Autopsy Opening Rd - St Kilda v Collingwood

[Sully111]

King Keeler meets the moment to slot sealer

Isaac Keeler takes a brilliant grab over Max Gawn before kicking truly to ice a fantastic victory for the Saints

www.afl.com.au

 

[ScrappyDo]

He's been top 5 disposals for a couple of years. He needs to play through tags.

Yep. I heard pre-game Nas had the longest active streak of 20+ disposals in the league. That ended last night.

We should have tagged Naicos and Pendles from the start.
Should have moved Nas to HB in the 2nd quarter.
Should have belted the ball forward at ruck contests.
Our HB's should have played in front of their men at centre ball-ups.

Lots of would'a - could'a - should'as.
In essence we entered a gun fight but found out we still only had bananas. We'll never know what machinations took place in the coaches box, we can only see how the react in future games.

 

[DougalHoward]

Is Dougal injured? Why wasn't he playing?

Caminiti forward may have offered something.

 

[Minga]

Every other team in the comp watched Nas agitated and ineffective with the tag last night, interesting times ahead.

Agreed, but he’ll be fine. Daicos went through the same attention when he broke out. Most tag worthy players have.

Nas still had 20ish and a goal. Remember when Windy tagged Neale in a Brownlow year (or there abouts) and kept him to 4 touches (or there abouts). A loose argument but my point being it’s no biggie, it’s good for Nas to have stuff to work on. Daicos stands out because yes he’s a classy player but also plays in a veteran disciplined team that both he elevates and elevates him.

We’re just going to have to be patient, there is no ceiling to what we can achieve in these next two seasons but we’re only limited by how fast we can gel and execute as a newly formed & developing team.

 

[#1_pigeonracer]

Quite disappointing, even Ed Sheeran failed to turn up ffs.

 

[stavro#4]

Is Dougal injured? Why wasn't he playing?

Caminiti forward may have offered something.

I thought the doco explained this to a degree?

They locked in a core group to build “connection” and that meant “even if it put noses out of joint”

 

[jumperfan]

Every other team in the comp watched Nas agitated and ineffective with the tag last night, interesting times ahead.

I think it'll be good for him in the long run. It was bound to happen at some point and having it happen in the first game of the season is preferable to a must win final.

 

[BucketsandBanger]

Sorry that’s Bs. Naicos is a star and the reason he is, Is because he can do things like weave out of traffic and make space for all the other Pies. Who run forward of the ball.

That ****ing kick in the second quarter? Where he weaves past 2-3 and hits the pies player outside the boot in the centre square shows his talent. We needed to be smarter than collapse on him.

And that extends to us in general. You can be a manic pressure side. But you have to know when to go 1 in or all in.

Sucked in by Naicos and Pendles all night and they murdered us.

We need to do that for Nas.

Legit that might be the biggest difference between good teams and bad. Whenever we play a top 4 team I’m constantly thinking they are a bunch of front runners who are always running ahead of the ball. But no, they just trust their players to win contests and put themselves in a position to capitalise once they do. Bad teams get sucked to the ball, good teams trust their teammates and structures. When Daicos and Pendles got the ball we would have been better off just leaving them and running hard the other way with their teammates. Funnily, the absolute worst thing you can do is have multiple players try and tackle them. So frustrating.

 

[SG34]

Systems back to normal.

I thought Collingwood would be favorites even though the odds tipped to St Kilda at the end.

Stil one of the most frustrating and disappointing games to watch in recent years.

Thank gooodness for TDK.

It was the skilled old hands that kept us in. Hill 760m gained and all over the place in the first half particularly. In the second, Sincs got going.

The also ran old hands, not so much.

Wilson and Pou, no surprises. Actually their output was up. Not as high as most’s expectations it seeems.

What happened to Higgo? Was it their coaching genius that rendered him ineffective?

Of the newbies,
TDK
SOS OK

Flanders invisible at first, I thought what is going on? Was he on the bench a a lot?.
Carroll. I don’t get the fuss, or why he was selected. Crucial kicking shortcomings. Missed targets, and missed a gimme
He might be OK. Byrnesy like

Mitchito and Sharman, usual fare. Flashes and frustratons .

Dont know what the selectors can do, but Corey E. Needs to work on the game plan if. That is what he does.

 

[BrutThough]

Keeler doesn’t play above his head though. He is like a tall flanker.

At this stage, do we have any hard evidence at Dodson does? One was an emergency and featured in the pre season squad, the other played VFL and didn't. It should be obvious who is currently ahead for a game next week.

