Hodge v. Bartel

[Samthegun]

Hodge would be the first picked, before Matthews for mine. Hodge would be captain.

I guarantee you no Hawks person who has been in the club rooms and inside the teams and on the teams, would not have Hodge in the top few. P'raps only Matthews would be above him. And I reckon a material amount would want Hodge as captain.

It says a lot that the players rate Hodge so highly. I've never met the guy so I wouldn't know fully, but it's obvious that he has a certain aura about him - he's a natural leader. He goes a certain direction and everyone follows.

For me, I don't see Hodge as particularly clutch. (Ducking boos from fellow Hawks supporters.) If there was a grand final goal to be kicked on the siren to seal victory I'd choose Burgoyne every day of the week. Ultimate clutch player, with leadership qualities to boot.

 

[Xtreme]

Jimmy's not a sniping, drink driving, lite n easy eating bogan though

He did try and audition for Superman with a beautiful leap and stage dive against the Hawks a few seasons back!



I made a gif out of it, wish I still had it on the hard drive haha.

 

[scarecrow2k1]

Bartel is a great player, but Hodge is significantly better.

Bartel lacks the career consistency that Hodge has. Yes he has the brownlow and the norm Smith, but as others has said, hasn't won a B&F and has been AA twice.

Hodge has the additional AA appearance, two B&Fs, extra norm Smith and probably played at a higher level across his career.

Both greats of the game but in completely different categories.

 

[The 747]

He did try and audition for Superman with a beautiful leap and stage dive against the Hawks a few seasons back!

You're kinda late to the party, you feel me?

 

[scarecrow2k1]

It says a lot that the players rate Hodge so highly. I've never met the guy so I wouldn't know fully, but it's obvious that he has a certain aura about him - he's a natural leader. He goes a certain direction and everyone follows.

For me, I don't see Hodge as particularly clutch. (Ducking boos from fellow Hawks supporters.) If there was a grand final goal to be kicked on the siren to seal victory I'd choose Burgoyne every day of the week. Ultimate clutch player, with leadership qualities to boot.

For me, having two norm Smith's is clutch as he's standing up in big games.

 

[Hawker55]

It says a lot that the players rate Hodge so highly. I've never met the guy so I wouldn't know fully, but it's obvious that he has a certain aura about him - he's a natural leader. He goes a certain direction and everyone follows.

For me, I don't see Hodge as particularly clutch. (Ducking boos from fellow Hawks supporters.) If there was a grand final goal to be kicked on the siren to seal victory I'd choose Burgoyne every day of the week. Ultimate clutch player, with leadership qualities to boot.

It's different kinds of clutch really. Hodge had a dud 2012 GF where he shouldn't have played coming back from injury, but has been excellent in all four Premierships. Plus his smother in the 2014 PF against Port. Burgoyne has had good spurts in all those games but didn't have a four quarter effort in any.

Regarding kicking after the siren, funnily enough I'd take Buddy every day of the week in a pressure situation, even with a set shot. He loves the big occasion.

 

[Wild Bill]

No point Telling some Geelong fans mate they are just to salty. You do speak a lot of sense however.

It's not a popularity contest - the 2nd best leader I have seen also had flaws but Carey handed me two flags in the 90s. I will be forever grateful.

Voss belted someone off field and hurt a lot of players in his time. The 3rd best leader I have seen.

It must be tough watching your most hated team becoming one of - if not the - greatest team of all time.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

It's not a popularity contest - the 2nd best leader I have seen also had flaws but Carey handed me two flags in the 90s. I will be forever grateful.

Voss belted someone off field and hurt a lot of players in his time. The 3rd best leader I have seen.

It must be tough watching your most hated team becoming one of - if not the - greatest team of all time.

Carey, Hodge and Voss are comfortably the 3 best leaders I've seen also.

 

[HairyO]

Except for his off field behaviour, inability to rise to the occassion when tagged(thankfully with Mitchell's dominance he hasn't had to deal with tags in recent years) and his overly rough play such as ramming heads into goal posts or breaking an opposing captains jaw. Other than that yes he is a great captain.

