Jammo vs Richo - Contest by contest

[Bluebear]

Once again faced with sheer stupidity on this forum I am forced to take valuable time away from baby bear (actually I did it while he slept, but anyways)........to help people's memory a little.

The offending posts are:

I won't shame you here, but it's in the Jamison buddy thread[/color]]
First post
As I posted elsewhere it was Rocca-Dawson-esque

Second post
Wish I hadn't taped over game - do not remember all these times Richo BOG was beaten by Jammo.

It was Soooooooooooooo Rocca-Dawson-esque because it was exactly the same mismatch

- Undersized (gave away more than 2 stone)
- Inexperienced (gave away 251 games)

If you want to correct a newbie mate then get your facts right and get your head around the above

Secondly If you want to start telling people to post elsewhere - start being offended by the abusive criticism of our players and team by the ranters on this site.

Third post
I do not want to bag our players and I get the feeling Jammo may be a favourite of yours

No he did not get flogged as badly as Dawson but it was a mismatch.

http://finalsiren.com/AFLPlayerStats.asp

Rocca 15k 3h 8m 8.0gl Ranking 6 with 132pts
Dawson 1k 5h 1m Ranking 344 with 16pts


Richo 13k 2h 11m 5.2gl Ranking 25 with 104pts
Jammo 5k 2h 2m Ranking 341 with 23pts

I know stats can lie and I wish I had not taped this week's game over it so that I could appreciate the points you make but Jammo did not have a great game. He was a newbie playing his 6th game on a veteran.

We are on the same side

Well, I did still have the game on tape.
Here is a contest by contest description.
You guys be the judge.
Keep in mind the claim isn't that Jammo beat him, just that to compare it to Zac Dawson on Rocca is stupid, ridiculous, and unintelligent.




First Quarter

• 1 on 1 at Olympiuc stand 50m, Jammo spoils out of bounds
• 2 on 2 at top of goal square, Jammo holds Richo away from contest with body, Thornton marks in front (Brown running off for cheap kick)
• Richo marks on the lead 55m out Olympic stand side. Shanks kick so badly it WAS funny.
• Richo marks 30m out Southern pocket, in 1 on 1 vs Jammo, misses badly to right side
• Jammo marks weel out in front of Richo Olympic eing, delivers to F50 to Hartlett with precision kick
• Richo pushes Jammo in the back and marks. Free not paid. Misses badly to right again.
• Richo marks on lead at 50m, looks for shortpass and is called to play on, drills goal off one step.

7 contests, Richo 4, Jammo 3. Close but Richo with two goals takes the cake.




Second Quarter

• Richo out marked by Jammo in 1 on 1 at 45m members side
• Jammo spoils in 1 on 1 contest, similar position
• Richo marks on the lead outside 50m. Another poor kick inside 50 - rebounded to blues F50
• Richo out-wrestled in 1 on 1 by Jammo, Bannister arrives to mark over the top.
• Richo doubles back on lead and marks 20m out top of goal square. Goals.
• Pack 20m out top of square, Jammo spoils over Richo.
• Richo marks on lead defensive wing Southern side.
• Richo marks on wing, Jammo spoils with hip to back of Richo's head
• Jammo marks on defensive side of wing.

9 contests. Richo 4, Jammo 5. 1 goal, and to on defensive wing. Jammo wins the second Q IMO.




Third quarter

• Richo wrestled out by Jammo in 2 on 2. Thornton floats across in front and marks
• Jammo spoils Richo Southern stand 50m arc.
• Richo paid soft free for hand on arm (called push in the back - depsite two of these not being paid against him ), misses everything with the kick from 40m, members side.
• Richo gathers loose ball and tackled by Jammo, not kick or handball but no free for holding the ball either. Richo gets such a raw deal.
• Jammo runs off Richo and links up to hit Hoops with the footy on F 50......Richo in his wake.
• Thornton goes to Richo, Richo marks and kicks inside 50
• Richo gives free away pushing Thornton in the back
• Richo marks 70m out
• Richo gives away free holding Thornton
• Richo marks 30m out on Thornton, goals
• Thornton spoils Richo.

