Equalisation in the AFL

[Windhover]

I understand the AFL has implemented policies and distributed support "packages" to teams to help balance the league, but it has had very little to no impact in actually equalising the league. It clearly isn't working and all this talk of equalisation has been a farce. Heck, at round 10 the top 8 was basically confirmed. All the next 13 rounds are for is to sort out the top 8 order and the draft order.

The talk of equalisation was, is and always will be a farce.

Before the season began no one in their right mind would have given tuppence for the chances of Essendon, Carlton, Brisbane, Gold Coast or St Kilda even making the finals nor Melbourne or Richmond winning the flag. That's 7 teams written off winning before the year began.

Next year it is already safe to say Ess, Carl, Brisbane, Gold Coast, Rich, Saints, Freo will have no chance of winning the flag and only the Saints have any prospects of making finals. So all these Clubs (if they have any sense) are busily manipulating the "equalisation" rules, paying over the odds now so they can hope to pay less later, improve draft position by "playing the kids" because, overtly, it is not "about this year". And we are meant to pretend it is an 18 team competition. Bah!

If we ever achieved true "equalisation" we would end up with 18 mediocre teams that look much like Richmond. This is not a surprise. Richmond have probably done less than any other team to try and manipulate the Rules to achieve success. The biggest "name" recruited from another club on their list is Yaz and that sure has done them well. Otherwise, because of salary cap, all their other recruits from other clubs were players that weren't then guaranteed a game: Hampson, Grigg, Maric, Miles, Townsend, Hunt and Andrew Moore. Except Chaplin, but he isn't worth a game now. What a sack of spuds.

 

[gbatman]

Hawthorn's success comes from many areas, being up the top and "built" when the new franchise teams were coming in gave them a huge advantage as it's kept the other sides who were building down. It really knocked a side like us for 6. Their deep list means they are able to rest aging players and manage them so that they can play for longer, no doubt if Judd was a Hawk he'd still be going and going well. Because they are winning they are able to sign players for less and recruit easier because players really want to be there. No doubt they have recruited really well but they do have an advantage that other sides don't have. Very much enjoying the perks of being up the top.

The gulf between the top sides and the bottom sides is massive. Just giving the bottom sides an early pick is clearly not good enough. Success needs to be built relatively quickly, especially if it's to be sustainable. The current AFL system doesn't work, the game has moved in a way that makes sure that it doesn't work. As I mentioned before, the only way of fixing it is to change the draft order how I suggested it.

A few early picks may have worked 10 or 15 years ago but no longer. The distance between picks it too far apart because there are more teams. The game is far less individualistic and more team structured. While a few guns can still carry a side, they can't to the extent they used to, particularly forwards. The game is more physically demanding and hence teams expect to use more players per year. One or two gun kids done make much of an impact, these bottom sides need 2 or 4 gun kids to impact and the current system doesn't really allow for that unless you trade and that still means you're losing something as well.

Give the bottom sides more and the top sides less.

 

[P_Crippy]

Since 1985
Hawthorn 8 flags
Essendon 3 Flags
Geelong 3 Flags
Brisbane 3 flags
West Coast 3 Flags
Carlton 2 flags
Collingwood 2 flags
North 2 flags
Adelaide 2 flags
Sydney 2 flags
Port 1 flag

31 years, 11 different premiers and only one without multiple flags. This tells me equalisation isn't/hasn't worked.

 

[BlueJet]

Since 1985
Hawthorn 8 flags
Essendon 3 Flags
Geelong 3 Flags
Brisbane 3 flags
West Coast 3 Flags
Carlton 2 flags
Collingwood 2 flags
North 2 flags
Adelaide 2 flags
Sydney 2 flags
Port 1 flag

31 years, 11 different premiers and only one without multiple flags. This tells me equalisation isn't/hasn't worked.

Why? Pretty much all of those clubs have done their time near the bottom of the ladder as well.

 

[P_Crippy]

Why? Pretty much all of those clubs have done their time near the bottom of the ladder as well.

I guess it depends on what the afl view as equalisation. I get your point, but all the teams missing from that list have done their time down the bottom as well.
My personal view with equalisation is that it should have gotten more difficult for clubs to win consecutive number of flags.

 

[BlueJet]

I guess it depends on what the afl view as equalisation. I get your point, but all the teams missing from that list have done their time down the bottom as well.
My personal view with equalisation is that it should have gotten more difficult for clubs to win consecutive number of flags.

