First Item On The List

[BlueMark]

Fallujah.

It will be nothing but 'liberated' rubble inside of two weeks.

The gloves will be taken off in Iraq now and the resulting toll of innocent lives will make Saddam look like an amateur.

 

[Dry Rot]

Time to bring "Bomber" Harris out of retirement.

 

[BlueMark]

There is no doubt the American and token Iraqi forces will secure the city. They have the numbers, technology and firepower to do so. The battle for Fallujah is the type of set piece battle the US excells at. BUT the insurgents are doing exactly what one would expect, giving a fairly determined resistance within the city itself but transferring the focus of thier attacks elsewhere.

As "The Art of War' teaches...attack your enemy where he is weakest and that is exactly what the insurgents have been doing. The Americans however keep trying to hit the insurgents where they are strongest, only to see them disperse and reform elsewhere.

So where is the insurgents weak point. The hearts and minds of the Iraqis, something the Americans have spectularly failed to win.

 

[Pessimistic]

My suggestion if the US continues its policy to bomb the crap out of a country before the locals even see an american soldier they will NEVER win 'hearts and minds'.

 

[BlueMark]

Seems the YS has been fudging the facts again.

The Iraqi battalion that has been committed to the fighting is made up of Kurds.

The 'hundreds' of terrorists killed is a slight over estimation so far the US forces have recovered 71 bodies from the city despite securing 70% of the city.

How the hell did the insurgents manage to capture a platoon of national guard (unless it is disinformation, it is a pretty poor performance by the Iraqis and the American protection troops embedded with each Iraqi unit)

As predicted the insurgents have shifted the focus of thier operations elsewhere. While the Americans will secure the city and claim 'victory' it seems thier objective of smashing the resistance will not have been met. Once the US forces leave then insurgents will return (Vietnam anyone?).

 

[Lestat]

Eyewitness: Defiance amid carnage
As US forces battle insurgents in streets strewn with rubble and corpses, Iraqi sources question the claims that the US controls much of Falluja. The BBC News website spoke by phone to Fadhil Badrani, a journalist in the city who reports for the BBC World Service in Arabic.



The heaviest fighting has been in the north of Falluja

I went for a walk around the city last night after the Americans pulled back.

It was very quiet - often the only sounds coming from the movement of fighters along streets and rooftops.

In places, it was also very dark, with only the occasional rocket or flare lighting the way.

Wherever I went, I found broken buildings and bodies - local people and fighters killed on the streets.

Clutching weapons

I also saw four crippled US tanks and three abandoned Humvees.

In the Hasbiyyah area, I counted the bodies of at least six US soldiers lying on the ground.


Click here for a satellite map of the city showing troop movements and key sites


Enlarge Image


Some of them were badly mangled with various bits blown off. Others were in better condition, as if they had taken small-arms fire.

I noticed two of the US soldiers were still clutching their guns tightly across their chests. But most of their weapons were missing.

Some of the dead are beginning to rot in the streets.

But the living do not exactly smell great either - I have not had a bath for a week. Nor have I shaved.

There is no real rest here, day or night.

Jolan flashpoint

The US brought in a very big force on Wednesday morning.

The mosques no longer broadcast the daily call to prayer but nor are they silent.


US soldiers evacuate a wounded colleague from Falluja

Every time a big bomb lands nearby, the cry rises from the minarets: "Allahu Akbar" [God is great].

The worst fighting is to the north of the city, in the Jolan district.

This is where a lot of the fighters have been based.

Incidentally, it is also where US security guards were ambushed in April, leading to the first siege of Falluja.

I think it is misleading to say the US controls 70% of the city because the fighters are constantly on the move.

They go from street to street, attacking the army in some places, letting them through elsewhere so that they can attack them later.

The fighters have told me they are prepared to resist the Americans until the death.

They say they are fighting not just for Falluja, but for all Iraq.

They express confidence that they will win in the end.

They say the idea is to inflict enough casualties on the American troops to force them to reconsider their mission.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3999899.stm

 

[Lestat]

Has anyone else noticed that US Marines seem to only fight someone after having called their aircraft to dump tons of bombs over their opponents' heads.

There is a fundamental difference among soldiers who really fight an enemy face to face and soldiers who only attack when their opponents are already seriously injured or dead.

Cowards...of the highest order!

 

[theGimp]

Has anyone else noticed that US Marines seem to only fight someone after having called their aircraft to dump tons of bombs over their opponents' heads.

There is a fundamental difference among soldiers who really fight an enemy face to face and soldiers who only attack when their opponents are already seriously injured or dead.

Cowards...of the highest order!

Its was man.. expect to be heavily criticised for this one.