Jammo vs Richo = 5 contests, 4 to Jammo, 1 (dodgy free) to Richo, no goals.
Thornton vs Richo = 6 contests, 3 each and 1 goal




Fourth Quarter - Jammo back on

• Richo marks in 1 on 1 and goals
• Jammo first to loose ball on HFF and rushes OOB
• Jammo spoils Richo on 50m arc members HFF
• Richo beaten in 2 on 1 by Jammo and Banno
• Richo marks from ANOTHER hand in the back. Pushed in the side legit but initial hand clearly in the back of Jammo. Goal.
• Richo on the lead is spoiled.

6 contests - Richo wins 2 for two goals. Jammo wins 3, and one is a double team.

In total:
27 contests between Richo and Jammo.
Richo won 11 including 3 dodgy free kicks
Jammo won 15 and 1 double team from Banno.

Some might score it as a win, but Richo did kick 4 goals on Jammo.

Not exactly a Dawson-esque perfromance though now is it.

Now please, for the sake of my quality time with family and patients, think before you post, and try to watch the games you comment on.

BB out.

 

[Salaryman]

Love your work there BB

 

[Pamam]

bloody hell BlueBear!!!

i think u need to find another hobby!

definately agree with your comments once again!!!

Jammo is holding his own well enough for a player with less than 10 games experience

Richo has 10 years body maturity and is bound to win one one one tussle contests and any player cant stop forward on a good lead especially when the supply is decent!!

Jammo is a gun........my god.........what a gun!!!! to be put in his position and to show what he has shown only proves that he is definately worthy a spot in the defence but we also know there is still much improvement left!

i hope he gives it to Lloyd after the crap goals he scored last year!!!

 

[btdg]

Nice work. I thought that Jammo did a respectable job on Richo, certainly seems to have the technique, just needs to add a little muscle

Of course, a forward only needs to win 5-6 contests in a match to win the day, if they convert those into 4-5 goals. Richo winning 11 might be seen as a bad day for Jammo - someone like Lloyd might convert those 11 into 7 or 8 goals and really be the difference. But we're forgetting that Richo is a dominant forward capable of changing games. If Jammo is going to be our full-back, he's going to play on a lot of those, and his efforts on Richo weren't bad. Not match-winning, and Richo probably won on the day, but a decent job nonetheless...

 

[judd5]

Jammo is our future at FB, and hopefully this week is given the job on Lloyd.

 

[Blue Dawn]

Jammo is our future at FB, and hopefully this week is given the job on Lloyd.

Can we please, please, please see Setanta back for another rollicking rund on Lloydy?

 

[AlecDuncan]

Quality work BB. As others have pointed out. Jammo did nothing wrong that night. Occasionally he got out-muscled. Other times he was beaten on the lead where Richo had plenty of space and good delivery. Most of the time he was exactly where he was meant to be and fighting all the way.

 

[Pamam]

Quality work BB. As others have pointed out. Jammo did nothing wrong that night. Occasionally he got out-muscled. Other times he was beaten on the lead where Richo had plenty of space and good delivery. Most of the time he was exactly where he was meant to be and fighting all the way.

and thats why he is becoming a blues fan favourite

coz he fights all the way!!!!

 

[as0l0]

and thats why he is becoming a blues fan favourite

coz he fights all the way!!!!

BlueBear or Jammo?

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

A spoil is a win then?? Not a break even?? A clear contest win, then yes give him a point.... but awarding a win just for holding his ground while another defender floats across to mark... come on. The much easier act of spoiling should not be worth the same points as a mark/kick/goal for the forward. 50/50 split at best.

Based on your breakdown, I've counted 4 clear wins to Jamison, 11 to Richo, plus 4 goals.

Jamison soundly beaten.

 

[judd5]

Can we please, please, please see Setanta back for another rollicking rund on Lloydy?

Setanta can take Lloyd out as much as possible and whenever possible as far as i'm concerned.

