Draft hits and misses

[Vdubs]

Agree with everything here bar the bolded, although crippled was probably to strong a word from me. Anyone remember his build up before I think it was 03 how everyone thought he was the pre season bolter?

Agree, great first year, but we excused his really poor kicking because of his youth and size. Problem was, he deteriorated if anything over time, and his injury was not the issue.

 

[Hot Tin Roof]

'92 was a strange draft period. Didn't yield a whole lot for us, until you include the picks we used from Colby's later trade to snare Moondog and (Boris, after picks were thrown around), plus one or two others iirc (don't remember who they were).

DRAFT .PICK... NAME ..GAMES
National 18 Leigh Colbert 105
National 33 Corey Robertson 0
National 48 Andrew Osborne 0
National 63 Matthew McMurray 0
National 65 Gerard Power 0
National 78 Damien Crowe 0
National 93 Adam Shanahan 0
National 108 Bryan Beinke 0
Pre-Season 18 Matthew McMartin 0
Pre-Season 34 Shane Crothers 4
Pre-Season 48 Mark Ballan 0
Pre-Season 61 Daniel Fletcher 1
Pre-Season 70 Shayne Breuer 71
Pre-Season 77 Damon Lukins

 

[THE CAT WRANGLER]

Surprised no-one's mentioned David Ugrinic yet.

Gold !

 

[The Quandrinator]

Misses:

McKay
Hooper
Tenace
David Clarke jnr
Spriggs
Christian O'Brien
Ezra Bray
Cameron Roberts
Hamish Simpson
Daniel Foster
Matthew Mc Carthy
Henry Playfair
Peter Street
Adam Houlihan

I' m getting tired a lot of duds

I don't know that pick 79 (H Simpson) or 69 (M McCarthy) can really be considered 'Misses'. That's my broader problem with the article - they were counting some number 1 and 2 selections as "Hits" - FFS!!!

A lot of those go back to pre-Brian Cook. It was Cook who instituted the selection criteria used so well by Wells.

 

[Seeds]

Misses:

McKay
Hooper
Tenace
David Clarke jnr
Spriggs
Christian O'Brien
Ezra Bray
Cameron Roberts
Hamish Simpson
Daniel Foster
Matthew Mc Carthy
Henry Playfair
Peter Street
Adam Houlihan

I' m getting tired a lot of duds

Not all those players were duds though. Some were actually pretty good value considering the picks we used on them.

 

[Seeds]

Paul Chambers?

Loats was an even bigger miss.

 

[Seeds]

Is it just Geelong? Because James Hird has him beat. Pick 79. Although his coaching career is a bit of a shambles. But good on Boris. Def has a great career.

As does Chris Grant and half of the West Coast Eagles side from the early 90's who were all taken with picks above 100.

 

[Seeds]

Has there been a worse player on our list than Ben Finnin? Can anyone beat that?

 

[Seeds]

I could have mea and named others ...

Gillies
Adam Varcoe
Scott Simpson
Dan McKenna
Adam Donohue
Brodie Moles
Nathan Djekkura
Joel Reynolds


Etc etc

We never drafted Varcoe or Reynolds. Both of who could play anyway and only injuries cut them down. Now Dan McKenna. There was a stinker.

 

[Partridge]

Mitch Brown I'd throw in the list of misses even though injuries hurt him.

Harry Taylor was a mature recruit but has to go down as one of Wells's finest pickup's given what he's done from literally day 1 and beyond.

Taylor's been sensational. A couple of iffy moments in his first year (including unfortunately one in the Grand Final) but otherwise slotted in seamlessly.

If you're going to include Brown there are a few other current players to add as well. Simpson and Vardy for starters.

 

[Partridge]

Very subjective in some ways, but there were plenty of objective markers to support my thoughts here:

Spriggs was not crippled by injury.
He made a full recovery and just never produced anything but ordinary skill levels.
Houlihan definitely had lots of ability, but was perhaps too much the outside receiver.
Tenace, like D Clarke jnr, and Spriggs- more pace than skill. Their skill deficiencies and resultant lack of confidence was costly.

That's because he spent all of his recovery time smoking dope. He couldn't handle the fact he wasn't the best of the best anymore and mentally wasn't tough enough (I got to know a very, very close friend of his).

 

[Sttew]

Taylor's been sensational. A couple of iffy moments in his first year (including unfortunately one in the Grand Final) but otherwise slotted in seamlessly.

Everything about the Taylor recruitment had "ingenious" written over it! AA, Matthew Egan is cut down by a potentially career ending injury. Within weeks we snare little known Harry Taylor at pick 17 as "insurance" in case Egan doesn't recover. The rest is history. From one AA CHB to a dual AA CHB.

 

[speedybundy]

Agree, great first year, but we excused his really poor kicking because of his youth and size. Problem was, he deteriorated if anything over time, and his injury was not the issue.

I reckon his injury was a major part though, showed how talented he could be but was inconsistent during 2001 before missing out on all of 2002. Never got back to anywhere near some of the games he produced in 2001.

 

[Vdubs]

Has there been a worse player on our list than Ben Finnin? Can anyone beat that?

