No. 1 Pick

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

Kreuzer is a certainty. His second efforts, ground level work, and ability to follow the play are superb.

I have said it before - Cotchin is not a real midfielder. He is a classy, magical HF like Brown or Didak. Yes great to have but doesn't solve any midfield problems.

Pick 1 will be Kruezer. Any debate is artificial.

Do you beleive Chris Masten is more of a "pure" midfielder then Trent Cotchin ?

 

[Weaver]

Do you beleive Chris Masten is more of a "pure" midfielder then Trent Cotchin ?

Far and away. Masten is an extractor who wins first ball and stoppages and has done so in senior company. Masten won't generate highlights and get the crowd excited - but he will help teams win. Foley and Masten would be a classic 1-2 punch as rovers ... but will a club take a rover at 1? Generally it is rare to see true rovers inside the top-10.

 

[richoatthedisco]

1. I don't think we'll have 1st draft pick. Even if we do finish last, Carlton has to win one more game or they'll have 1st pick due to winning 4 or fewer games 2 years in a row. And they don't look like winning a toss, let alone a game. With Melbourne and Brisbane also struggling, we could still push up to 13th. Theoretically carlton might yet have the first 2 draft picks and get Kreuzer and Cotchin and we'll get pick 5. With Voss as coach. they'll be pushing for a flag well before us if that is the case - they already have some great young kids...
2. Back in 1999, Collingwood got the AFL to change the rules so they could draft 'once-in-a-generation' player Josh Fraser at no.1. Kreuzer descriptions sound very similar to how fraser was being wrapped up back then. pavlich went no.4 that year, who would you rather have?

 

[PLSC]

Kreuzer is a certainty. His second efforts, ground level work, and ability to follow the play are superb.

I have said it before - Cotchin is not a real midfielder. He is a classy, magical HF like Brown or Didak. Yes great to have but doesn't solve any midfield problems.

Pick 1 will be Kruezer. Any debate is artificial.

cotchin very outside!

would take masten before him based on needs but krezuer is the one for sure

 

[Roger Dodger]

Make no mistake Carlton have started tanking. Suspending Fevola only confirms it. A team would have to have a horrible bus accident to lose to Carlton during the remainder of the season.

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

Make no mistake Carlton have started tanking. Suspending Fevola only confirms it. A team would have to have a horrible bus accident to lose to Carlton during the remainder of the season.

Yep, we're tanking

Phew ! ... lucky we don't play you blokes again,

 

[tigers71]

Yep, we're tanking

Phew ! ... lucky we don't play you blokes again,

I wish the Blues all the best against the Demons I hope you beat and than the number 1 pick is ours

 

[PLSC]

Make no mistake Carlton have started tanking. Suspending Fevola only confirms it. A team would have to have a horrible bus accident to lose to Carlton during the remainder of the season.

they will win atleast 1 match out of 9!

worst outcome is they give melbourne 2 wins and stuff up their priority chances, good draw for us imo

 

[emperor]

Yep, we're tanking

Phew ! ... lucky we don't play you blokes again,

lol all the old guard will be turning in their graves.....Richmond and Carlton figthing each other for the wooden spoon

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

In all seriousness, I'm all for Carlton tanking the rest of season 2007 - if it eventuates to the following:

* Pagan getting the sack
* Priority draft selection
* Games into the youngsters

 

[Weaver]

Theoretically carlton might yet have the first 2 draft picks and get Kreuzer and Cotchin and we'll get pick 5. With Voss as coach. they'll be pushing for a flag well before us if that is the case - they already have some great young kids...

Carlton = kids is a bit of a myth. They are a long way behind everyone and in serious problems. They are still playing Wiggins, Ackland, Saddington, Lappin, Bannister. Still have Whitnall and Kouta to replace. Teague, Cloke and McLaren are hardly young back-ups.

On the weekend their under-23 players were Murphy (20), Bentick (22), Betts (21), Gibbs (18), Hartlett (21) and Russell (21). Just 6 blokes under-23 in the team is hardly a youth-program. Of those Hartlett and Russell have hardly cemented a spot, and Bentick is just a goer.

 

[Kyusss]

they will win atleast 1 match out of 9!

worst outcome is they give melbourne 2 wins and stuff up their priority chances, good draw for us imo

Wat sort of team cant win 1 out of 9 ey

 

[jeff99_Au]

there are a few players that could be taken at number on this year not just those 2 (vics) everyone keeps talking about SA has a few good options we did just be the vics on the weekend. few young guns showed alot. i hear bowden in tassie is going to be up there as a top 10 pick no relationship to ours bowden brother.

if i was in charge i would waste a first round pick on ruck man just my thoughts.ruckman take time to be ready for afl level.we have a good ruck stock atm simmo,knobel,patto,graham is starting to show in vfl now.

we need to think what postion we need most of all i think back line. to win any game you need good defence. we have polak,newman,bowden,raines,thursfeild as a start but we need depth in that area i think.

 

[polakthetiger]

ruckman take time to be ready for afl level.

However, Kruezer by all reports plays like a midfielder!

Fair points on your other comments and agree that if me miss No1 pick, we should look at all options. A few over in WA definately worth a look!

kruezer for me though.

