Injury Max King's knee

[aidansbonor]

gonna sink 10 beers if I hear this at marvel in 2 weeks

 

[AirWinmar]

Wouldn't the fix be that Max just goes deep to the goal square as a decoy/Bail out option and Owens/Sharman/Marshall or TDK then get lesser defenders?

in fact it would extend out to Higgins and Hall probably Nas too!

Tbf there is no reason Marshall cant be doing something similar. Instead we see basically all forwards clustering together and flying very often. If we use King the same way itll be similar except that King is the best contested marker in our side. Albeit been out of action for 2 years

 

[tommo7]

God I can’t wait for the whole team to get around him when he kicks his first.

 

[The Jack]

God I can’t wait for the whole team to get around him when he kicks his first.

Let’s hope he kicks at least one before he breaks down again.











Joking.

 

[Saintbloke]

I would play him in the VFL for a few weeks- anyone out of the game for that long, and being slow to recover from injuries, needs a gradual build up to senior footy. Like Clark, the player of less injuries of a few years ago isn't the same player now- Clark looks to have lost a little pace, and Max will most definitely have lost pace and flexibility with those injuries, so don't expect a sudden turn around of fortunes for us, but a slight improvement is better than nothing.

 

[bergholt]

I would play him in the VFL for a few weeks- anyone out of the game for that long, and being slow to recover from injuries, needs a gradual build up to senior footy. Like Clark, the player of less injuries of a few years ago isn't the same player now- Clark looks to have lost a little pace, and Max will most definitely have lost pace and flexibility with those injuries, so don't expect a sudden turn around of fortunes for us, but a slight improvement is better than nothing.

it's true but his upper body is noticeably bigger and he's been doing a lot of core work so it'll be interesting to see what impact that has

 

[phantom13]

 

[SG34]

There is no scenario where King playing makes us worse. He structurally makes us better straight away.

How much ground time does he need for that to hold? 50% ?70%?
Where is the threshold where it costs more than it pays?

I guess, given that Sharman has been underwhelming, and Owens continues to get his paycheck as part-time ruck (I think it was a free from a ruck contest that got hi that free, (then 50 metrre penalty)and great goal fro momentum on Sunday) , that affects the equation.

if, say, JSOS and Wilks are killing it in defence, and Caminiti is on the fringes of selection in round 7 and they have to make a call between Hammer (as forward-utility and King (at 50% ground time full-forward) I wonder what would be in their calculations?
1) WIN, play percentages
2) Get ground time into King above all else?

So i don't know where the 'structural' thing works there.

 

[phantom13]

How much ground time does he need for that to hold? 50% ?70%?
Where is the threshold where it costs more than it pays?

I guess, given that Sharman has been underwhelming, and Owens continues to get his paycheck as part-time ruck (I think it was a free from a ruck contest that got hi that free, (then 50 metrre penalty)and great goal fro momentum on Sunday) , that affects the equation.

if, say, JSOS and Wilks are killing it in defence, and Caminiti is on the fringes of selection in round 7 and they have to make a call between Hammer (as forward-utility and King (at 50% ground time full-forward) I wonder what would be in their calculations?
1) WIN, play percentages
2) Get ground time into King above all else?

So i don't know where the 'structural' thing works there.

The structure and rotation issue to me is somewhat secondary. A semi fit King changes the look of our forward line completely so if he can do it, do it.

To me he has zero match conditioning off two years, a dicky knee and now some concern about soft tissue injuries under load, nothing simulates match conditioning, nothing.

Building a couple of games worth of TOG in the VFL (which is less intense and he could move between going 100% and 70%) will be a critical conditioning component and build confidence for him.

