In & Out 2012

[Number 10]

Who will win their spot in the 22 next year and who will lose their spot?

By lose their spot I mean - have strong competition and be pushed out by someone who is performing better on a regular basis.

Please - this is not somewhere to post kneejerk reactions to players playing well or poorly in the GF.

For me:

Out: L. Brown (retire), B. Johnson, L. Davis (retire), J. Blair, Krakouer
In: Fasolo, Tom Young, Nathan Brown, Macaffer, Josh Thomas

Exception 1: If Didak doesn't have a full preseason, which I assume he will, then in comes Ben Sinclair.

I say Thomas because we genuinely need another hard ball getter in the middle. Sure, Swan, Thomas and Pendlebury good in close but they are much better in space.

 

[10571z]

We should have a good 2012 but im worried about...

Didak - Will he perform again with a good preseason

Krarkouer - Cant go to arizona will he perform in 2012?

Davis - Just had a AA year and still chasing that flag i think he should stay

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Davis is not going to win a GF for us so he is out of the 22.

Out: L. Brown (retire), L. Davis (retire or out), J. Blair, Beams (trade), Maxwell, Toovey, maybe Didak
In: Fasolo, Tom Young, Nathan Brown, Macaffer, Josh Thomas, Seedsman, Wood

 

[Ed D]

Too early to say. Anything written would just be a guess apart from saying L.Brown would be out.

 

[Ed D]

Davis is not going to win a GF for us so he is out of the 22.

20 possessions and 11 tackles made him one of our better players in the GF, even if his kicking was a little shaky early. Also if you're thinking about the Varcoe opening goal, it was either Varcoe or Selwood having an open shot, Selwood had the ball.

 

[TradeDraft]

In: Eade Hart

Out: Malthouse Neeld

 

[Pera]

What the hell? Beams? Blair? Maxwell?

We still have a very good list and our spine is still very young. We have a three or four year window wide open still and with N Brown back, a fit and firing Krakouer with a proper pre season and a new coach, we should be right up there. Not much needs to be changed, just some tinkering and we'll be fine for 2012 and beyond.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

What the hell? Beams? Blair? Maxwell?

We still have a very good list and our spine is still very young. We have a three or four year window wide open still and with N Brown back, a fit and firing Krakouer with a proper pre season and a new coach, we should be right up there. Not much needs to be changed, just some tinkering and we'll be fine for 2012 and beyond.

We are talking best 22 here aren't we? If so, the 3 outs are reasonable, and there are rumours regarding Beams wishing to leave. Beams would remain best 22 if certain to be at the club.
Blair has reached the limit of his ability then declined. Maxwell is no certain starter if he loses the captaincy to Pendles, which he surely will sometime soon.

 

[Macca_]

For me:

Out: L. Brown (retire), B. Johnson, L. Davis (retire), J. Blair, Krakouer
In: Fasolo, Tom Young, Nathan Brown, Macaffer, Josh Thomas

Don't see why everyone is scrutinizing Johnson. Shaw, HarryO and himself provide the run off our backline. Blair will still be in our 22, but will probably become our new specialist sub. Neon Leon will stay at the Pies AND stay in our best 22.

Out: Krakouer, Didak
In: Fasolo, Brown

Need to play our young guns more often. IMO we played too many of our big name players in the NAB Cup.

Also don't know why people are questioning Maxwell's leadership and spot in the side. He may have underperformed in a few games this year, but he still slots nicely into our defensive structure. The players speak very highly of him in terms of the quality of his captaincy.

 

[Syphoncom]

Davis is not going to win a GF for us so he is out of the 22.

Out: L. Brown (retire), L. Davis (retire or out), J. Blair, Beams (trade), Maxwell, Toovey, maybe Didak
In: Fasolo, Tom Young, Nathan Brown, Macaffer, Josh Thomas, Seedsman, Wood

If those names are gone, so is Dawes.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

If those names are gone, so is Dawes.

They are not gone, just not best 22. I am surmising that Seedsman may threaten Toovey's position at some stage, though I am no Toover-hater and happy to have him in the side - he does have a weakness in his kicking which could see him fighting for a spot at some stage next year.

Dawes on GF form could be considered outside best 22, but the selections are not meant to be GF motivated. Dawes is young and will hopefully improve.