Yes.
David Loates.
We recruited him injured, he played injured, maybe once.
Hawks must have licked their lips.

 

[jim boy]

Has there been a worse player on our list than Ben Finnin? Can anyone beat that?

We didn't pick him up in the draft, so he shouldn't be on the list.

In a way he was a hit. Not because he was a decent footballer - it's fair to say that he was never going to get anywhere near the ones, but because the deal was that we got rid of Ronnie Burns, and that was of benefit top us as it freed up salary space (although we did continue to pay some of his wage at Adelaide) on a deal where we stupidly signed him on for years. Because of the rules at the time, Adelaide had to give us a draft pick which we had to use, or a player - we would have let ronnie go for nothing if it was allowed. Adelaide weren't going to give us either, except for some no-hoper who we both knew would never play. So we got what we wanted out of that deal.

 

[And_ROOS]

Ahh memories...

 

[Seeds]

Yes.
David Loates.
We recruited him injured, he played injured, maybe once.
Hawks must have licked their lips.

True. I named him two posts after I posted that one.

 

[vinum coupe]

was Brown injured this season at all?

I'll let you in on something as it sounds like you missed it, Vardy and Simpson did not get through a full pre season because Vardy had a groin injury and Simpson had a back injury and both returned to the VFL at the beginning of May in order to build up on their fitness.
When you take this into consideration and then look at what they were able to do at senior level for the rest of the year, it sort of highlights the difference in quality between all three players as 2 not only matched it at VFL level, they actually went on and held their own in the AFL, something your idol has not been able to achieve thus far for reasons you choose to ignore.

Bobby. Aside from playing out of position in the ruck. Tell me how Vardy has held his own?
And the other player you quote is 206cm FFS.

 

[Vdubs]

Marcus Drum.
May have been talented, but one of the unluckiest recruits we've ever had; did we really get him? Wouldn't know what he even looks like.

 

[Strangled Cat]

Cat Wrangler always bitches and moans about the team even when they win

And his namesake on bay 13 is one of the biggest Hawthorn flogs you'll see on bigfooty. I wonder if there's a connection?

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

The main thing that makes Tenace's relative failure easier to deal with is that 2003 was an incredibly weak draft overall, a few serviceable players were taken after Tenace like Adcock, Stanton and Buchanan but overall the list is a mess of nobodies or players inferior to our list needs at the time.

 

[Sttew]

Marcus Drum.
May have been talented, but one of the unluckiest recruits we've ever had; did we really get him? Wouldn't know what he even looks like.

Hope we won't be saying the same about Hamish McIntosh, except we all know what he looks like.

 

[Partridge]

was Brown injured this season at all?

I'll let you in on something as it sounds like you missed it, Vardy and Simpson did not get through a full pre season because Vardy had a groin injury and Simpson had a back injury and both returned to the VFL at the beginning of May in order to build up on their fitness.
When you take this into consideration and then look at what they were able to do at senior level for the rest of the year, it sort of highlights the difference in quality between all three players as 2 not only matched it at VFL level, they actually went on and held their own in the AFL, something your idol has not been able to achieve thus far for reasons you choose to ignore.

Where did I say he was my idol? Got a quote handy for that? I'm simply willing to give more time to young players than you clearly are.

Speaking of "choose to ignore", you have said this about Vardy (and Simpson):

"When you take this into consideration and then look at what they were able to do at senior level for the rest of the year"...

What Vardy was able to do? Are you serious? I'll give you some stats on YOUR IDOL (to make a braindead assumption like you just did) for the year 2013:

- Recorded under 10 possessions 5 times in 10 games
- 8 touches and 6 hitouts against Fremantle in a QUALIFYING FINAL
- 4 touches and 9 hitouts against Sydney
- 9 touches and 4 hitouts against North
- a truly awesome 5 touches and 6 hitouts against GWS
- As a goalkicker, 4 goals in his last 6 games of the season
- Averaged only 8.8 touches, and 2.9 marks per game (the apparently hideous Brown somehow managed 11.6 and 4.4 respectively)

In 2013, Vardy played precisely TWO good games. His first game against Gold Coast when he kicked 4, and against St.Kilda when he stepped up when Simpson went off and had by far his best game in the ruck. Otherwise, he has not come close to doing enough. I'd be curious to know how you rate the St.Kilda effort, as Brown was also terrific in the same game. No doubt in Brown's case it will be due to weak opposition / no pressure, with Vardy it's probably clear proof of general awesomeness.

The truth is neither player has made it, and neither have done enough. Both need to do way more to prove they belong at the top level. Difference is I'm willing to give both players that chance.

 

[vinum coupe]

I think Shoenmakers is another example of how a tall back can develop if you give him the chance.
It was a real shame he went down this year because he was starting to look imposing.

 

[Partridge]

I think Shoenmakers is another example of how a tall back can develop if you give him the chance.
It was a real shame he went down this year because he was starting to look imposing.

Schoenmakers? He did. As much as we enjoyed bagging him he looked a far better player this year than before. We just seem very reluctant to learn that players mature at different rates and some take longer than others. How impatient we are is pretty ridiculous really.