That's fair enough too, my concern is that if it goes too far that way it begins to resemble a kids game of pass the parcel where everybody gets a prize whether it's warranted or not.
For example, clubs like Hawthorn were on deaths door before rebuilding themselves as a powerhouse, Collingwood are onto their third rebuild since Carlton was last a contender, WCE are similar.
In my opinion, some just do it better than others and provided that all clubs are working within the same parameters, I don't think that can be changed.

Sent from my SM-N915G using Tapatalk

 

[footyfan1978]

Unlike you I do not enjoy the equalisation system. It intentionally rewards mediocrity which should be anathema to any sporting contest.

I never said I enjoy equalisation. I just accept that is the system that the league use to ensure a few clubs do not dominate. We actually would have been one of the few clubs to dominate. However what would have become of the league without a salary cap in place. I suspect about 6 clubs would have gone to the wall. As a football industry it is very sad to see Fitzroy gone from the league but at least all those other clubs that came close to bankruptcy have not been killed off.

It does reward mediocrity but it is nothing new, the league have been using this system for well over two decades now. They are not going back to what was happening before. As a club we simply have to embrace this is the way things run in league. We saw what happened about 15 years back when Elliott that was old school thinker oversaw our club not embrace it seriously. Nearly sent us to the wall and we no longer have our own home ground as a result. It has been very very dark times. What I am enjoying is not the equalisation system, but enjoying seeing my club for first time actually work with the system and see if we find a way back to becoming a power premiership winning club despite the challenges this system puts on the task at hand. I finally see some light. That is what I am enjoying.

 

[Blue Pulse]

The biggest revenue maker for any club, be it AFL, VFL or amateur would be playing games at their home venue and receiving gate takings, a % of food and drinks etc. Some of the deals in place at the moment, if a poor crowd attend the match the club is forking out to play a game - this is ludicrous. Geelong, Freo and WCE have a huge advantage at the moment as do clubs that have brokered good ground deals, this is something I believe that the AFL should control if they want equalisation.
Administration plays a huge part as you can see by clubs who have faltered and then quickly have risen back to the finals, WCE, Adelaide. It will be interesting to see how Freo go now that they have a new ground deal where the WAFC does not hold the purse strings

 

[footyfan1978]

It is interesting to think if the equalisation policies of salary cap and draft had not come into the league in 1980's where would we be now as a league ?
Carlton, Essendon and Hawthorn were clearly the bet run clubs at the time. I suspect the way most of other clubs were being run to try to keep up would have seen many gone. Collingwood, Richmond, Footscray, St.Kilda and Fitzroy clearly would have gone. I suspect Melbourne and even Sydney Swans would have died. North Melbourne experiment into private ownership may have eventually worked for them and possibly Geelong would have survived. They obviously sold off several players to Sydney run Edelsten in 1986 to keep their finances in check. I think the path would have seen new franchises with private owners become a thing. I doubt Sydney Swans would have survived. As it was they got into terrible trouble in early 1990's so I think they would have gone to the wall. A new Syndey franchise would have needed to be given a licence in the league. Maybe Sydney Giants would be the only NSW franchise and Gold Coast Suns the Queensland licence etc etc.

If it worked we would probably see a league something like Carlton, Essendon, Hawthorn, North Melbourne, Geelong, Sydney Giants, Gold Coast Suns, West Coast Eagles, Fremantle Dockers, Port Adelaide Power, Adelaide Crows and Tasmania of some sort.
We would play 15 times in Melbourne and 7 times interstate each home and away season and probably still using a final five.
It would be an open market system and every chance new franchises come and go regularly into and out of existence.
Clearly a 12 club league would see high standard better teams at top end.
What we have now with 18 clubs and talented spread more thinly across it all is not at same level it would have been with a 12 club league.

 

[The Blue Baggers]

This really irks me too.
We are effectively propping up clubs that are in a better position both on and off the field than us.
The AFL just seem to chose who they will help, if they are north of the
Victorian border you will get looked after.
It is also unfair that the AFL have paid for Paul Roos to coach Melbourne for the last 3 years when they have debt much less than we do and only had themselves to blame for the position they were in. I wonder if Roos' salary was included in Melbourne's footy department spending. Probably not.
We have a terrible Etihad deal and according to Greg Swann it was worse than most of the other clubs yet we get nothing from the AFL.
Melbourne also got pick 3 as compo for losing Frawley using some "formula" than no one understood. They also get compensation from the MCC because they have the highest number of MCC members who nominate Melbourne as their club, yet other clubs get nothing even though they also have many MCC members too.
It is a joke and so unfair.
We get shafted at every opportunity and just sit back and take it.

that is actually crap , ian collins chose to take a big up front payment to move games to the docklands

that said it was still way under's what we were offered to move their when the ground 1st opened !!