To me it would be incredibly negligent of the S&C guys to bring him straight into the ones (noting i cant imagine they would even be suggesting it)

 

[Now is the time]

I would play him in the VFL for a few weeks- anyone out of the game for that long, and being slow to recover from injuries, needs a gradual build up to senior footy. Like Clark, the player of less injuries of a few years ago isn't the same player now- Clark looks to have lost a little pace, and Max will most definitely have lost pace and flexibility with those injuries, so don't expect a sudden turn around of fortunes for us, but a slight improvement is better than nothing.

What do you think King has been up to across the period of time?

Sitting on a verandah until the medicos say you knee is perfect and there is no reason you can not play?

Simply, he has put in a body of work which will result in him returning to the playing field.

And this myth of Clark (now) being slow is housed in his long striding, loping running gait.

Which has always been his running gait.

Don't forget he is 186cm, so not a small man needing to pump his legs for pace.

 

[Ads734]

What do you think King has been up to across the period of time?

Sitting on a verandah until the medicos say you knee is perfect and there is no reason you can not play?

Simply, he has put in a body of work which will result in him returning to the playing field.

And this myth of Clark (now) being slow is housed in his long striding, loping running gait.

Which has always been his running gait.

Don't forget he is 186cm, so not a small man needing to pump his legs for pace.

How dare you talk sense into this forum. If the guys don’t move their legs like Jack Steven then as far as I’m concerned they’re slow.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

View attachment 2583059

Where’s Henry? Is he good to go???

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Where’s Henry? Is he good to go???

Him & Dow played in a scratch match last weekend.
So, it seems they are good to go, yeah

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

straight in, can't be much worse than keeler and he found a spot

 

[SG34]

4 kicks 0 goals in his last game. Here’s the autopsy thread from the game (which is why they should be titled appropriately. - so they can be checked in the future).

Autopsy Thread 'Round 16, 2024: St.Kilda v Port Adelaide'

Jun 30, 2024

AFL - News, Fixtures, Scores & Results - AFL.com.au

Australian Football League. All the latest AFL news, video, results and information

www.afl.com.au

Heartbreak for Port Adelaide as Hinkley pinches another win. Meanwhile the Saints' hopes for a decent draft pick are alive and well.

• Hubnester
• Replies: 487
• Forum: St Kilda

• 
• 
• 

Had a shocker, with half the board calling for him to spend time in the VFL

I looked at just the first 2 pages of that autopsy. It is 20 pages long folks. Here are just a few comments from the first two pages. I am not doing this to pile on the King. Long live the King! But here is a 'slice-o-life' of back then, on King's last game. This is how 'we' felt at the time.

-King was detrimental to us. Disgraceful performance.
-King to Sandy, putrid
-King frustratingly uncompetitive.
-been saying it for YEARS, trade max
-We were one man short all game with King in the side
-King and Owen’s below standards
-King and Owens are passengers in the forward half.
-Been firmly in the King has shit delivery brigade for a while, but that was atrocious
-King should never step foot inside the forward 50 again. A dead set liability
-Big Maxie probably does need to do a Pooey and go back to Sandy

 

[Captain Paddy]

I don’t reckon the club use him at VFL level first.

Maybe if we had a decent VFL side but we’re ass so he’s either just going to be standing at FF while we can’t hit a target or getting smashed by a pack of 10

 

[MordySaint]

I don’t reckon the club use him at VFL level first.

Maybe if we had a decent VFL side but we’re ass so he’s either just going to be standing at FF while we can’t hit a target or getting smashed by a pack of 10

100% .... he's way too good for VFL

There's nothing he can actually gain by playing VFL that he can't get from a solid workout at training.

 

[puppy_dog7]

Max King 2 weeks > Max King TBC

I’m not holding my breath just yet.

I still have PTSD from
Aaron Hammil- 2 weeks

 

[mad-saint-guy]

100% .... he's way too good for VFL

There's nothing he can actually gain by playing VFL that he can't get from a solid workout at training.

Match fitness is very very different to doing drills at training.

