Injuries - Shminjuries

[Allefgib]

After tonights performance can we finally put to bed the fact we have been so shithouse this year is primarily due to our injuries?

Please continue to argue that point if you feel its true.

Personally I think its now plain for all to see the club has some very very significant issues. Coaching staff, gameplan, players not caring, lack of leadership, boys club mentalit etc etc are all legitimate possibiliites. I just don't see how anyone can point to the injury list as the issue and assume its going to get better once we have more players 'fit' and 'match hardened'.

We've run out both last quarters in the last few weeks - but been abysmal the first three quarters of both games. Been shit all year.

God help me I wish it was the injuries.... it isn't. Can we focus on the real issues now?

 

[Crow-mo]

North had bigger outs than us, and supposedly from a lower base. i.e. the rest of their team is supposed to be inferior to ours.

even if you assumed the outs were equal, they had a poor pre-season (according to them) too, we should have had the depth in class to still carry the day.

but as we all know...

 

[Paladin]

Most pathetic effort i have ever seen from a crows side, worse than the 141 point drubbing at the gabba. How can we get smashed by such a poor team. Something is wrong, something has to change.

 

[King Elvis]

I honestly think injuries and lack of fitness were the problem initially, and things worsened from there.

 

[Allefgib]

I honestly think injuries and lack of fitness were the problem initially, and things worsened from there.

highlighted existing issues or created new ones?

 

[Tex200]

I know its frustrating and we want look for different things but for mine injuries is still a key contributor to this mess. Missing from last years semi final team;

Knights
McKay
Thompson
Sellar
Symes
Otten
Hentschel
Johncock
Burton

Add to this Dangerfield was a first up after an injury break.

As I said the whole season is frustrating but you cant ignore this. Also you cant ignore that once players do get back they take a few weeks to get up to speed. The problem has also been therefore, that even if we get someone back, we top it up with another ie dangerfield in johncock out.

Very harsh to ignore these facts.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

Injuries do have an impact on W/L however what is pissing the most of us off is the lack of fight, spirit and hunger for a contest and you cant blame injuries for what we are seeing

Last night we played the youngest side in the comp and got absolutely belted for 3 qtrs

when are people going to wise up, there is something very wrong at the AFC

 

[Tas]

North had bigger outs than us, and supposedly from a lower base. i.e. the rest of their team is supposed to be inferior to ours.

even if you assumed the outs were equal, they had a poor pre-season (according to them) too, we should have had the depth in class to still carry the day.

but as we all know...

I don't think we have the same quantity injured but our outs are pretty big for us given we don't have the list depth atm.

Injured players:
Petrie (FF)
McIntosh (#1 Ruck)
Campbell (best Small forward)
Anthony (wingman)
Adams (midfield, been great this year)
Lower (midfield, important big bodied midfielder like Greenwood)
Urquhart (hbf/wing, wasn't setting the world on fire before getting injured)

 

[Crow-mo]

I don't think we have the same quantity injured but our outs are pretty big for us given we don't have the list depth atm.

Injured players:
Petrie (FF)
McIntosh (#1 Ruck)
Campbell (best Small forward)
Anthony (wingman)
Adams (midfield, been great this year)
Lower (midfield, important big bodied midfielder like Greenwood)
Urquhart (hbf/wing, wasn't setting the world on fire before getting injured)

add in hale as well...

 

[Crow-mo]

I know its frustrating and we want look for different things but for mine injuries is still a key contributor to this mess. Missing from last years semi final team;

Knights
McKay
Thompson
Sellar
Symes
Otten
Hentschel
Johncock
Burton

Add to this Dangerfield was a first up after an injury break.

As I said the whole season is frustrating but you cant ignore this. Also you cant ignore that once players do get back they take a few weeks to get up to speed. The problem has also been therefore, that even if we get someone back, we top it up with another ie dangerfield in johncock out.

Very harsh to ignore these facts.

the problem with your list is that it is arguable that they would all make a first choice 22. there are a lot of fringe performers there.