He’s not a ruckman, in fact he’s not much of anything except flashes here and there.

Play Dodson assuming he’s fit, bring back stocker and hunter Clark if fit.

For $1.7mil, I'd hope TDK is capable of rucking as the sole guy with someone filling in when he rests. Whoever comes in for Marshall is likely to play primarily forward regardless of who it is.

 

[botts]

Loving the media pile on.

It was always gonna happen. Just lazy

 

[smooth_mover]

Not a charitable take on my thread at all...


In all seriousness, he's our 2nd highest paid player, he loses the head-to-head ruck battle every week (at best draws even) and you're happy?

Was meant as a gentle poke and might have come off as harsher than intended, I'm no keyboard warrior.

But I stand behind the general thrust of the comment. To some, the price will never be justified and I get it. But I thought he was close to, if not our BOG yesterday and if he can churn that out week after week and the bean counters can make it work. I'm pretty satisfied.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Loving the media pile on.

Why are you suprised. Always going to happen when we lost

 

[Saintbloke]

Systems back to normal.

I thought Collingwood would be favorites even though the odds tipped to St Kilda at the end.

Stil one of the most frustrating and disappointing games to watch in recent years.

Thank gooodness for TDK.

It was the skilled old hands that kept us in. Hill 760m gained and all over the place in the first half particularly. In the second, Sincs got going.

The also ran old hands, not so much.

Wilson and Pou, no surprises. Actually their output was up. Not as high as most’s expectations it seeems.

What happened to Higgo? Was it their coaching genius that rendered him ineffective?

Of the newbies,
TDK
SOS OK

Flanders invisible at first, I thought what is going on? Was he on the bench a a lot?.
Carroll. I don’t get the fuss, or why he was selected. Crucial kicking shortcomings. Missed targets, and missed a gimme
He might be OK. Byrnesy like

Mitchito and Sharman, usual fare. Flashes and frustratons .

Dont know what the selectors can do, but Corey E. Needs to work on the game plan if. That is what he does.

I thought Carroll was one of our few consistent performers last night and wouldn't knock his game at all. Flanders a good linkup player. Pou and Wilson largely ineffective and should have done a lot better- they both have senior experience. Disappointed in Higgo, MacRae, Wood- senior players who didn't get enough of the ball in the right places. TDK and SOS excellent pickups.
Lyon needs to settle Nas in a position and resist the temptation to move him all over the field- you can get away with it in practice matches, but not pressure senior matches. We had no system in the centre corridor- cr#p coaching.

 

[littlecreatures]

Thought there were more positives than negatives but still a frustrating loss - my takeouts:

​

• We’ve got a good handful of players on the precipice, where the signs are there to take it to the next level (e.g., Sharman, Pou, Wilson, Hugo, Boxshall, etc). Need these options for weight of numbers and to support Nas.
• Can’t consistently win games of footy with a make-shift forward line for best part of 3 years. Chuck Tauru up forward for rest of season, see how Keeler goes coming in for Ro.
• Thought the midfield mix was off slightly, Hugo could’ve gone to Daicos much earlier as the predicted match up, and Windy should’ve had some rotations in the middle.
• As much as I disagree with Kornes at times, I think he’s right in terms of Macrae, it is inside mid or bust.
• JSOS was immense, TDK started off like house on fire with his assertiveness, and Ryan inside 50 work looked cut above the rest when in the game.
• Flanders looked much better as game wore on, but started poor.
• The defensive press was poor with too many sitting behind the footy allowing Collingwood to transition out of their D50.
• Collingwood just managed the game a whole letter better, way more efficient, and there senior leaders got the job done (e.g., Daicos brothers, Quaynor, Maynard, JDG, Pendles, etc).

 

[stavro#4]

At this stage, do we have any hard evidence at Dodson does? One was an emergency and featured in the pre season squad, the other played VFL and didn't. It should be obvious who is currently ahead for a game next week.


For $1.7mil, I'd hope TDK is capable of rucking as the sole guy with someone filling in when he rests. Whoever comes in for Marshall is likely to play primarily forward regardless of who it is.

Does this count?

VFL Showreel, R16: Alex Dodson highlights

Enjoy Alex Dodson's standout VFL performance for Sandringham

www.afl.com.au

 

[The Jack]

Copping it’s from every angle right now.

We should have done better last night

Was always going to happen. Plenty rooting for us to fail. Get used to it.

