra havoc she would have caused in the female comps then.


From memory she had to get special permission from the saca to be allowed to play district cricket against men.

 

[Zakk Wylde]

I did play against Rolton in a B Grade game.

Clearly she can hold a bat and technically is very sound. We knocked her over cheaply.

 

[mic59]

England resume on the last day 6 wickets down and nearly immediately lose Johnny Bairstow, who is third time unlucky with reviewing the decision. There are cyclones raining in parts of India and although they are pretty far away at the moment they can move quickly on the sub-continent and could easily mean there will only be a bit more than one session left.

EDIT : Woakes is also out for a duck and the score is 8/191.