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Toast Josh Fraser

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Ist ruck at 19 what chance did he have and he was never the same after that interstate match,if we had of had Monkey still when Fraser came to the club he may have played 300 he certainly had the skill for it.

He played 200 here and not many of us can say that,he never had the size to a 1st ruck and the pity of it is we never had anyone else to help him.
 
In Nick Maxwell's book, "One Grand Week", NIck recounts a conversation that he had with Fraser. He writes that Fraser only saw himself as a ruckman.

I find this a shame because Jolly was clearly the number one option in 2010 and Fraser refused to adapt. Fraser would have been anyones first option to play the 'Leigh Brown' role, but my opinion is that Leigh Brown was much hungier than Fraser and was prepared to do whatever he could to be in the side. Fraser never reinvented himself. Never played a game mostly forward then pinch-hitting in the ruck. Never wanted to. But somehow it's been a good enough role for Paul Salmon, Brad Ottens, Nick Naitanui...

I believe it contributed to us losing the flag in 2011
 

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The interesting part of the interview above is not so much what Fraser said but what he didn't say. He thanked coaches at GCS and one or two assistant coaches from Collingwood, but not Mick Malthouse, of whom he made no mention. Nor did he thank Collingwood supporters, though he did semi-allude to them when he thanked GCS fans for their support, saying he 'got plenty of the other' during his career. It is a shame he has been left with such bitter memories of his time at ourclub.
 
At his best he was very good, he always stood up and played great when up against Cox in the Perth games. But at the other end he was pathetically weak, getting outmarked by Bell was just laughable. I remember his game against the Dees in 2010 and just wished he would **** off.

I reckon the turning point for most pies supporters towards Fraser was the 2007 final series, when we wouldn't put his hand up to play in that prelim stating that he wasn't right to go. losing by less than a kick, with Ottens just dominating, i always wonder what would have happened if Fraser played.
 
MyManDawes said:
The interesting part of the interview above is not so much what Fraser said but what he didn't say. He thanked coaches at GCS and one or two assistant coaches from Collingwood, but not Mick Malthouse, of whom he made no mention. Nor did he thank Collingwood supporters, though he did semi-allude to them when he thanked GCS fans for their support, saying he 'got plenty of the other' during his career. It is a shame he has been left with such bitter memories of his time at ourclub.
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He copped the blame for Malthouse's total mismanagement of his career, far too many blind and short sighted supporters couldn't see the facts that were right in front of them and blamed Josh.

A shameful episode for our club.
 
I never thought he was a ruckman.

He would be better suited to today's game, rather than 10 years ago.
 
jonbe54 said:
He copped the blame for Malthouse's total mismanagement of his career, far too many blind and short sighted supporters couldn't see the facts that were right in front of them and blamed Josh.

A shameful episode for our club.
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I think Malthouse had an expectation about what a ruckman should be able to do and Fraser didn't quite measure up - the "dogging it" incident against Hille springs to mind. That said, we didn't develop a single ruckman in mick's tenure at the club which is disappointing
 
Yonchi said:
I think Malthouse had an expectation about what a ruckman should be able to do and Fraser didn't quite measure up - the "dogging it" incident against Hille springs to mind. That said, we didn't develop a single ruckman in mick's tenure at the club which is disappointing
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The problem is Yonchi he never had a first ruck body and he never had any assistance, he was worked into the ground by Malthouse with no support offered, yet when Eddie gave Mick a prod and told him to get on with it or get out he quick smart got a first ruck didn't he.

No Yonchi Mick destroyed Josh's career because he wanted things his way, as always.
 
jonbe54 said:
The problem is Yonchi he never had a first ruck body and he never had any assistance, he was worked into the ground by Malthouse with no support offered, yet when Eddie gave Mick a prod and told him to get on with it or get out he quick smart got a first ruck didn't he.

No Yonchi Mick destroyed Josh's career because he wanted things his way, as always.
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I think we're agreeing with each other here. Can you imagine playing a new draftee for 21 games in his first season? In particular a ruckman.

What did Mick think was going to happen? Did he have any better than a 'she'll be right' attitude to Fraser?
 
I don't like slagging any Collingwood player. It is never a players fault they get drafted to play. Most of them try their hardest, but are not good enough. Josh Fraser was a #1 draft pick and he did not ask for this. He was considered the best player by Collingwood. He came to the club as a young and skinny kid and was thrown into the ruck to play against gorillas. He was savaged week after week by players much bigger and physically stronger than him. He tried his hardest and he played a lot of great games. I will always remember his performance in 2002 Prelim against Adelaide. I think he kicked 4-5 goals. People always remember the negative and forget the positive. I wish Josh forgets his grudges and comes back to the club some day. He was never the same player after copping the knee injury in that all star game. Before that, he was starting to show some of the talent he had. Wish the guy all the best in the future. He is actually a good bloke !
 

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I've taken issue with Josh Fraser for his whole career, not because of him but because of what his drafting represented to me. Below is part of my standard Josh Fraser rant...

Josh was named vice captain in 2008 which represented the opportune time to start 'dogging it' and getting dropped from the team. He once finished 4th in the collingwood B+F. Not too shabby? Pathetic actually. As a number one draft pick - the best he ever did in club polling.

But when you get to the crux of the matter, why would we have wanted Pavlich in that draft anyway?
And who wouldn't select Rhyce Shaw at number 18 in that draft?
And why wouldn't you take Steve McKee (trading away your number 3 pick so that you can pick up Danny Roach at number 7 ?
Ben Johnson - the best #62 drafted ever (afl website) and the drafting of Leon Davis in comparison to the above was not the most ridiculous thing we did that at draft time. Methinks luck played a part

Josh Fraser represents a draft that could have really put Collingwood in the box seat for a decade (note who Geelong drafted). To me he represents all that that was totally f*&cked about Collingwood in the mid-to-late 90s
 
Yonchi said:
I think we're agreeing with each other here. Can you imagine playing a new draftee for 21 games in his first season? In particular a ruckman.

