Harvey?

[4n20]

Thanks for bring that up, take a look at a game we played 3 or 4 weeks ago and all the dockers were slipping over, The guy who made the boot choice recalled players to change there boots

Simple error get guys hurt, That why we see so many staff on ground for warm up, They study the weather, Looks at the other side to see what there doing and they....MAKE THE CHOICES and the big H signs off on it

i think we will end up with a lot of the young guys washed out and hurt badly and next years line up will look much like this year, A lack of healthy players can hurt a team for years

The cats are starting to fall dew tooo...hurt players, I give the cat this year and toward next year they will be a mid rate team..that my view and it hold little water anyway

that happens every second week...we could be playing neck deep in concrete and we would still find a way to fall over. Ive lost count of how many times ive seen an opposition player (usually a badly out of form one) dodge and weave past 4 or 5 of our players and kick a goal and leave them laying on the ground like its the Battle of Normandy.

As for Harves...he deserves the extra patience due to our first real rebuild and I do remember Clarkson getting criticised a fair bit earlier in his tenure. Season 2011, though, I would expect some significant progress. Im backing him in.

 

[The Purple Jesus]

The mistakes made by the previous regime (Connolly, Schwab etc) will haunt us for years. Giving away Medhurst, Polak and pick 8 to get Taz was a terrible, terrible move that will hurt for years. This wasnt the only Schwab clanger though. Dont get me wrong he did a great job OFF the field but shouldve left the trading for someone with half a brain. If you remember he threw the kitchen sink to get Jeff White to Melbourne and that didnt deliver a flag although close. A list must be built through the draft.
Harvey also went down that same path in his first year by thinking we were still a chance to snatch a flag (drafting Mark Johnson, Kepler and Josh Head for back up). In hindsight this was a dreadful move. The same dreadful moves we having been making since 1995. Back then we delisted Peter Bell after 2 games and traded away McLeod and The Wizard for Chris Groom and Phil Gilbert! Those 3 wouldve given us the nucleus of a decent side at least early on.
The fact is Harvey needs wins to guarantee his job but time is running out as we WILL struggle next year. If we get 5 or 6 wins next year that would be half decent given our ordinary list. I still think our BEST 22 is pretty solid but after that our list falls away badly due to too many rookie listed crabs being on our list. These guys are often good competitors but lack polish. The best teams have highly skilled players (we do not have many highly skilled players on our list). If you look at our list of rookie upgraded players over the years we havent done too bad. But remember when they are rookie listed they have been over looked by all other clubs.
We need to make sure we do not win another game this year, get a priority pick and draft like we have never drafted before. the pressure on Phil Smart will be immense. Harves will be hoping he can pull a couple of gems who can make an immediate impact like Hill, Suban, Broughton etc

 

[Moo]

Harvey won't be judged this season, next season if he holds his nerve and goes to the draft again ...then we will see.

If we are not competitive going into the 2nd half of next season - especially if we can get Palmer, Hill, Hasleby, Pavlich, Sandilands, Tarrant, Broughton and Hayden all out on the park together. - big questions will be asked.

Time to be disapointed but not to judge just yet.

Plus if Harvey turns out not to be the right man - he would still rate as one of best coaches simply for bringing in such young talent.

We are forming a base here.

 

[jenny61_99]

I never thought Harvey would make it as a coach - assistant maybe, but not a senior coach. Mostly because he was too much "one of the boys" - more likely to sit and share a slab after the game or training with the players. If you ever watched him on Fox Footy he was just like a kid - along with Jimmy Barnes I think it was, making crass jokes and giggling like school kids.

Having said that, he surely needs to be given more time now that he IS the coach? You had a purple patch with 3 successive wins this season - against Sydney, West Coast and Carlton. When things go your way, and you can field a full team (ie. injuries are minimised) you play some good footy. At home - your fortress - you are generally formidable. A senior, more experienced coach may be better than Harvs... but they may not either.

You are rebuilding, give him at least another year and see how he develops these youngsters. Hang in there though, because your devotion will be rewarded.

Your supporters are amazing - turning out in force despite not having good on field success!

 

[samseenee]

I have said b4 and I will say again.
We need to give Harvs a chance.
He has done right by the club by getting rid of dead wood.
He needs at least another year in charge to show what he has got and
whether he can turn this team into a finals contender.

 

[melbournedocker]

Dew too the high risk of injuries the clubs pay a lot of cash to hire a guy to teach them to go as hard as they can with min risk, It a fine line and many clubs end up with more injuries than others

The big H is the man in change and the blame ends with him if we carry a high amount of injuries if he makes no changes to stop it, So far, it a dark dark day in his camp

The club is a company dew to the high amounts of cash it brings in, Any risk to this...there will be changes, we not a high school club (Sometimes i think we play that way)but many members have walk, 3000 from last year and the numbers of people who have gone to games has fallen 5% to %7

If the big H walks i hope he take the big R Heart with him, We hit a all time low, It could not crash and burn more than this unless the club lets it happen.

