Jobe could keep Brownlow...

[themarkedman72]

You said poor, not average. Changing your tune much? He was basically our entire side under Knights, but we'll ignore that because it doesn't suit your arguments

Incorrect. His average disposals actually dropped from the previous year under Knights in Hird's first year, his average marks increased by 0.4 a game, and he tackled less.

Do you understand what PEDs do? Because ******* hell you're woefully ignorant if you think they magically make your kicking better

lol wut. In 2008 Jobe had 5 games under 20 disposals, 09 he had 4 games with less than 20, in 2010 he had 2. Really indicates he can't get away from a tag

Because somehow magically he increased his aerobic capacity. No, he must be taking PEDs. That's the only way people can improve ever.

kicking under pressure is different to having the strength to break free and kick free from pressure.

Jobe is a bull now. His strength is increased and his body fat is way low compared to before so he is not pulling so much useless weight. Maybe he was on the weight loss jabs?

Either way there was a marked improvement, abnormal improvement after the arrival of dank and the weapon.

Your in denial, I think that clearly outlines you as the woefully ignorant person in this conversation.

Whats more your clearly upset, take a moment, breath deep and relax, your not essendon.

 

[The Prosecutor]

kicking under pressure is different to having the strength to break free and kick free from pressure.

Jobe is a bull now. His strength is increased and his body fat is way low compared to before so he is not pulling so much useless weight. Maybe he was on the weight loss jabs?

Either way there was a marked improvement, abnormal improvement after the arrival of dank and the weapon.

Your in denial, I think that clearly outlines you as the woefully ignorant person in this conversation.

Whats more your clearly upset, take a moment, breath deep and relax, your not essendon.

Yet, you're completely full of s**t in this post.

He was always strong, you have no idea if he has lost any fat at all and he was one of the best well before Dank rocked up.

 

[RegHickeyStand]

You said poor, not average. Changing your tune much? He was basically our entire side under Knights, but we'll ignore that because it doesn't suit your arguments

Incorrect. His average disposals actually dropped from the previous year under Knights in Hird's first year, his average marks increased by 0.4 a game, and he tackled less.

Do you understand what PEDs do? Because ******* hell you're woefully ignorant if you think they magically make your kicking better

lol wut. In 2008 Jobe had 5 games under 20 disposals, 09 he had 4 games with less than 20, in 2010 he had 2. Really indicates he can't get away from a tag

Because somehow magically he increased his aerobic capacity. No, he must be taking PEDs. That's the only way people can improve ever.

He has always been a good player. I think it's just unfortunate he had his breakout year during the drug scandal year.

 

[The Prosecutor]

He has always been a good player. I think it's just unfortunate he had his breakout year during the drug scandal year.

He was breaking out in 2011 before Dank was even at the club. He was leading the Brownlow when he did his hamstring in Round7-8.

2012 just picked up where he left off.

 

[eth-dog]

Jobe is a bull now. His strength is increased and his body fat is way low compared to before so he is not pulling so much useless weight. Maybe he was on the weight loss jabs?

Either way there was a marked improvement, abnormal improvement after the arrival of dank and the weapon.

Your in denial, I think that clearly outlines you as the woefully ignorant person in this conversation.

Whats more your clearly upset, take a moment, breath deep and relax, your not essendon.

Yes, that happened in the 2006 pre-season, he got rid of the fat and put on the muscle. But let's not allow the facts get in the way of a good story, ey?

Not really. He increased his aerobic capacity, not his muscle strength. For that to have been done through doping Jobe would have had to inject oxygen into his blood stream. Funnily enough Essendon haven't been accused of blood doping. But it was the PEDs, wasn't it?

I'm in denial? Where is the evidence of that? PED's don't improve skills, what they do is increase muscle mass- funnily enough Jobe's weight has been consistently at around 94 kgs since around 2007/08.

Sarcasm automatically means I'm upset.

 

[eth-dog]

He has always been a good player. I think it's just unfortunate he had his breakout year during the drug scandal year.

Averages for the first 7 rounds of 2011 (before injury):

31 disposals, 5 marks, 1.6 goals, 3.7 tackles per game. He was leading the brownlow at the half way stage of the year. That tells me he dominated the first part of the year (and against 3 top 5 sides of that season too)

 

[RegHickeyStand]

Averages for the first 7 rounds of 2011 (before injury):

31 disposals, 5 marks, 1.6 goals, 3.7 tackles per game. He was leading the brownlow at the half way stage of the year. That tells me he dominated the first part of the year (and against 3 top 5 sides of that season too)

Drugs can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Nobody is saying that.

That means he took to the hard training regime of Hird/Thompson, then broke down, like a lot of Essendon players did in 2011/2012. Being a more mature body meant he was going to be more stable than the younger guys. Be a shame if it turns out he took illegal substances. I must admit I was gobsmacked at how he got BOG after BOG in 2012. Especially against top sides. I know if Selwood has a big game against a team like Sydney, he doesn't play at that level against a lesser side the next week, generally.

 

[eth-dog]

Drugs can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Nobody is saying that.

That means he took to the hard training regime of Hird/Thompson, then broke down, like a lot of Essendon players did in 2011/2012. Being a more mature body meant he was going to be more stable than the younger guys. Be a shame if it turns out he took illegal substances. I must admit I was gobsmacked at how he got BOG after BOG in 2012. Especially against top sides. I know if Selwood has a big game against a team like Sydney, he doesn't play at that level against a lesser side the next week, generally.