 

[SwanBet]

OUT: A.Toovey, A.Fasolo, L.Brown
IN: N.Brown, B.Macaffer, C.Wood


Krakouer will be even better, his tank will improve with a full preseason, dont see anyone who could perform the small forward role better, arguably one of the best front and centre players in the land. The talk of him missing Arizona, well i hate to break it to you, but due to the amount of time we spend there, the benefits are only given for about half the season.(true fact)
Didak will get his mojo back, the club wont make the same mistakes again, if hes out of form they will drop him.

Wood will obviously come in and play second ruck to Jolly next season, unless we get really active in the trade period. Witts might sneak a few games in, but no where near a finals player.

Toovey is a hard worker, a great shut down man, but i can see a spot for him next season unless leon davis retires/goes home. There is almost no room for him, will get games through rotation, but cant see him in the fully fit best 22.
B: Tarrant, Brown, Davis
HB: Obrien, Reid, Maxwell/Shaw

I rate the caff, really missed his form from 2010 this season. A good third/fourth tall that we lacked. We had to many smalls up forward, and when we bomb it in, and if trav isnt there marks are hard to come by. Caff is can clunk one, as well as get on his bike of the lead. He would have been perfect matchup for Scarlett, just like he was for fisher in 2010. Fasolo is still young, and will play alot of games next season, but a fully fit macaffer is a better option in my eyes.

B: C.Tarrant, N.Brown, L.Davis
HB: H.Obrien, B.Reid, N.Maxwell
C: H.Shaw, S.Pendlebury, D.Thomas
HF: S.Sidebottom, T.Cloke, A.Didak
F: A.Krakouer, C.Dawes, B.Macaffer
R: D.Jolly, D.Swan, L.Ball
B: B.Johnson, C.Wood, S.Wellingham Sub: Blair

EMG/Depth: D.Beams, A.Toovey, T.Goldsack, A.Fasolo, L.Keefe, S.Buckley, J.Witts, J.Mcarthy, B.Sinclair, L.Rounds + Danyle pearce(linked with us/heard is likely to come) + our pick 25.

Our best 22 looks very solid, however i only really can picture; beams, goldsack, toovey and fasolo as likely players who are worthy to come in and have an impact/play there role well. Interesting to see what happens in trade period. Hopefully we dont lose beams/goldsack/macaffer. otherwise we wont win the premiership, depth is essential.

 

[Drizt]

It is going to be very interesting.

 

[PremiumPies]

Too early to say. Anything written would just be a guess apart from saying L.Brown would be out.

I've been thinking the same thing. It's just too soon for me to say one way or another with any kind of authority.

 

[SpongePie]

I dont get the calls to drop Toovey. Sure he had an average grand final, but so did Swan...

All Im saying is Toovey had a great year, he rarely got beaten 1 on 1. The best game that springs to mind was Anzac day. If you have the video, give it a watch. On at least 3 occasions he won critical 1 on 1s that went a long way to us winning that game. And remember in the GF he was still carrying an injury.

I think he he moved into a pure tag role, aka Ling type, he could be in for a huge year in 2012.

 

[Number 10]

I've been thinking the same thing. It's just too soon for me to say one way or another with any kind of authority.

Yeh, bit of fun though.

I'm thinking maybe keeping Krakouer in the side and just not including Fasolo in the 22 - from my original post.

 

[mattys123]

I dont get the calls to drop Toovey. Sure he had an average grand final, but so did Swan...

All Im saying is Toovey had a great year, he rarely got beaten 1 on 1. The best game that springs to mind was Anzac day. If you have the video, give it a watch. On at least 3 occasions he won critical 1 on 1s that went a long way to us winning that game. And remember in the GF he was still carrying an injury.

I think he he moved into a pure tag role, aka Ling type, he could be in for a huge year in 2012.

We need a tagger, and Tooves could be the man.

For years when Mick has been coaching, he has been remiss not to even consider developing a tagger, and it has bitten us on numerous occasions.

Imagine having a tagger take Bartel, Selwood or Chapman out of that Grand Final, it would have evened things up a bit.

In my mind, Cameron Ling was the most important player on GF day, because he held the best player on the field to only 20 possessions.

We need that, give Tooves a full pre season to build his "tank", and use him as our tagger in 2012.

 

[damuzzdu]

Out : L.Brown (retired)

Possible outs : Blair - felt he got shown up on sat and i think he is depth player at best...not in our best 22.