When did a tag last work? Why wouldnt he be tagged all the time?

 

[Seeds]

Carey, Hodge and Voss are comfortably the 3 best leaders I've seen also.

Nothing says leadership like players not even wanting to play with you and kicking you out of the club. Carey has to be in the list of the worst ever leaders at actual leadership. He may be the best captain player or all time but as the best leader he is not even in the discussion.

 

[Seeds]

When did a tag last work? Why wouldnt he be tagged all the time?

All the time when my club tried it and I've seen plenty of other teams successful at it too. Luckily you have such a gun in Mitchell and Lewis who has also risen to the elite mid level that you can't really consider tagging a part time midfielder like Hodge anymore.

 

[Wild Bill]

Nothing says leadership like players not even wanting to play with you and kicking you out of the club. Carey has to be in the list of the worst ever leaders at actual leadership. He may be the best captain player or all time but as the best leader he is not even in the discussion.

On field leader he was an all time great. As I posted before a lot of great captains have flaws.

 

[Wild Bill]

All the time when my club tried it and I've seen plenty of other teams successful at it too. Luckily you have such a gun in Mitchell and Lewis who has also risen to the elite mid level that you can't really consider tagging a part time midfielder like Hodge anymore.

It's why Selwood would be so happy Dangerfield joined the Cats. Selwood won't be looked at being tagged each time he runs out with Danger.

 

[Seeds]

Easily has been a better player than Bartel though who has partly wasted his career.

 

[Seeds]

It's why Selwood would be so happy Dangerfield joined the Cats. Selwood won't be looked at being tagged each time he runs out with Danger.

Hodge is a fantastic player. But he really struggled with tags. Selwood also has had some trouble with tags, like most, but when Selwood has a bad game being tagged he still racks up 20 to 25 touches. When Hodge has a bad game being tagged he gets less than 15 touches and goes invisible. In any case I have Hodge above Bartel. But the assumption that he is invincible in big games is wrong. He couldln't handle taggers and has been lucky that in the past 4 years he has barely been tagged.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Since the 70s.

And sure, a Geelong supporter can have an opinion on Hawthorn players, but if I said that Selwood was overrated and wouldnt be in the top 20 Geelong players would you take me seriously or would you assume its a Hawk supporter trolling?

Theres no logic to your arguement re Selwood

Hawthorn won a stack of premierships in the 70s and 80s and Geelong won none - that would suggest that from the 70s onwards Hawthorn had a hell of alot more top players ( which your rating Hodge against ) compared to Selwood - re Geelong players

You look at the spine of the Hawthorn flag winning teams of the 80s

Langford - Mew - Tuck - Brereton - Dunstall

I wouldnt have Luke Hodge ahead of any of them ( key position players are so bloody important) - no way - and thats not bagging Luke Hodge - sure he is a very good player and a top notch captain ( and i think because hes captained them to 3 flags in row - people have rated him through the roof )

Hodge apart from obviously the 2008 GF - i cant remember him doing anything against Geelong - those 11 losses in a row - where was he - he didnt stop the rot or turn any of those games

Where as Mitchell ( absolute champion) and Burgoyne ( sensational player with brilliant skills ) - how many times have they rescued Hawthorn - and turned the game - plenty

 

[Biscut]

'Poor fatty porkins.

Well played!

 

[Biscut]

Something we all need to take into account when comparing the two. Bartel had a glittering early to middle period during his career, perhaps helped by playing in a team full of great players. His last few years have been much harder due to his age, declining body and not having the same quality players around him.

Hodge was never as good a player in his early years due to playing in a weaker team at the time, as such his output would be hampered. In his middle to late years he stands out a lot more due to natural development as a player, better quality players around him and has clearly flourished as the skipper of such a great team.

Both players, whilst both have had unbelievable careers were playing in teams opposite in ability to each other all the time. Perhaps someone with enough smarts could compare both players careers during the best period of there careers. For Bartell that would be from around 2006 to 2011 and Hodge would be from 2008 until now?? Would be an interesting read.