He did it in the early part of 2012, where he had a midfield around him so he didn't have to do all the heavy lifting. He increased his tank a lot, so naturally he got up for games more often

 

[Dan26]

Just for a hoot I'm going to explain it to you in a way you might understand

I understand perfectly. You're the one with youre head buried in the sand. Total denial of reality.

No ones erasing the fact that Ben Johnson won the race

No ones erasing the fact that Lance Armstrong won 7 tour de-France turtles

People do think that way. There are idiots out there who think the above two athletes didn't win. They might have done so unfairly, but they won.

The records are being amended to reflect that those that have gained an illegal advantage goes against the spirit of sport and its nature.

You just don't get it. The naivity and ignorance is astounding. "Amending" a record is just an author penning something in a book. That's all it is. It's meaningless. It's irrelevant. No one cares about an "amended" record because it bears NO reality to the actual historical event. It's a fictional construction.

These people are scum and should be looked upon with distain you strip the medal to reflect that they don't deserve it

A medal is just a symbol. There are brownlow medallists who have sold their medals. The piece of metal itself is irrelevant. All that matters is "did they win" and if they polled the most votes without being suspended, they won. You can't change the past. Likewise, atheletes cheat in evey game. At last years Gradn Final (I was sitting near the fence) I saw Ted Richards holding onto Lance Franklin deliberately, with the ball in the air. No big deal, but he was still cheating. Deliberately. He got away with it. Who knows whether Franklin would have taken the mark and whether that would have been the difference?

Remember the famous photo of Leo Barrys mark? Look at who Tagh Kennelly is holding on to. Cheating. On purpose. But he got away with it. If you get away with it, and don't get caught, so be it. it might be unfair, but you can't change the past. West Coast fans just need to accept it.

Future generations might think it was unfair that Sydney won two premierships (both narrowly) with more salary cap room. Nothing that can be done about it. It's over. They won. Putting an asterix next to it in a history book won't mean a thing.

I'll wager you've never really invested alot of yourself into any sporting endeavour, to train that hard to do everything you could and fail, is hard enough.

I have actually. But it's a moot point and irrelevant to the discussion. My personal sporting prowess is irrelevant and anyone who engages in personal attacks (as you just did towards me) is conceding a loss in the debate. Stick to the facts.

but at the same time your gracious you take your hat off to your opponent he's just better then you he trained better invested more good on him.

Then you find out he's such a pissweak a-hole he injected s**t so he could be that good because he didn't have what it took to do it without it.

It's not fair, I agree. But, that's just bad luck. They won. Plenty of athlestes deliberately cheat on purpose by breaking rules. Barry Hall cheated in 2005 for example. He belted someone behind play (on purpose), admitted 8 years later that he wasn't honest and he should have admitted guilt and been suspended. He broke the rules, cheated on purpose, got away with it, and played in a premiership that was only won because he cheated one week earlier.

It's not fair. But that's just bad luck. he got away with it. History is history, it can't be changed. Deal with it.

Truth is if Watson was a decent bloke, if he believed there was any chance he may have achieved an unfair advantage over his peers or acted in a way that diminishes the prestige of the award, he would have already handed back his medal.

The mans either extremely sure that he did nothing untoward or he's a ******* dog like Mr Armstrong.

Nothing about Jobe Watson indicates that he is anything other than a top bloke who plays the game with integrity, honour and class and respect.

 

[Dan26]

The storm where cheating

Agree.

and had their flags stripped

Their flags were not stripped. The NRL wrote down in a book that they were stripped. But that means nothing. They played and won them. I have the DVD's. It happened.

Just "saying" something is stripped doesn't mean it actually is. You can't strip someone of something and change history, just to satisfy your own desire for justice.

History is history. It can't be changed. The only penatly the Storm got was not being able to accrue points in the 2010 season. The 2007 and 2009 premierships were played, won, enjoyed and celebrated, and nothing an author pens in a book changes any of that historical fact.

Those flags were not won.

They were actually. Who do you think you are? Doc brown and Marty McFly?

Just "saying" they weren't won doesn't change history. Words and authors don't change history. They only record it. If you record events incorrectly, you are only cheating yourself.

 

[themarkedman72]

Agree.



Their flags were not stripped. The NRL wrote down in a book that they were stripped. But that means nothing. They played and won them. I have the DVD's. It happened.

Just "saying" something is stripped doesn't mean it actually is. You can't strip someone of something and change history, just to satisfy your own desire for justice.

History is history. It can't be changed. The only penatly the Storm got was not being able to accrue points in the 2010 season. The 2007 and 2009 premierships were played, won, enjoyed and celebrated, and nothing an author pens in a book changes any of that historical fact.



They were actually. Who do you think you are? Doc brown and Marty McFly?

Just "saying" they weren't won doesn't change history. Words and authors don't change history. They only record it. If you record events incorrectly, you are only cheating yourself.

when you cheat and get caught, No one thinks your a winner.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Even if Watson was injecting roids, him getting a Brownlow Is still more acceptable than Brad Hardy winning one

 

[QS]

He is the captain and knew knew full well what was going on and endorsed it.

Would you like a broom for that sweeping statement?