 

[eyeofthetiger]

you blokes still dwelling on this ? surely u'd be talkin about the bombers game by now.......which i hope u guys win. sure jammo is gonna be a good player but he was def killed on the night....had it been for some poor kicking and supply to richo he could of easily had 8. jammo is reminds me of will thursfield is hes first 2 yrs only goin to get better both hungry to earn there spot from the rookie list.

1 point i def agree on this kid is hes def gonna be better than that hack from the dawks. ZAC DAWKSON.

 

[Pamam]

BlueBear or Jammo?

jammo.....but bb is becoming a favourite on BF!!

 

[Artie Bucco]

Yeah Agree with that. Richo won the contest on the night but it wasn't the shellacking people were saying. Jamo did well and is going to be a beaty, if our mids can stem the flow of ball into the D 50 he will do well this year. I have no doubt once he hits 50 games he can be in the top few FB's in the league

Setanta can take Lloyd out as much as possible and whenever possible as far as i'm concerned.

yeah I'm all for Jamo but just on Lloyd I love to see Setanta on him

 

[Magnificence]

Jammo has a real future but he got monstered by Richo

 

[Bluebear]

bloody hell BlueBear!!!

i think u need to find another hobby!

Heading to U.K. for a month so I think maybe I'm cramming a months worth of posting into these last few days.

A spoil is a win then?? Not a break even?? A clear contest win, then yes give him a point.... but awarding a win just for holding his ground while another defender floats across to mark... come on. The much easier act of spoiling should not be worth the same points as a mark/kick/goal for the forward. 50/50 split at best.

Whatever. Doesn't surprise me at all to see you post this.

The FACT is mate, if you are playing full back, and spoil your opponent whenever he goes for the mark YOU HAVE BEATEN HIM........CLEARLY.

The comments and contests were made in light (if you bothered to put the post in context, which you seem to try very hard not too) of the comparisons made to Zac Dawson.

In this light........and in any light, a spoil, holding your ground to not allow Richo a run on the ball........are all wins. You are stopping him. That's your job. Did you think Waite was beaten by Riewoldt if Riewoldt had 2 more kicks? No, Roo who normally dominates games was ineffective and Waite spoiled him time and time again.........THAT'S A WIN TO WAITE.

FFS.

The count stands.

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

Heading to U.K. for a month so I think maybe I'm cramming a months worth of posting into these last few days.



Whatever. Doesn't surprise me at all to see you post this.

The FACT is mate, if you are playing full back, and spoil your opponent whenever he goes for the mark YOU HAVE BEATEN HIM........CLEARLY.

The comments and contests were made in light (if you bothered to put the post in context, which you seem to try very hard not too) of the comparisons made to Zac Dawson.

In this light........and in any light, a spoil, holding your ground to not allow Richo a run on the ball........are all wins. You are stopping him. That's your job. Did you think Waite was beaten by Riewoldt if Riewoldt had 2 more kicks? No, Roo who normally dominates games was ineffective and Waite spoiled him time and time again.........THAT'S A WIN TO WAITE.

FFS.

The count stands.

I groan loudly in your direction.

You are putting the same value on a defender simply holding his ground (in the scheme of things, very easy), as what you put on a forward taking a contested mark and kicking a goal (very difficult). Don't you see the lop-sidedness of your argument??

 

[Salaryman]

I groan loudly in your direction.

You are putting the same value on a defender simply holding his ground (in the scheme of things, very easy), as what you put on a forward taking a contested mark and kicking a goal (very difficult). Don't you see the lop-sidedness of your argument??

I'm not sure BB was too concerned about weighting the degree of difficulty of each contest, but simply lookingat where Richmond came out on top and where Carlton came out on top.......you could analyse the subtle nuances of each contest until the cows come home, in fact why don't you do that for us? For making a point and a crude analysis I think it did its job. Of course splitting hairs would again highlight your superior knowledge over the rest of us because we can't forget you played the game at a high level

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

I'm not sure BB was too concerned about weighting the degree of difficulty of each contest, but simply lookingat where Richmond came out on top and where Carlton came out on top.......you could analyse the subtle nuances of each contest until the cows come home, in fact why don't you do that for us? For making a point and a crude analysis I think it did its job. Of course splitting hairs would again highlight your superior knowledge over the rest of us because we can't forget you played the game at a high level

So if you can see how biased the argument is, then surely you have to see that it holds no water. It's flawed from the start. I'm attacking the whole foundation on which his argument is based... think that's a little more major than "splitting hairs".