For what's it's worth I've enjoyed this thread and both will be remembered as greats of the AFL and we have all been lucky to enjoy/despise each player depending on who you support!

 

[Jables]

At their best they are both pretty close in terms of ability (I'll bite my tongue on the ways I think Hodge is better, haha).

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Hodge is a fantastic player. But he really struggled with tags. Selwood also has had some trouble with tags, like most, but when Selwood has a bad game being tagged he still racks up 20 to 25 touches. When Hodge has a bad game being tagged he gets less than 15 touches and goes invisible. In any case I have Hodge above Bartel. But the assumption that he is invincible in big games is wrong. He couldln't handle taggers and has been lucky that in the past 4 years he has barely been tagged.

I think Hodge has only had 15 touches or less once in the past two years... no tags for him then?

 

[Biscut]

At their best they are both pretty close in terms of ability (I'll bite my tongue on the ways I think Hodge is better, haha).

So true.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Something we all need to take into account when comparing the two. Bartel had a glittering early to middle period during his career, perhaps helped by playing in a team full of great players. His last few years have been much harder due to his age, declining body and not having the same quality players around him.

Hodge was never as good a player in his early years due to playing in a weaker team at the time, as such his output would be hampered. In his middle to late years he stands out a lot more due to natural development as a player, better quality players around him and has clearly flourished as the skipper of such a great team.

Both players, whilst both have had unbelievable careers were playing in teams opposite in ability to each other all the time. Perhaps someone with enough smarts could compare both players careers during the best period of there careers. For Bartell that would be from around 2006 to 2011 and Hodge would be from 2008 until now?? Would be an interesting read.

For what's it's worth I've enjoyed this thread and both will be remembered as greats of the AFL and we have all been lucky to enjoy/despise each player depending on who you support!

Hodge was great prior to 2008, it's just that not many people took any notice of his good games due to Hawthorn being so lowly.

In 2006, as a centerman he had a string of games where he had 30+ possessions every week, and he was absolutely dominant, averaging over 26 disposals for the year.

 

[hawkman]

Something we all need to take into account when comparing the two. Bartel had a glittering early to middle period during his career, perhaps helped by playing in a team full of great players. His last few years have been much harder due to his age, declining body and not having the same quality players around him.

Hodge was never as good a player in his early years due to playing in a weaker team at the time, as such his output would be hampered. In his middle to late years he stands out a lot more due to natural development as a player, better quality players around him and has clearly flourished as the skipper of such a great team.

Both players, whilst both have had unbelievable careers were playing in teams opposite in ability to each other all the time. Perhaps someone with enough smarts could compare both players careers during the best period of there careers. For Bartell that would be from around 2006 to 2011 and Hodge would be from 2008 until now?? Would be an interesting read.

For what's it's worth I've enjoyed this thread and both will be remembered as greats of the AFL and we have all been lucky to enjoy/despise each player depending on who you support!

Hodge was an All Australian in 2005 in a team that finished 14th. His first 3 years were average but he has been good nearly every year since 2005

 

[Samthegun]

It's different kinds of clutch really. Hodge had a dud 2012 GF where he shouldn't have played coming back from injury, but has been excellent in all four Premierships. Plus his smother in the 2014 PF against Port. Burgoyne has had good spurts in all those games but didn't have a four quarter effort in any.

Regarding kicking after the siren, funnily enough I'd take Buddy every day of the week in a pressure situation, even with a set shot. He loves the big occasion.

Nahh, not Buddy with a set shot (maybe for a freakish running goal, though). He missed a set shot at a crucial stage of the 2012 grand final in the last quarter. He sprayed a lot of them that day - very jittery. Although he got better with conversion over the years, I always felt he was a 50/50 proposition when having a set shot. Just that feeling of unease when he was in front of the sticks...

I agree that Hodge is a big game man in an overall sense. Also, you have a point re PF 2014.

 

[Samthegun]

Hodge was an All Australian in 2005 in a team that finished 14th. His first 3 years were average but he has been good nearly every year since 2005

He had a pretty average 2012...though he was beset by injury. I thought he was gone after that season...