If we're comfortable with him coming on for the final 8-10 minutes of each quarter and don't feel that will hamper rotations too much, then we could probably get away with bringing him in against West Coast next week. But don't expect much - he'll be gassed quickly, struggle with following up at ground level and be a defensive liability. Be prepared to be annoyed by him standing still, calling for it to be kicked long and then watching the opposition defence jogging away with the ball. That's why you think about bringing him back through the VFL.

 

[Ads734]

Match fitness is very very different to doing drills at training.

If we're comfortable with him coming on for the final 8-10 minutes of each quarter and don't feel that will hamper rotations too much, then we could probably get away with bringing him in against West Coast next week. But don't expect much - he'll be gassed quickly, struggle with following up at ground level and be a defensive liability. Be prepared to be annoyed by him standing still, calling for it to be kicked long and then watching the opposition defence jogging away with the ball. That's why you think about bringing him back through the VFL.

We’ve had guys averaging 50-60 % per game I’m happy for him to do the same tbh.

 

[Kildonan]

There seems to be a lot of negative Nellies in this thread.
I swear many of you actually want him to fail just to justify your ongoing negativity.
It's as if your right to feel let down by Kings injuries is more important to you than King performing at a better level than you expect.

Sure he will be a bit behind in conditioning and touch, but he is a professional who is being managed by professionals.
Let the experts decide how to reintroduce him into our onfield team and stop and think about why you display such hatred to one of our very talented players.

 

[mighty_sainters]

There seems to be a lot of negative Nellies in this thread.
I swear many of you actually want him to fail just to justify your ongoing negativity.
It's as if your right to feel let down by Kings injuries is more important to you than King performing at a better level than you expect.

Sure he will be a bit behind in conditioning and touch, but he is a professional who is being managed by professionals.
Let the experts decide how to reintroduce him into our onfield team and stop and think about why you display such hatred to one of our very talented players.

Couldn’t agree more Kildonan

 

[SaintsofSteel]

100% .... he's way too good for VFL

There's nothing he can actually gain by playing VFL that he can't get from a solid workout at training.

No one is too good for the VFL when they have missed 2 years of footy. Expecting him to return to the top level after not evening playing practice matches in simply unrealistic.

Playing minutes in the VFL allows him to ease back into the game and get some confidence in his body in a lessor competitive environment. It about giving the bloke a chance to suceed, rather than putting more pressure on him.

Having said that none of his injury management program has been well handled, so if any club was to throw the bloke straight back in its St Kilda.

 

[jwikked]

Let the experts decide how to reintroduce him into our onfield team

The same experts that have botched his recovery up until now? Even his shoulder injury - it should have been surgery immediately, instead they wait until the post season which delayed his pre-season significantly.
The club had gotten so much wrong with him, that those around him are suggesting he finds a new club to move to.

I’ll be glad to be proven wrong about Max, but it’s also hard not to be critical when the club signed him onto an insane deal, and the guy is as injury prone as he is. That deal should never have been signed off by the board.

But if he proves me wrong, I won’t be upset.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

No one is too good for the VFL when they have missed 2 years of footy. Expecting him to return to the top level after not evening playing practice matches in simply unrealistic.

Playing minutes in the VFL allows him to ease back into the game and get some confidence in his body in a lessor competitive environment. It about giving the bloke a chance to suceed, rather than putting more pressure on him.

Having said that none of his injury management program has been well handled, so if any club was to throw the bloke straight back in its St Kilda.

Yep no hatred here, I'd love for him to defy odds and have a successful comeback. But just think about how obvious it is in round one when a player is coming off an interrupted pre season. Then think about how obvious it would be for someone coming off almost 2 years of injuries and inactivity.

Granted, we might be able to get away with it if he only plays around 45% TOG. But coming back through the VFL releases pressure and gives him a chance to get some match fitness before dealing with the higher pressure to perform in a senior game. There's always a risk that he tweaks something early on as well and I'd rather be a man down in the VFL than the AFL game.