 

[Bluebear]

So if you can see how biased the argument is, then surely you have to see that it holds no water. It's flawed from the start. I'm attacking the whole foundation on which his argument is based... think that's a little more major than "splitting hairs".

Defender - Job Desription
Stop your opponent from winning the ball and kicking goals.

Secondary aim - win the footy yourself.

As I said (and now for the very last time), I don't think Jammo BEAT Richo on the night. Richo DID kick 4 goals on him.

The point.....and the basis for the arguement......is that Richo did not beat Jammo in a Dawson-esque fashion.

To argue semantics over other points is out of context and can be taken to another thread.

If you think Jammo was Dawson like in his defeat then put up an arguement.......which is a lot harder to do than just cherry picking someone elses from the cheap seats.

With your superior footy knowledge it shouldn't be too hard to mount an actual arguement should it?

Please explain the Zac Dawson like qualities of Jammo's performance and I will bow to your superior brain.

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

I'm not sure BB was too concerned about weighting the degree of difficulty of each contest, but simply lookingat where Richmond came out on top and where Carlton came out on top.......you could analyse the subtle nuances of each contest until the cows come home, in fact why don't you do that for us? For making a point and a crude analysis I think it did its job. Of course splitting hairs would again highlight your superior knowledge over the rest of us because we can't forget you played the game at a high level

So if you can see how biased his argument is, then surely you can appreciate that it holds no water. It's flawed from the start. My argument is the fact that his whole foundation on which his points system is based is completely wrong... nothing to do with the actual contests individually. Think that's a little more major than "splitting hairs".

One point for getting a hand in on a scrappy kick
One point for taking a big contested grab in front of goal and slotting it.
Sounds fair to me...

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

Defender - Job Desription
Stop your opponent from winning the ball and kicking goals.

Secondary aim - win the footy yourself.

As I said (and now for the very last time), I don't think Jammo BEAT Richo on the night. Richo DID kick 4 goals on him.

The point.....and the basis for the arguement......is that Richo did not beat Jammo in a Dawson-esque fashion.

To argue semantics over other points is out of context and can be taken to another thread.

If you think Jammo was Dawson like in his defeat then put up an arguement.......which is a lot harder to do than just cherry picking someone elses from the cheap seats.

With your superior footy knowledge it shouldn't be too hard to mount an actual arguement should it?

Please explain the Zac Dawson like qualities of Jammo's performance and I will bow to your superior brain.

When did I ever say it was a Dawson style humiliation?? My argument has been that your points system is fundamentally wrong and doesn't paint an accurate picture of what happened. You can't, in all seriousness, stand by the accuracy of that system, can you?? It puts a big dent in your credibility if you do.

Jamison was soundly beaten. End of story. As for those calling it a Dawson -esque embarrassment, not to that degree... I surely never said it was.

 

[a1118374]

Sadly BB i agree with ill nasty or whatever. At the game i thought jamo did great. He did as well as anyone could with richo having time to do 2-3 leads with no pressure on the player with the ball able to eventually execute a near perfect pass giving jamo no chance. I think richo won in the end, but kudos to jamo.

As we saw the other night out defenders arent the main issue....it all starts with midfield pressure, you cant consistently give up the corridor and beat anyone

 

[Blueinblood]

Jammison will eat richo for breakfast after another pre-season

 

[Murph_The_Smurf]

I groan loudly in your direction.

You are putting the same value on a defender simply holding his ground (in the scheme of things, very easy), as what you put on a forward taking a contested mark and kicking a goal (very difficult). Don't you see the lop-sidedness of your argument??

You don't know what your talking about ... with the rules now OBVIOUSLY favouring forwards.. i think its next to nearly impossible to spoil an opponent especially one the size of richo... and to hold a bloke like richo down is an awesome job !