What did Mick think was going to happen? Did he have any better than a 'she'll be right' attitude to Fraser?
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I agree with this.

We definitely ran him into the ground.
 
MyManDawes said:
The interesting part of the interview above is not so much what Fraser said but what he didn't say. He thanked coaches at GCS and one or two assistant coaches from Collingwood, but not Mick Malthouse, of whom he made no mention. Nor did he thank Collingwood supporters, though he did semi-allude to them when he thanked GCS fans for their support, saying he 'got plenty of the other' during his career. It is a shame he has been left with such bitter memories of his time at ourclub.
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FFS it was an interview on the GC website. How often do you hear Luke Ball waxing lyrical about Ross Lyon and St K fans on our website. Fraser is an easy target but he gave Collingwood a lot of great football and was cut down in his prime with injury. He carried too much too soon. The PCL injury in the state game he never really recovered from. In that interview he didn't bag Collingwood at all and thanked some people at the club who had been good supporters, Balme, Kliman etc. He didn't need to say anthing about MM. That wasn't bitterness.

He was unfairly maligned often. The incident with Hille was highlighted far more than it needed to be. We lost that match in bad circumstances, Ryder played great but Fraser was no where near as bad as made out (Ryder 6K, 10HB,1M,27HO v Fraser 6K, 13HB,2M, 27HO) . He was an easy scapegoat. Remember he came out and smacked Essendon in the return match BOG that day. Below is a description from Football Almanac that day


Josh Fraser is relentless in the ruck and on several occasions finds our players in space from his hitouts. It is as if Josh is carrying the headlines from Anzac Day on his black and white back and shaking them off one by one. At the end of the quarter he lays his stamp on the game by kicking a snapped goal from a forward-line ruck contest. He finishes the night the most influential player on the ground.

Fraser was similar to Kreuzer in his 1st 3 seasons, took on a big workload , was exciting and handled it (to the detriment of his later career). He was better than Kreuze in fact as he kick goals, 38 one season. We burnt him but he played 200 games and I tip my hat to him. Carlton should take note.
 
Gone Critical is entitled to his opinion but my reading of the interview remains exactly the same. The fact that Josh thanked people at Collingwood but not Malthouse strongly suggests he is not a big fan of MM. As far as our supporters are concerned, let's be frank, they were incredibly critical of him throughout the latter part of his career, sometimes rightfully so, such as the Peter Bell mark incident. There was that famous moment when he cupped a hand to his ear after kicking a goal, as if asking where the boos and jeers are now. Maxwell at the time remarked on the fact that fans had given Fraser a hard time.
 
Josh Fraser represented a new start for our club. I remember his first game and a goal he kicked in the first quarter, I think it was against Hawthorn?

There is an element of truth in saying that Josh refused to adapt in 2011 and hence his subsequent departure. The reality of the matter is that today the club does a much better job of developing a player's potential and strengths. We simply didn't do that with him.

Fraser copped a baptism by fire. His performance in the state of origin game displayed his talents to the world, his injury in that same game illustrated his dumb luck.

I'll remember him as the dawn of a new era for the CFC, and also as an instance where the club didn't do a great job to help a young man become the best version of himself.

And stop hating FFS!
 

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Imagine if instead of trading Michael for Molloy we had traded Michael for McDonald or Keating.

Imagine instead of letting Ottens go to Geelong we gave up our first and second round picks to Richmond that we wasted on Egan and Rusling.

Imagine how good Fraser would have been with a Keating or an Ottens by his side.
 
Timmy from Thomastown said:
Imagine if instead of trading Michael for Molloy we had traded Michael for McDonald or Keating.

Imagine instead of letting Ottens go to Geelong we gave up our first and second round picks to Richmond that we wasted on Egan and Rusling.

Imagine how good Fraser would have been with a Keating or an Ottens by his side.
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I beg to differ on Rusling Timmy - no fair sinking the slipper into a bloke that tried his guts out and was cruelled by the most incredible run of injuries for a single player that I have ever seen.

Shaun had class enough and more to make the big time but never got a clear run at it.
 
jonbe54 said:
I beg to differ on Rusling Timmy - no fair sinking the slipper into a bloke that tried his guts out and was cruelled by the most incredible run of injuries for a single player that I have ever seen.

Shaun had class enough and more to make the big time but never got a clear run at it.
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Fair enough, I am using the benefit of hindsight there. Using his name as an example as Richmond got two late first round picks for Ottens....our 7 and 23 woudl have been a better offer.

That said Rusling might easily have been still available later in the draft. He was a genuine smokie and it was a shock to most draft experts when we took him second round.

Rusling aside the point is that there were rucks available in trade week most years if Malthouse wanted one
 
For some reason when people think of Josh Fraser's career they focus on the declining years.

He was a bloody good player for us for in his first 150 games. In those first 6 years he was one of our best and most important players.
By 2007 injuries stated to diminish his output.

Let's not forget the good years - there were many.
 
Gone Critical said:
Fraser was similar to Kreuzer in his 1st 3 seasons, took on a big workload , was exciting and handled it (to the detriment of his later career). He was better than Kreuze in fact as he kick goals, 38 one season. We burnt him but he played 200 games and I tip my hat to him. Carlton should take note.
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If Malthouse is heading for Carlton Kreuzer should ask for a trade.
 

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