I think your comparing two completely different aspects of our footy club. Of course, we are a business, we need to be financially viable and in recent years we have done very well as a business. But comparing what is going on in terms of inexperience and changes in our playing personnel is not completely fair when relating to business issues. The implications of continued poor performances like Saturday (into next year) could see aspects of our business suffer badly including membership and sponsorship but its premature after a couple of bad losses and the large player turnover to get too worried about this.

Samseenee sums up this situation very well in my view.

 

[Freo Blood]

Support Harvey. He is the first coach to put the club future ahead of his own job security. Connolly and Schwab promised a journey but in hindsight were only interested in promoting themselves. Harvey is reaping the consequences of the multiple high and mid draft picks traded away by those clowns (in good draft years). Judge him more on the attitude and ability of the youngsters he has had the most say in.

 

[malpaso]

Support Harvey. He is the first coach to put the club future ahead of his own job security. Connolly and Schwab promised a journey but in hindsight were only interested in promoting themselves. Harvey is reaping the consequences of the multiple high and mid draft picks traded away by those clowns (in good draft years). Judge him more on the attitude and ability of the youngsters he has had the most say in.

That's it exactly. He's put a plan in place, it involves young players, team first mentality and toughness. Old skool if you will.

Just needs time.

 

[Belnakor]

I remember guys pounding Drum for his performances - he did get in the nucleus of a team that made it to a prelim.

 

[Moo]

I remember guys pounding Drum for his performances - he did get in the nucleus of a team that made it to a prelim.

...and that's why we follow clubs - to lose Prelim finals

 

[Belnakor]

pfft at least we made it, and we were playing a team who had 3 extra players on the ground to stop any kind of momentum we got.

 

[JoondalupJ]

... and Harveys mentor

Then Mathews ?

 

[JoondalupJ]

clarkson was not luck - he made 2 grand finals with his 2 years at central in the SANFL then was an assistant coach with the Power when they won the GF.

Yes your right, but I meant lucky for us. To choose an AFL senior coach with no senior experience as big boss, outside SANFL and send him to a struggling club that Hawthorn were at the time, was a huge risk by the decision makers. They breathed a sigh of releif I'm sure after sticking with him, and 2007 looked OK. IT COULD HAVE BEEN THE OTHER WAY. Harvey just looks lost all the time. Going from WAFL/SANFL to AFL IS A HELL OF A DIFFERENCE.

 

[Grantly114]

Support Harvey. He is the first coach to put the club future ahead of his own job security. Connolly and Schwab promised a journey but in hindsight were only interested in promoting themselves. Harvey is reaping the consequences of the multiple high and mid draft picks traded away by those clowns (in good draft years). Judge him more on the attitude and ability of the youngsters he has had the most say in.

Dont judge him now, next year will be a total loss with Harvey stats, lets face it, if we wait till next year to say he not the man for the job the next guy will take two years plus to get out of this hole we are in.

Iam very scared that he will keep up his acts and next year at round 4 (2010)people will call for his head and we will have wasted all this year and 2010 to Rebuild from the damage.

I say move on, He not the man for the job, WE need to take a stand and get a guy now so 2010 can be something

If iam wrong, I will stand correct and be the first to say..I was wrong, But look at this guys stats...It not good

 

[Grantly114]

I think your comparing two completely different aspects of our footy club. Of course, we are a business, we need to be financially viable and in recent years we have done very well as a business. But comparing what is going on in terms of inexperience and changes in our playing personnel is not completely fair when relating to business issues. The implications of continued poor performances like Saturday (into next year) could see aspects of our business suffer badly including membership and sponsorship but its premature after a couple of bad losses and the large player turnover to get too worried about this.

Samseenee sums up this situation very well in my view.

It going to hurt, Add people are out of work and there little money going around, The weak clubs will be the first to get hurt with funds, I will say that that Freo has been one club that had great backing from the hard yakka days (I was given one of there first tops they used)but every club is under a great deal of stress and the let downs will not help

 

[Moo]

Dont judge him now, next year will be a total loss with Harvey stats, lets face it, if we wait till next year to say he not the man for the job the next guy will take two years plus to get out of this hole we are in.

Iam very scared that he will keep up his acts and next year at round 4 (2010)people will call for his head and we will have wasted all this year and 2010 to Rebuild from the damage.

I say move on, He not the man for the job, WE need to take a stand and get a guy now so 2010 can be something

If iam wrong, I will stand correct and be the first to say..I was wrong, But look at this guys stats...It not good

You could put any caoch in the world in charge of our current squad and we would not be playing finals football.

Plus get this misconception out of your head that Harvey is not building a base. Whoever we have in the future whether it be Harvey or Mr X ...I guarantee you that Palmer, Hill, Suban, Mayne, De Boer, Broughton, Clarke, Ruffles, Walters, Pearce and Ballantyne are very much likely to form part of those plans. Plus there will be the 4 or 5 more players we add next draft and the 3 rookies too.

At the moment it is enough that Harvey ahs been tough enough to make the calls on the list ...that is where we were at last year and that is where we are at this year.

The next 2 seasons are about developing those young players. If there is not enough natural improvement in this playing group - coupled with the return of injured players then it is time to move on.