 

[Dramoth]

I wonder if clubs getting a free agent should lose their next pick, rather than every club effectively paying for a FA by dropping backwards in the draft.

That should be applicable to restricted free agents.

 

[BluesRule]

That should be applicable to restricted free agents.

Agree it should not include DFA's

 

[Dramoth]

Agree it should not include DFA's

It shouldn't include unrestricted FA's as well.

Someone does their 10 years at a club, the club has basically had them for the majority of their career and unless that team is a perennial bottom dweller, they shouldn't be rewarded for losing a player.

 

[harmesy 37]

There is a big problem with equalisation in the AFL, for sure. The teams up the top sustain this through good admin for sure. They also sustain this because player retention is easier and it's easier for them to recruit, they can keep good players on less money and also entice players to come their way and due to already having a geep list they have more talented spill over to trade with. Teams up the top really have it over teams down the bottom.

Problem with AFL is they still try and think like other sports in the world, but it's not. AFL has 18 on the field and 22 in a team which is huge compared to other sports so having access to one or two gun players isn't going to make a huge impact.

.

This is a good post as it points out some of the problems with trying to get a good team together with one good pick per year to turn around a team that has been down the bottom of the ladder for years.

There is still a general perception that it is ALL Carlton's fault they are in this position. If only Carlton recruited better etc, had better coaches. This isn't the answer. We are told to all rely on the draft to turn around our fortunes, but then we are also told to ignore how the AFL steps in to assist preferred clubs move up the ladder.

A previous poster mentioned the assistance Melbourne got. Then there was North Melbourne.

Next on the AFL hit list will be Brisbane. Caroline Wilson is on that bandwagon ..give assistance to Brisbane etc. but they have just won 3 premierships in recent years. How much assistance does a team with 3 AFL premierships need? And is it Carlton's duty to suffer so as to assist Brisbane moving up the ladder? Every time they assist a club the clubs around them suffer.




The difficulty with relying on the draft is that let's say you get one Weitering per year, ie your team is improving by 5% per year, at the same time, your older players are taking on injuries and deteriorating by 5%. The simple maths do not allow a quick progression for a bottom team up the ladder as a result.


We should be copying the NRL method then as they are obtaining a range of victors. No draft, but keep the salary cap.

 

[harmesy 37]

Let's copy the NRL system and do away with the draft.

In the AFL It isn't working. There is no equalisation. Hawthorn will win it this year, and that means four boring grand finals in a row.

In a competitive sporting market place with rugby league making ground and soccer surely the time has come to make some changes.

No more draft. Recruit players as you see fit as per the NRL system.
This would therefore strengthen the VFL/SANFL/WAFL/SEAFL comps as the players would more often be coming through the teams of these clubs. We would be recruiting from Williamstown, Geelong VFL, etc more and some from an under 18s competition. You choose who you want as long as it is under the cap.

The NRL haven't had back to back winners since 1992-93. Their system is working. Ours isn't. Get RID OF THE DRAFT.


http://www.nrl.com/2016-nrl-player-transfers/tabid/10874/newsid/88894/default.aspx

 

[harmesy 37]

We have been sold a pup with the draft.
Weitering "the great hope for the future for the Blues".
He might be an excellent player but he is ONE good player and then other clubs also pick up good players.

The system is broke. Get rid of it. No more draft.

 

[Styxx]

Equalisation was screwed when bottom level teams were effectively pushed out of the drafts for the sake of Gold Coast and GWS setting them back 5 to 10 years.

 

[thylacine60]

We have been sold a pup with the draft.
Weitering "the great hope for the future for the Blues".
He might be an excellent player but he is ONE good player and then other clubs also pick up good players.

The system is broke. Get rid of it. No more draft.

suggestions?

 

[Buckley00]

We have been sold a pup with the draft.
Weitering "the great hope for the future for the Blues".
He might be an excellent player but he is ONE good player and then other clubs also pick up good players.

The system is broke. Get rid of it. No more draft.