 

[sbenno]

As much as I would like injuries to be the answer (while they've probably exacerbated the problem), I am coming around to CM's way of thinking.

If the injuries we had were Goodwin, Bock, Rutten, Tippet, Vince and Thompson, then that would be the difference between winning and losing (well, if they were playing well), but we do have our prime movers out on the park, most of the time, with a few exceptions.

The injuries we have are not the difference between uncompetitiveness (which was apparent from what of the first half I saw last night, and past games this year) and winning.

I am becoming increasingly suspicious that something bad is happenning behind the scenes that we aren't privy to. It's the only explanation I can come up with.

Only a fundamental change could make such a difference from what we saw last year to the shit we're serving up this year. Is it faith in the coach? Belief in the gameplan? Playing for each other? Confidence?

I honestly thought that after a win last week the boys would smell blood, and give yesterday a red hot go. That they didn't is hugely disappointing. Like we've been saying all year, it's that we lost, it's how.

 

[WALL-e]

We've been very unlucky with injuries, but that doesn't excuse effort.

Lack of desire until we get a run on then everyone lifts. Sick of seeing 1 quarter of footy.

 

[Tas]

add in hale as well...

True, I didn't even notice what happened to him.

 

[StillCrowing]

We did lose Johncock, Burton and Thompson through injury this week. That's nearly 500 games worth of experience, not to mention Johncock has eeeeeasily been one of our best players.

Those players were replaced with three guys who have 50 games worth of experience between them. I don't know that it's a definitive reason for the loss, but it definitely makes a difference.

 

[SellarStardom]

All year what we have seen from the players is a lack of contested ball, almost no backing up, poor disposal and decision making and a reverting back to crap game style. Then we have seen a few brief quarters of the players reversing this style and plainly saying stuff it, taking the game on and going for broke. This suggests a few critical issues.

Game style - this is not working effectively and confusing the players. Viney's rolling zone game plan, is employed most stringently by Crows and Hawthorn, say no more! But the players now feel this game plan isn't effective and are obviously showing this on the ground. When they ignore the game plan and work on instinct the game looks better.

Intensity - lack of intensity is simply lack of desire to put in for each other and the club, this is the most worrying sign. This translates into a lack of fight and hardness at the players. It is also why a lot of the time the players are not leading from the front, our forwards caught behind

Internal relationships - It has been suggested the pay now afforded to Tippett has caused issues, this may be at play but is unlikely to be a major factor

The club has some major issues no doubt, only time will tell if this is rectified or raises it's ugly head?

 

[crow_fish]

Without a doubt injuries have contributed to our poor record this year, it is not only reason but has had big impact especially in defense.

The crows have historically prided itself on not leaking high scores. It was only last year that forward line really started function well. But IMO crows under craig have had strong defense unit. This year we have interrupted by injuries to key personnel. Bock had interrupted time of it, Johncock has missed games. Otten play excellent role last year as a defender and hard running rebounder has been missed. Symes is another who played back sweeper, was good at this role and his rebounding has been missed this year. Goodwin also played more time back last year and due to injuries has been forced more in midfield.

Instead we have inexperienced backline at the moment with Davis, Schmidt, Jaensch and Doughty who played more in midfield in last year (did good jobs on watson, power and judd last year, and like to see him move back there).

So got two rookies, second year player and midfielder in the covering up holes in backline. I not suggesting that Davis, Schmidt or Jaensch be dropped.

 

[crow_fish]

I would be very suprised if Tippett would be fit enough this week, I was at Roos match and clearly something wasn't right in second half.

Spending a lot more time then usual on bench. And in last quarter he called bock in to take ruck contest in defensive 50 and moved out. Stevens also did more in ruck in later part of match.

I know he has issues with his knee, and isn't it the time now that we give him some time to get this right.

 

[Tex200]

the problem with your list is that it is arguable that they would all make a first choice 22. there are a lot of fringe performers there.