Whilst Harvey is building a list, that is the most important element as we speak.

 

[Tundrawolf]

Maybe its because of all the due on the grass lately there are so many injuries

This is actually quite funny

 

[Outshined]

Regardless of whether or not Harvey proves to be a successfull match day coach, he's potentially given whoever may be next in charge a great platform to work from. He has done the one thing that this club has always shied away from in promoting youth as well as attempting to right the mistakes of past coaches.

It would be unfair to judge him one way or the other this year. Harvey never claimed we were going to make the finals or be any serious threat to the flag. Most of us realised that any injuries to the core group of players would be disastrous as our depth is non existant. Round 13 2005 at the exact same venue, Hawthorn lost to Port Adelaide 10.11 71 to 29.14 188, with a margin of 117 points. While admittedly they kicked 9 more goals than us, they were still flogged by a good team by the same margin but went on to make the finals in 2007 and win the flag in 2008.

I'll guarantee you that there was much criticism of Clarkson in the weeks following and probably for that whole season (they won 5 games that year). Many probably thought Clarko was inept as a coach. How wrong he proved them all. Give Harvey time and he may prove many of his doubters wrong too.

 

[longsuffreosupp]

If Harvey doesn't bring a good enough rise above the ladder in 2010, then all is not lost. Id hope then we go for an experienced coach that can gel the team together while Pav and Co are around for a decent tilt. Our best side on paper is still a pretty good side.

 

[Grantly114]

You could put any caoch in the world in charge of our current squad and we would not be playing finals football.

Plus get this misconception out of your head that Harvey is not building a base. Whoever we have in the future whether it be Harvey or Mr X ...I guarantee you that Palmer, Hill, Suban, Mayne, De Boer, Broughton, Clarke, Ruffles, Walters, Pearce and Ballantyne are very much likely to form part of those plans. Plus there will be the 4 or 5 more players we add next draft and the 3 rookies too.

At the moment it is enough that Harvey ahs been tough enough to make the calls on the list ...that is where we were at last year and that is where we are at this year.

The next 2 seasons are about developing those young players. If there is not enough natural improvement in this playing group - coupled with the return of injured players then it is time to move on.

Whilst Harvey is building a list, that is the most important element as we speak.

If you set out to develop a play group would you use a freashman to do the job, I just hope the Big H dont burn out the younger guys and put these guys in a mindset it better to be playing for some other club with some hope in the next two years.

Palmer, Hill, Suban, Mayne, De Boer, Broughton, Clarke, Ruffles, Walters, Pearce and Ballantyne ..who will walk and who head east in a year or two, there will be a few of the above names missing at the end of next year

 

[Tommo]

Dont judge him now, next year will be a total loss with Harvey stats, lets face it, if we wait till next year to say he not the man for the job the next guy will take two years plus to get out of this hole we are in.

Iam very scared that he will keep up his acts and next year at round 4 (2010)people will call for his head and we will have wasted all this year and 2010 to Rebuild from the damage.

I say move on, He not the man for the job, WE need to take a stand and get a guy now so 2010 can be something

If iam wrong, I will stand correct and be the first to say..I was wrong, But look at this guys stats...It not good

But is the damage really all that bad. Having a youth policy really doesn't cause any major issues other than short term.

If he sticks to a youth policy then the worst that happens is we end end with a list of quality young players that he can't get the most out of. If it is deemed that he isn't the man the next coach will have a very solid base.

I don't see any problem with the way things are going long term.
Sort term its a different story.

 

[Freo Blood]

All this experience coach tosh gives me the sh8%s. All we ever hear is bring in Sheedy or Matthews. Guess what Richmond don't want Sheeds. They are both grumpy old men - too old. We have a youngish coach, a young and capable CEO and a young list... a great combination. Do you really think that 18 year olds will really lift for Sheedy or Matthews. Anyone who didn't think we were gonig to get flogged by at least 15 goals on the weekend was delusional.
Adelaide play such a fantastic defensive game we always find it hard to break through even with a strong team. With 8 players 18 or 19 years old plus 8 crabs we never had a chance to mount a credible attack.

 

[Moo]

Palmer, Hill, Suban, Mayne, De Boer, Broughton, Clarke, Ruffles, Walters, Pearce and Ballantyne ..who will walk and who head east in a year or two, there will be a few of the above names missing at the end of next year

I would strongly disagree with this statement.

 

[E Shed]

All this experience coach tosh gives me the sh8%s. All we ever hear is bring in Sheedy or Matthews. Guess what Richmond don't want Sheeds. They are both grumpy old men - too old. We have a youngish coach, a young and capable CEO and a young list... a great combination. Do you really think that 18 year olds will really lift for Sheedy or Matthews. Anyone who didn't think we were gonig to get flogged by at least 15 goals on the weekend was delusional.
Adelaide play such a fantastic defensive game we always find it hard to break through even with a strong team. With 8 players 18 or 19 years old plus 8 crabs we never had a chance to mount a credible attack.

k'n spot on. Be thankful we have a coach at the helm who's got the guts to wear the heat while we rebuild.