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John Coleman

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Is it me or is it whenver I ask someone who is actually old enough to see him play, they all regard him as the greatest ever. I'm pretty sure there wont be too many comments on here about Coleman due to the average age on here.

But I've seen on t.v and asked alot of men and women who are in their 50's 60's whose the greatest player they have seen and probably- no exageration, they all say John Coleman.

I wish the was footage or some sought of film that could have done this man justice to the younger football followers of today.

But you can also say that during 60's 70's most people around those times would say either Ian Stewert or Leigh Matthews is the greatest ever.

What i'm trying to get to is...is it possible to compare players of different generations? IMO it is impossible, due to one large reason. About 5% of Australia's population have and they would be probably to senile to judge on such topic.
 
At the very least you would have to say that he was very very good.

Full Forward of the team of the century, and there have been some bloody good full forwards in the history or the comp - and yet no one has really argued against this one.
 
EB_Tiger said:
is it possible to compare players of different generations?
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Not really. Was it harder or easier in Colman's day than Coventry's, Hudson's or Locketts? Who had better supply or less competition? Would a player who played a lot less games have remained as productive over an extended time like Coventry or Lockett?
 

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MarkT said:
Not really. Was it harder or easier in Colman's day than Coventry's, Hudson's or Locketts? Who had better supply or less competition? Would a player who played a lot less games have remained as productive over an extended time like Coventry or Lockett?
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Would modern coaching strategies negate a player like Coleman? Or would Coleman's coach think up other counter strategies to make him even more effctive?

Impossible to compare.
 
It's also the nature of old people to claim people from their generation are the best ever. Makes them feel superior.

They do the same in giving no credit to the current Australian cricket side even though it's statistically the best ever.
 
I reckon he's record and myth is slightly overated.
I wouldn't rank Coleman ahead of Pratt, Coventry or Lockett.
Pratt kicked 150 goals in a season, something coleman never did.
 
Coleman is certainly a favorite of mine but IMO he doesn't deserve the greatest ever title because he wasn't able to maintain his form over a long period of time... I think he did it for 5 years before injury finished him.

Tony Modra's had a very similar success rate over the first 5 years of his career (slightly worse I think) and then tapered off... I think that's what would have happened to John.

Still a great player though and he's classic mark is my favorite
 
Hard to compare.

Statistically Played 98 games for 537 goals @ 5.47 per game from the age of 22 to 27

Pluggers career average was under 5.

But between the ages of
17-22 played 93 games for 352 goals @ 3.78
22-27 played 80 games for 495 goals @ 6.18
27-35 played 92 games for 464 goals @ 5.04
 
Overrated.

How can someone be judged on 98 games of football?

Obviously had talent to burn, but to be declared the greatest ever is ridiculous.

What was Allen Jakovich's record like in his first 50 games?
 
RodgerFox said:
Overrated.
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How can you say that when you never saw him play.
The ones who say he is the greatest ever are the ones that saw him play. Obviously that is debatable but to rule him out as over-rated is mindless.
 
Longy413 said:
How can you say that when you never saw him play.
The ones who say he is the greatest ever are the ones that saw him play. Obviously that is debatable but to rule him out as over-rated is mindless.
Click to expand...

To call him the best ever is to overrate Coleman.
 

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celtic_pride said:
To call him the best ever is to overrate Coleman.
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Why?
Someone has to be the best ever. The guys who say he was saw him play, it's a matter of opinion. The fact that people (football people) saw him play and rate him as the best they saw doesn't make him over-rated.

There is no doubt he was an extremely gifted footballer. The best of his time...he drew a crowd, probably like no other. The stories (factual) about him are incredible.
 
Longy413 said:
Why?
Someone has to be the best ever. The guys who say he was saw him play, it's a matter of opinion. The fact that people (football people) saw him play and rate him as the best they saw doesn't make him over-rated.

There is no doubt he was an extremely gifted footballer. The best of his time...he drew a crowd, probably like no other. The stories (factual) about him are incredible.
Click to expand...

Well yes I would agree with the best of his time, but I certainly cannot rate him ahead of players like Pratt, Lockett or Hudson.
Besides the memory cheats and those old geezers who saw Coleman are probably remembering him through rose tinted glasses.
Coleman never kicked 150 goals in a season.
 
celtic_pride said:
Well yes I would agree with the best of his time, but I certainly cannot rate him ahead of players like Pratt, Lockett or Hudson.
Besides the memory cheats and those old geezers who saw Coleman are probably remembering him through rose tinted glasses.
Coleman never kicked 150 goals in a season.
Click to expand...

Scuse my ignorance but how long was the season when Coleman played?
 
Longy413 said:
Why?
Someone has to be the best ever. The guys who say he was saw him play, it's a matter of opinion. The fact that people (football people) saw him play and rate him as the best they saw doesn't make him over-rated.

There is no doubt he was an extremely gifted footballer. The best of his time...he drew a crowd, probably like no other. The stories (factual) about him are incredible.
Click to expand...

Without stating the obvious, there is more to a footballer than his talent.

Longevity, physical presence, consistency and durability are but a few.

He played 98 games!! His career ended with a knee injury. Granted that medical science wasn't as advanced as it is now, but I cannot see how a player who didn't even get to 100 games could even be considered as the best player ever.

If the question was 'who was the most talented player you've seen?', then it's an entirely different story.
 

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Longevity?

Cant have been the best footballer ever because he didnt play enough games?

Or he cant be the best footballer because he played in the wrong jumper.

This is ridiculous
 
Fogarty said:
18 home and away games. :)
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So would be fair to say any arguments about Coleman not kicking 150 goals are void as season was considerably shorter.
 
Allblack said:
Longevity?

Cant have been the best footballer ever because he didnt play enough games?

Or he cant be the best footballer because he played in the wrong jumper.

This is ridiculous
Click to expand...

If Andrew Walker retired after his fist game, would you have called him one of Carlton's greats?

He would have had a career average of 30 posessions, a career average of 2 goals and never played in a losing team.

Do you see my point?

As for the jumper comment, I actually find it hilarious that Essendon supporters are sticking up for a guy who played 1000 years ago simply because he was an Essendon player.

Now that's ridiculous.
 
Allblack said:
So would be fair to say any arguments about Coleman not kicking 150 goals are void as season was considerably shorter.
Click to expand...

Shorter than now.

But not shorter than when Hudson played.
 
OK good topic.The person who started this is quite correct.All who watched him will all say he is the best player ever.
He was unique,brilliant a team man,exciting,unpredictable at times and a genius.Relaxed and confident.
He was also huge in the media.Go check some of that era.He was a star never approached since.
He took huge risks which unfortunately explains his knee injury which ended his career.Leaping over the top of packs every game are not good odds,but he did every week and generaly succeeded.
Different time now we know,but players these days or for that matter in the last 20 years would not be allowed to take the risks he and others did.
As for those who say those who can remember,regard older players as better are mistaken.I don't.
Todays stars a fantastic and the overall standard is far far higher.There were a lot of very average but gutsy players then.
And the average but gutsy players were the ones who bashed Coleman every week.And helped to bring him down.
 

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