I said a few years ago the draft is bullshit.
You cannot build a good team with 1, top 10 draft pick every year, while other clubs have concessions
and academies. With the current draft system, it takes too long to build a premiership team.
Some top draft picks make the grade, some not.
The AFL have to change the current system, because the bottom teams are a long way off the top teams in the comp.

 

[harmesy 37]

suggestions?

One suggestion is for the AFL not to assist Brisbane. Not to assist Melbourne, North or Hawthorn either.

These are some of the thrashings I have witnessed as a Carlton supporter

Round 18, 2002 - Carlton lost by 108 points to Collingwood
Round 10, 2004 - Carlton lost by 108 points to St Kilda
Round 7, 2015 - Carlton lost by 77 points to GWS

There have been some big thrashings in-between that resulted in Carlton losing a lot of money (due to poor crowd numbers in part) but no real AFL financial assistance was forthcoming. (A loan was once given...)

Right now the three-time AFL premiers Brisbane are getting thrashed by GWS. The AFL are going to rush up there to assist them.
No thanks. If Carlton can incur thrashings Brisbane can too.
Let them suffer.

The suggestion is to get rid of the draft. The draft is the tool that keeps the bottom clubs down the bottom yet at the same time as appearing to create "equity". Your team gets pick one and another team gets pick 3...whoope-do. Big deal. That means nothing. Do you see any equity?
I don't see it....so get rid of the draft and teams can recruit as they see fit as long as they are under the cap.

 

[gbatman]

Don't get rid of the draft, just fix it. Modify it so that it suites the game and the times. It needs to evolve. I think a lottery system or zoning system would be a lot worse.

 

[harmesy 37]

Analysis of this is pretty poor.


It has taken my club well over two decades to buy into the new system that got brought in during late 1980's.
Last thing I want to see is system change again as soon as we actually embrace what has been in place for long time now.

People truly believe that Carlton didn't believe in "using the draft" up until a few years ago.
This is the media lie spun to ensure we blame it all on Carlton for their misfortune.

We only believed in "topping up" through trades is the common misconception that the media tell us. We don't "rebuild" we just buy in new players, yada, yada, yada.

So when Carlton recruited Andrew McKay - pick 13 1992 draft - that is sold to us as "not embracing the draft"?
Or when they got Camporeale at pick 15 in the 1994 draft - is that also "not embracing the draft"?

The fact is that up until the penalties for salary cap cheating Carlton was generally competitive whether or not "we embraced the draft" as the media spin it.
Since the cap penalties Carlton has frantically tried to elevate its position, making poor decisions to bridge that gap. Some good decisions, some bad decisions...but operating from a poor base.

Carlton is too far away now from the salary cap debacle to blame their predicament on those years. What they now have is an AFL system that assists clubs through various means, plus their own unlucky/poor judgement with recruitment/coaching. Can Carlton build through the present system with the draft?
Silvagni has done well, but it will take years to fill in the gaps. The system doesn't assist poor teams. Either the system changes or Carlton will have to wait years and years to be competitive.

 

[harmesy 37]

Don't get rid of the draft, just fix it. Modify it so that it suites the game and the times. It needs to evolve. I think a lottery system or zoning system would be a lot worse.

The draft isn't working.
The NRL system doesn't have a lottery, doesn't have zoning, doesn't have any of the concoctions we have and yet year after year another team wins their premiership, whatever it is called. Winfield Cup or whatever.
That system of the NRL hopefully would see more chance of a Carlton flag.

 

[Doro]

The draft isn't working.
The NRL system doesn't have a lottery, doesn't have zoning, doesn't have any of the concoctions we have and yet year after year another team wins their premiership, whatever it is called. Winfield Cup or whatever.
That system of the NRL hopefully would see more chance of a Carlton flag.

The NRL system isn't anything to covet. One scandal after another. They seem to have a different premier every year because Rugby offers the big dollars ( see Sonny Bill and Sam Burgess) and their clubs have a history of imploding upon lifting the trophy. The AFL system is clearly flawed in several ways, but the NRL is not the model to follow.

 

[thylacine60]

The draft isn't working.
The NRL system doesn't have a lottery, doesn't have zoning, doesn't have any of the concoctions we have and yet year after year another team wins their premiership, whatever it is called. Winfield Cup or whatever.
That system of the NRL hopefully would see more chance of a Carlton flag.

Not sure the AFL works to the 'more chance of Carlton winning a flag' ethos.