Future Moon missions

[Elroo]

Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos claiming we'll return to the moon with manned missions by 2024. Im old enough to remember the last time we went to the moon, I watched them on very grainy tv's back then. Lets hope its more than a dream.

https://www.theage.com.au/business/...reveals-his-moon-mission-20190510-p51lx4.html

'Time to go back, this time to stay': Bezos reveals his moon mission

By Brad Stone
May 10, 2019 — 10.25am

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A little less than half a century ago, a pair of NASA astronauts packed up their geological samples after three days of roving and returned to Earth in the Apollo 17 lunar module. It was the last time that a human walked on the moon.
Now the world's wealthiest man, Amazon.com CEO Jeff Bezos, and the other company he founded, Blue Origin, want to chart the next chapter in humanity's exploration of its tiny orbiting sibling.


At a press conference in Washington, DC on Thursday afternoon, Bezos made his case for going back to the moon and showed off his private space company's lunar lander.
"It's time to go back to the moon, this time to stay," Bezos said.

On stage at the event, Bezos dropped the curtain behind him to reveal Blue Origin's Blue Moon lander. The craft features a large internal spherical fuel tank and sits atop four landing pads. It's powered by liquid hydrogen, in part so it can be refuel from ice water on the moon's poles. Hydrogen fuel cells will power the device through the lunar night.
"This is an incredible vehicle," Bezos said, "and it's going to the moon."

Jeff Bezos in front of a model of Blue Origin's Blue Moon lunar lander on Thursday.Credit:AP
Manned missions to start by 2024

 

[Werewolf]

I'm super keen for more Moon exploration - stuff the cost blowouts and any other excuses! NASA are leading the way once again.

They have the Artemis program which will use the Space Launch System (SLS) and Orion capsule. Artemis 1 will be an uncrewed test flight, Artemis 2 will be a crewed mission to the moon without the landing, then hopefully Artemis 3 will land the next man and first woman on the Moon in 2024.

With sufficient funding, these missions should evolve into a permanent lunar base and mining for valuable metals (titanium, rare Earths).

The Russians and Chinese are also sniffing around, but won't execute manned landings until the 2030's at the earliest. Exciting times!

 

[Werewolf]

The landing of two astronauts near the lunar south pole in 2024 is still going ahead *fingers crossed*

NASA outlines plans to send humans to the moon for the first time in more than 50 years

NASA has unveiled its latest plans to land the first woman and the next man on the surface of the moon in 2024.

www.abc.net.au

 

[darth_timon]

I'm not sure about Moon missions. I'd like to to see more missions aimed at the moons of Jupiter and Saturn, especially Europa. That being said, a Moon base could one day prove to be extremely useful.

Sent from my ELE-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[Werewolf]

I'm not sure about Moon missions. I'd like to to see more missions aimed at the moons of Jupiter and Saturn, especially Europa. That being said, a Moon base could one day prove to be extremely useful.

That would be great too, but the context here is mostly on manned missions. This rules out anything beyond Mars in the foreseeable future. Ongoing trips outside of low Earth orbit won't really become economical until better propulsion systems are invented. Rocket technology hasn't improved substantially since the Apollo days in that you still need >90% of the rocket mass to be fuel. Newer rocket engines can have fewer parts, greater reliability and maybe re-use of components has improved, but improvements in thrust have been marginal and fuel consumption is still very high.

Anyway, I'm more interested in the possibility that mining on the Moon could sufficiently offset the costs of getting the equipment there.

 

[darth_timon]

That would be great too, but the context here is mostly on manned missions. This rules out anything beyond Mars in the foreseeable future. Ongoing trips outside of low Earth orbit won't really become economical until better propulsion systems are invented. Rocket technology hasn't improved substantially since the Apollo days in that you still need >90% of the rocket mass to be fuel. Newer rocket engines can have fewer parts, greater reliability and maybe re-use of components has improved, but improvements in thrust have been marginal and fuel consumption is still very high.

Anyway, I'm more interested in the possibility that mining on the Moon could sufficiently offset the costs of getting the equipment there.

I guess there's resources on the Moon that might be of benefit - if we can set up a safe, reliable means of getting them back to earth.

 

[Werewolf]

I guess there's resources on the Moon that might be of benefit - if we can set up a safe, reliable means of getting them back to earth.

There are much higher levels of titanium in the lunar maria compared to the Earth's crust. There's also a high oxygen content of the soil (from metal oxides) that could help sustain life support systems. Safety is still a concern since radiation levels are hazardous for extended stays. Clearly most of the work will be left to robots. An underground base makes sense, and it can also provide some protection against small meteorites:

After measuring radiation on the moon for the first time, scientists say a lunar base should be built underground to protect astronauts

Astronauts didn't measure how much radiation they were exposed to on the moon. New data shows the doses are 200 times as high as on Earth.

www.businessinsider.com.au

 

[CD Xbow]

NASA said that it has selected SpaceX and its Starship vehicle to serve as the lunar lander for its Artemis Program. NASA selects SpaceX as its sole provider for a lunar lander | Ars Technica

This is NASA's plan to return humans to the Moon later this decade. I think the astronauts are going to ride on the SLS and then dock with 'Luna starship' to land. It's a bit of a dog's breakfast, but the quickest way to get to the moon. Congress had refused to fund the landing part of Artemis, this way NASA can pay 2.9 billion out of it's general funding without needing extra dosh from Congress. BTW the still unfinished SLS has cost more than 2 billion dollars a years for a number of years. I expect if the SLS is delayed further then there would be the option of launching the Astronauts on Starship then docking with 'Luna starship' for a landing.