 

[Heisenberg_]

there are a few players that could be taken at number on this year not just those 2 (vics) everyone keeps talking about SA has a few good options we did just be the vics on the weekend. few young guns showed alot. i hear bowden in tassie is going to be up there as a top 10 pick no relationship to ours bowden brother.

if i was in charge i would waste a first round pick on ruck man just my thoughts.ruckman take time to be ready for afl level.we have a good ruck stock atm simmo,knobel,patto,graham is starting to show in vfl now.

we need to think what postion we need most of all i think back line. to win any game you need good defence. we have polak,newman,bowden,raines,thursfeild as a start but we need depth in that area i think.

Kruezer is the best available player so we simply MUST take him if we hae the first pick and he isn't just a ruckmen.

And BTW our current ruck stocks are not good, quite the opposite actually

 

[Weaver]

However, Kruezer by all reports plays like a midfielder!

I wish this game of Chinese Whispers would stop. One article suggests he is more athletic than most ruckmen and can win the ball at stoppages - and all of a sudden dozens of people who have never seen him play are declaring him a midfielder.

He is not. He is a ruckman / forward.

What he does have is very good second / third efforts, and is very good below the knees. While other tap-ruckmen stand around after the bounce Kreuzer has the awareness and ability to follow-up the ball at ground level and win the footy. After a marking contest he keeps competing for the loose ball.

That is where the 'ruck-rover' myth comes from. His ability to stay involved in stoppages after the initial aerial contest. But he is not roaming around gathering touches, being a running or link player, or anything like that.

What he is is a smaller ruckman (199cm) who has elite recovery and superb reading of the game.

 

[tigerjungle]

I think Kruezer looks like Pavlich mk 2. We could build a side around him. Only saw last qtr WA v Vic metro but he looked good in a side getting flogged. Did not see Cotchin at all, understood he was tagged.

 

[polakthetiger]

While other tap-ruckmen stand around after the bounce Kreuzer has the awareness and ability to follow-up the ball at ground level and win the footy.

After a marking contest he keeps competing for the loose ball.

His ability to stay involved in stoppages after the initial aerial contest.

What he is is a smaller ruckman (199cm) who has elite recovery and superb reading of the game.

A good description Weaver..thanks...although your description is a fine line of what a ruckman playing like a midfielder is and is very fine IMHO! He runs around the ground getting possessions! So OK, not linking like a midfielder!

My point was, rather than playing like a midfielder then is:

He is not a big lanky 18 y.o. who is going to take 4-5 years to learn how to take a mark and get a possession around the ground like someone suggested. But he will be able to do that at AFL likely in his 1st season.

 

[TigerPower]

We need Kruezer bad stuff cotchin, our kpp except a few are either getting on near retirement(e.g. Richo, brown, simmo), or are duds(kingsley, shultz). So that leaves one option get tall kkp in this draft so they can develop in time for 2011 hype, and we have plenty of short people already. Take kruezer (ruckman fixed), we need a star kp forward to replace richo and develop with rewolt and hughes they are not enough and havent proven themselfs yet (maybe lochie collins), we need a tall kp defender as wallace indicated today, and then from then on we can look for smaller guys in the 4th and 5th rounds, as well as coburg to try. Tall kpp take longer to develop so we need to get them NOW before it's too late and we perform too well for the top end of the draft.

P.S the saying goes a good big man will always beat a good small man.

 

[PLSC]

people are just trying to find negatives/risks with kreuzer just for the sake of it but he is the clear number 1 imo

you cant teach 200cm picking the ball up from the ground kicking to a contest and then 5 secs later be at the same contest getting another kick away

if anyone is into basketball like me you will understand this example, if your not then just change greg oden's name with kreuzer and kevin durant with cotchin/palmer etc

Here's the analogy I use. Taking Kevin Durant is like dating a supermodel. She's hot. Everyone thinks you're cool for being next to her. For a few years everything is great. But when it's time to settle down, have kids, start a life ... she's eyeing younger guys. Partying late at night. Leaving you in the dust the next time a good thing comes along.

Taking Oden is like marrying the girl you don't want to date, but the girl you want to spend the rest of your life with. She's responsible. She looks out for you. She helps you be the best person you can be. She's not hot on the outside. But inside she makes your life worth living.

very cheesy but very true!

 

[deliberate!!]

I wish this game of Chinese Whispers would stop. One article suggests he is more athletic than most ruckmen and can win the ball at stoppages - and all of a sudden dozens of people who have never seen him play are declaring him a midfielder.

He is not. He is a ruckman / forward.

What he does have is very good second / third efforts, and is very good below the knees. While other tap-ruckmen stand around after the bounce Kreuzer has the awareness and ability to follow-up the ball at ground level and win the footy. After a marking contest he keeps competing for the loose ball.

That is where the 'ruck-rover' myth comes from. His ability to stay involved in stoppages after the initial aerial contest. But he is not roaming around gathering touches, being a running or link player, or anything like that.

What he is is a smaller ruckman (199cm) who has elite recovery and superb reading of the game.

OK Weaver....you sold me.....let's grab him.