We must play most of the kids in NAB cup and who cares if we we lose. Players like Tom Young, Paul Seedsman, Kirk Ugle, Lachie Keffe, Ben Sinclair, Josh Thomas etc

We will get Nathan Brown & Caff back

Hopefully Bux will not make the mistake of playing favorite sons when out of form...they can play in the VFL until ready.

Fasolo to start in most games in 2012. Then the kids must be given games early and we must have better player management so that 26-28 are fit ready to go as we approach round 19.

 

[Subprime]

Last 2 years we've won a flag and come close to a second. That tells me most things are right and with a young core group minimal changes are required.

On Caff - let him get fit and then get him back in the team, he has a booming kick, can take a grab and was a key part of the '10 victory.

On Krak - he will be better for the pre-season to come and has the right attitude to succeed.

On L Davis - he was good in the GF and should be retained if possible.

On Maxwell - had a couple of bad injuries during the year but still popped a vessel for the club when it counted.

On Dawes - a broken hand for a key forward is going to affect performance. Retain.

On Blair - will be under more pressure to retain his spot next year and that will be good for him. Same goes for Didak.

Leigh Brown - thanks for all your efforts and good luck in the future.

 

[Scodog10]

I don't agree with wholesale changes personally. We were in that game up to our eyeballs until maybe the 10 minute mark of the final term, according to supercoach we had 6 of the top 8 ranked players on the ground (which included Davis) and we're still a young side striving for their physical peak which is why the bigger bodies of the Cats wore us down.

3-4 changes max to the best 22 is the way I'd play it and trading out established players is a big no no for me because our lack of depth hurt in the end.

In saying that though our depth will be stronger next year as we'll have Macaffer and Brown as basically new recruits plus Clarke is a strong chance to return. So I can see a positive if some of the blokes being mentioned are moved out of the best 22, but only as long as they're replaced with BIG bodies. For a team that prides itself on the contested ball to lose 185-154 just isn't good enough.

 

[MarkT2]

A the moment Wood comes in for Brown which is a plus IMO.
Other than that, a couple more have to come off the list by draft time. Depending on retirements we might need to look at trades unless there are some obvious delistings whoch I can't see.

If Davis plays on then there may not be much more change to the 22. Dick will pressure Krakouer. McCaffer and N. Brown will press for spots as will Goldsack. Sinclair looks a long way off at this point. Rounds not quite so far off it but still a bit away from the best 25 or so. Keffee needs to get stronger. I'd like to see Josh Thomas make an impact but who knows.

 

[Pie 4 Life]

Toovey becoming a full time tagger has some good merits. I like the sound of that TBH. Providing he works on his tank, he has the speed to go with the best. Perhaps then we should target another negating defender as he was our only real small "negating" defender.

Not that I'm interested, but weren't we into Crowley a couple of years ago? Would prefer someone younger but we'll see how it goes.

 

[lihei]

Last 2 years we've won a flag and come close to a second. That tells me most things are right and with a young core group minimal changes are required.

On Caff - let him get fit and then get him back in the team, he has a booming kick, can take a grab and was a key part of the '10 victory.

On Krak - he will be better for the pre-season to come and has the right attitude to succeed.

On L Davis - he was good in the GF and should be retained if possible.

On Maxwell - had a couple of bad injuries during the year but still popped a vessel for the club when it counted.

On Dawes - a broken hand for a key forward is going to affect performance. Retain.

On Blair - will be under more pressure to retain his spot next year and that will be good for him. Same goes for Didak.

Leigh Brown - thanks for all your efforts and good luck in the future.

Well said!

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

As long as I see Toovey and Johnson gone, I'm happy. The rest are workable.

 

[Snoop Dog]

emotions are talking here chaps.......we've just come off a season where we lost 2 games and ultimately lost the GF bc we got some injuries at the wrong time of the season and our blokes subsequently ran out of gas. To talk wholesale changes is a bit much.

In respect to;

Davis was an AA - if he wants to play he will play. His final was good and he laid 8 or so tackles.

Johnson - another who will be ok if he plays on which i think he will given Tarrant is. He may need to be managed a bit more though so he is at his prime late in season.

Kraks - super first half but just didnt get going in the second half. Fitter and stronger next year for sure.

Didak - unless he shows he can tackle then going into the 2012 finals might be an issue.

Toovey - surely people are writing him off?

IN terms of the kids Caf, Thomas, Dick, Brown and Fasolo should be the ones they look to for next year as players to come into the 22 and challenge the incumbents for spots.