The Ars technica comments are often good, thought this was the best:

Obi Wan Shelby - "I felt a great disturbance in the pork....."

 

[Werewolf]

NASA has assembled a mega rocket to take humans to the Moon

 

[Eagle Wrath]

I'm not sure about Moon missions. I'd like to to see more missions aimed at the moons of Jupiter and Saturn, especially Europa. That being said, a Moon base could one day prove to be extremely useful.

Sent from my ELE-L09 using Tapatalk

I think we need to start developing on the moon. Defence systems for meteors/UFO's potentially. Problem is who will own it all. I'd like to see the UN or something similar in control but that probably wont happen. We will end up with China, Russia and the US owning bits of it most likely.
Europa definitely needs more exploration. All that water must hold some life you would think.

 

[Nugett]

I think space mining will become a reality in the near future. Having a base on the moon, where the moon could also be mined for ice/water to make hydrogen for rocket fuel is also a possibility. Which could then open up the possibility for further future human space exploration like Mars.

Mining in Space Is Coming

. . . Elon Musk, America’s first trillionaire?

www.milkenreview.org

Space Mining: Scientists Discover Two Asteroids Whose Precious Metals Would Exceed Global Reserves

"Mini Psyches"—mysterious metal-rich near-earth asteroids—have been discovered. They could one day be mined.

www.forbes.com

 

[Werewolf]

Artemis 1 is launching tomorrow; an uncrewed test of the SLS and Orion spacecraft as it flies around the Moon and back. Hopefully a successful flight will allow Artemis 2 carrying a crew of four to be launched in 2024, with Artemis 3 slated to land two astronauts on the Moon the following year.

Here's what's at stake for NASA's Artemis 1 mission to the moon

The uncrewed Artemis I launch marks the debut of the most powerful rocket ever assembled and kicks off NASA's long-awaited return to the moon's surface.

www.cnbc.com

 

[Gavin Excell]

Artemis 1 is launching tomorrow; an uncrewed test of the SLS and Orion spacecraft as it flies around the Moon and back. Hopefully a successful flight will allow Artemis 2 carrying a crew of four to be launched in 2024, with Artemis 3 slated to land two astronauts on the Moon the following year.

Here's what's at stake for NASA's Artemis 1 mission to the moon

The uncrewed Artemis I launch marks the debut of the most powerful rocket ever assembled and kicks off NASA's long-awaited return to the moon's surface.

www.cnbc.com

This completely passed me by
Launch happening 10.30pm AEST tonight

 

[Taylor]

 

[Taylor]

 

[Taylor]

Scrubbed the launch.

We had to find a video of the Apollo mission launchs to keep a four year old happy so he doesn't run around the house counting down from ten to try and make the rocket go.

 

[The Dice Man]

Scrubbed the launch.

We had to find a video of the Apollo mission launchs to keep a four year old happy so he doesn't run around the house counting down from ten to try and make the rocket go.

I thought it was just delayed 40 minutes.

 

[Taylor]

I thought it was just delayed 40 minutes.

Not happening today anymore

 

[CD Xbow]

Not happening today anymore

Booster has more leaks than the Trump admin. IIRC this was something like the cause of the failure of the dress rehearsal.
Putting a positive spin on it, at least there was not an earth shattering kaboom.

 

[Werewolf]

It looks likely that the launch will be postponed until next month

 

[CD Xbow]

It looks likely that the launch will be postponed until next month

Yes, no Kaboom.
Some folks believe the best outcome is what is known as the wickwick event. I've watched this meme start in the Ars Technica forums earlier this year.

 

[Taylor]

Those people think that technology continues to advance without motivation, struggle and necessity. Human history shows that is very wrong.

 

[Werewolf]

Fingers crossed that the launch goes ahead!

NASA prepares for latest attempt at Moon rocket launch after delays from hurricane and fuel leaks

Ground teams fill the main fuel tanks of NASA's towering, next-generation Moon rocket for the latest attempt at its debut launch, 10 weeks after it was initially scheduled.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Ry009]

 

[Werewolf]

So far, so good with Artemis 1. Splashdown is planned to occur on December 11th:

NASA capsule reaches Moon in last big step before lunar orbit

NASA's Orion capsule reaches the Moon, whipping around the far side and buzzing the lunar surface on its way to a record-breaking orbit.

www.abc.net.au