 

[Lestat]

Its was man.. expect to be heavily criticised for this one.

Just stating facts Gimp.

Oh...and it appears that the greatest millitary in the world has been on the recieving end of a large number of casualties in Falluja...with there state of the art weaponry up against 'insurgents' armed with light weapons.

Its funny...for two days now CNN has told me time and time again, that 75% of Falluju is in US hands, and that the resistence the US has faced has been less then expected.

Yet 3 days later....the battle still rages on. Only the most ignorant could possibly believe any news that the US Millitary media chooses to release.

--------------------------------------------------------------

US toll mounts as Falluja battles rage


Friday 12 November 2004, 3:49 Makka Time, 0:49 GMT


The US-led military assault of Falluja entered its fourth day



Related:
US forces raid homes of AMS officials
Fighting in Falluja rages amid confusion
Mosques bombed in Falluja fighting
Falluja facing humanitarian crisis

Two US Super Cobra gunship helicopters have been downed in separate incidents near Falluja, a US military spokesman said.

A previously unknown group - the Green Brigade, member of the 1920 Revolution Brigades - claimed responsibility for downing one of the helicopters.

US officials said on Thursday that 18 soldiers had been killed since US-led troops launched their latest attack on Falluja on Monday.

Aljazeera also reported that five Iraqi national guards were killed while another 34 were wounded since 9 November.

In a sign of mounting US casualties, more than 100 American soldiers seriously wounded during the Falluja offensive arrived at the United States' main European military hospital in Germany, a hospital spokeswoman said.

The hospital has expanded its intensive care unit and medical surgical wards to cope with the stream of patients.

The US military flew 102 soldiers in two planeloads to the hospital, with a further two planes of wounded due on Friday, spokeswoman Marie Shaw said.

The US military said the total number of wounded as of Thursday morning stood at 178. It also said several hundred anti-US forces were killed in Falluja.

'Peak period'

"This is one of our peak periods. We are very busy. It is more than we have seen in the last couple of months because we used to admit about 30 patients a day," Shaw said.


Increasing numbers of wounded
US troops are being evacuated


Thursday's arrivals joined 125 wounded who arrived from Monday to Wednesday, including 70 on Wednesday.

Landstuhl is the usual destination for seriously injured US troops stationed in Iraq or Afghanistan.

"They have all kinds of injuries - explosion, blast injuries, gun shot wounds," she said. It was possible that some intensive care patients had also suffered amputated limbs, she said.

Upsurge in violence

In other developments, Aljazeera has learned that four Iraqi policemen were injured as a result of an explosion of a booby-trapped car driven by a bomber in central Hilla city. Another car also exploded inside a petrol station along the highway between Hilla and Musiab.

Also on Thursday, the police chief of Babel province escaped an assassination attempt carried out by a group of armed men using light weapons.



The attack on police stations in
Mosul seemed well coordinated


And in one of their most daring attacks to date, masked fighters stormed into six Iraqi police stations in Mosul, 370km north of Baghdad, seizing weapons and torching buildings, an AFP correspondent in the city said.

A group of men pulled up in front of police stations in various parts of the city on Thursday, forcing policemen out in what appeared to be a coordinated attack.

Dozens of people were seen fanning out on the city streets and some hunkered behind sandbags and were seen firing mortar rounds on US and Iraqi forces stationed on four of Mosul's five main bridges.

Mosul next?

Speaking on Monday, the same day that the massive attack was launched on the city of Falluja, Iraq's Defence Minister Hazim Shaalan vowed a campaign in Mosul.

"We will launch operations in Mosul, because some groupings that came from neighbouring western countries are trying to step up terror operations there," he said referring to Syria.

A US general also hinted at further offensives after the battle for Falluja - the largest military operation since last year's US-led invasion.

Mosul has seen a rash of car bombings against Iraqi and US forces in recent weeks.


Aljazeera + Agencies

 

[theGimp]

Just stating facts Gimp.

Oh...and it appears that the greatest millitary in the world has been on the recieving end of a large number of casualties in Falluja...with there state of the art weaponry up against 'insurgents' armed with light weapons.

Its funny...for two days now CNN has told me time and time again, that 75% of Falluju is in US hands, and that the resistence the US has faced has been less then expected.

Yet 3 days later....the battle still rages on. Only the most ignorant could possibly believe any news that the US Millitary media chooses to release.

It is a bit strange hey, I heard early day one that they had 2/3 of the city under control. With all the ass kicking they claim to be doing you would think that the ratio would have jumped dramatically.

They wouldnt be making it sound like its a cleaner and eaisier job than it actually is would they ?