Thats easy to say. The fact remains this list represents almost half the side that went within a free kick of a prelim final 8 months ago.

 

[Crow-mo]

Thats easy to say. The fact remains this list represents almost half the side that went within a free kick of a prelim final 8 months ago.

yes its very easy to say

 

[feenix67]

Anyone saying our performances aren't significantly impacted by our injury count are just ignorant. The loss of even 1 week of preseason training can have a major effect on the base fitness level of a player. In the modern game, even a 1% differential in fitness level can be costly. The amount of players we have that had injury interrupted pre-seasons is much higher than in previous years and blind freddy can see that we're leg heavy and mentally fatigued.

What happens now is that the players lose confidence in themselves and their ability to play the game. They stop taking risks because they are afraid of making a mistake. They start making poor decisions because their movements arent natural and their thoughts arent clear. This is the first year I can remember playing so many underdone players. It cant be a change in philosophy - it has to be simple weight of numbers.

If ever people needed a reminder of the effect of injuries (or lack thereof) you only need to look back to 06, when we had a mediocre list full of supremely fit and healthy players capable of playing to a well thought out gameplan. We were untouchable. Our current list is no worse, yet we cant get near it. Look at our preparation and the amount of players carrying injury/not match fit. You dont have to be Einstein to work it out.

 

[birdmanptr]

I know its frustrating and we want look for different things but for mine injuries is still a key contributor to this mess. Missing from last years semi final team;

Knights
McKay
Thompson
Sellar
Symes
Otten
Johncock

If these players were fit they would be in our best 22 no question and would have a role to play as far as running the ball out of defence Kicking goals Sellar did a good job as 2nd ruck last year So while its sounds like a cop out to pull out the injury card lets just look at the facts we have KEY players not playing
Also we saw enough of Martin last year to suggest he would be pushing the best 22

Plus lets not forget that some of the kids would not get a look in if some/most of these guys were playing.The long term plus is that the kids will be better prepared by playing now where they would be running around the SANFL

 

[brucetiki]

It's interesting that the two teams I go for (Adelaide and Centrals) both have long injury lists, yet one side is 1-6, and the other is 5-1.

Injuries have a part to play with form, but at the end of the day Adelaide currently have too many players playing with no heart, no passion, and no desire. They know that they can go out there, play the crappest of the crap football, and know Neil Craig will be patting them on the back in the change room saying 'good job'. The players need to be told that how they're playing in disgraceful, they need to be punished on the track until they learn to play competitve football again.

 

[feenix67]

It's interesting that the two teams I go for (Adelaide and Centrals) both have long injury lists, yet one side is 1-6, and the other is 5-1.

Injuries have a part to play with form, but at the end of the day Adelaide currently have too many players playing with no heart, no passion, and no desire. They know that they can go out there, play the crappest of the crap football, and know Neil Craig will be patting them on the back in the change room saying 'good job'. The players need to be told that how they're playing in disgraceful, they need to be punished on the track until they learn to play competitve football again.

If you truly, honestly believe that to be the case, then you are seriously deluded.

 

[brucetiki]

If you truly, honestly believe that to be the case, then you are seriously deluded.

Yes, that was a slight exaggeration, but going on what Neil Craig's said in his press conferences this season (fans should be happy with the performance against Melbourne, Burton was solid in the Showdown etc), I do wonder if Neil Craig is rewarding mediocrity by allowing some players clearly not putting in the effort more gametime/games than they deserve.

 

[feenix67]

Yes, that was a slight exaggeration, but going on what Neil Craig's said in his press conferences this season (fans should be happy with the performance against Melbourne, Burton was solid in the Showdown etc), I do wonder if Neil Craig is rewarding mediocrity by allowing some players clearly not putting in the effort more gametime/games than they deserve.

Yeah, I find it hard to believe that Neil's background would allow him to reward mediocrity. He is, however, a man who bases his views around facts and figures. Perhaps his assessments are framed by facts and figures that we dont know about?