 

[phantom13]

I can’t say I’m seeing the positive out of this tbh.

If we can’t beat a team with Billy Frampton

17

Billy Frampton

Age

29

Ht

201cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.1

2star

K

5.1

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

3.1

3star

T

0.7

3star

MG

99.0

2star

D

8.5

2star

K

4.8

2star

HB

3.8

3star

M

3.5

3star

T

0.5

1star

MG

99.0

2star

D

9.2

3star

K

5.6

3star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

1.0

3star

MG

107.0

2star

as the number 1 defender with 60+ inside 50s then we’re not gonna win a lot of games.

Ultimately the Collingwood system and discipline killed us, they ripped us apart on transition and controlled the ball.

We were out coached and outplayed, I guess you can argue we only lost by 2 goals and had our chances but I’d argue dropping the 4 points is ****ing shit. Good teams win winnable games and we didn’t.

The forward line looks pretty horrible and the connection between mid and forward was deplorable.

 

[stavro#4]

I can’t say I’m seeing the positive out of this tbh.

If we can’t beat a team with Billy Frampton as the number 1 defender with 60+ inside 50s then we’re not gonna win a lot of games.

Ultimately the Collingwood system and discipline killed us, they ripped us apart on transition and controlled the ball.

We were out coached and outplayed, I guess you can argue we only lost by 2 goals and had our chances but I’d argue dropping the 4 points is ****ing shit. Good teams win winnable games and we didn’t.

The forward line looks pretty horrible and the connection between mid and forward was deplorable.

Such a shit outcome.

heck

 

[BrutThough]

Does this count?

VFL Showreel, R16: Alex Dodson highlights

Enjoy Alex Dodson's standout VFL performance for Sandringham

www.afl.com.au

Clearly not since it's not getting him a gig in the pre season games.

 

[Southeastsainter]

Think I’ve seen enough of Hammer as a key back, Dougal should come in and put Hammer as a forward.

What is Tauru in the team for? He’s not better than Wilkie or SOS + will need a fullback. He’s not a good 1 on 1 defender, his disposal is very suspect.

Do we try Tauru forward? Does Keeler play? Ro is out and we need a tall, maybe even Dodson? Kicked a few bags in the VFL.

Stocker has to play, he’s our closest match to Webster even if he’s slow.

Very underwhelming loss, must win Sunday vs the Dees, 1-1 not the end of the world. 0-2 it’s alarm bells with our upcoming opponents!

 

[stavro#4]

Clearly not since it's not getting him a gig in the pre season games.

They would be irrelevant seeing as Marshall and TDK were both fit.

We played with 26 blokes. No need for 3 rucks.

Even last week people were talking about Keelers 1 on 1 stuff in the air and that was as a defender where it’s far easier to kill a ball then up forward.

 

[phantom13]

Think I’ve seen enough of Hammer as a key back, Dougal should come in and put Hammer as a forward.

What is Tauru in the team for? He’s not better than Wilkie or SOS + will need a fullback. He’s not a good 1 on 1 defender, his disposal is very suspect.

Do we try Tauru forward? Does Keeler play? Ro is out and we need a tall, maybe even Dodson? Kicked a few bags in the VFL.

Stocker has to play, he’s our closest match to Webster even if he’s slow.

Very underwhelming loss, must win Sunday vs the Dees, 1-1 not the end of the world. 0-2 it’s alarm bells with our upcoming opponents!

Hammer was fine, the defense actually held up really well considering the speed on the ball inside 50 for them.

Tauru made no sense before the game and less sense in the game.

 

[SaintWrld]

Does this count?

VFL Showreel, R16: Alex Dodson highlights

Enjoy Alex Dodson's standout VFL performance for Sandringham

www.afl.com.au

Is that AFL footy or VFL? Dodsons only game at the top level he was such a liability he was subbed at half time and dropped the very next week. He couldn’t run out a half. And he has missed 80% of the pre season. Regardless of weather you like the way Keeler plays or not, he is far ahead of Dodson as an AFL level key forward, we don’t need two ruckman. Keeler’s last game at the level was a 13 disposal 2 goal game against GWS last year, Ross mentioned him in the presser last night so I would presume he’s the obvious choice.

 

[stavro#4]

Think I’ve seen enough of Hammer as a key back, Dougal should come in and put Hammer as a forward.

What is Tauru in the team for? He’s not better than Wilkie or SOS + will need a fullback. He’s not a good 1 on 1 defender, his disposal is very suspect.

Do we try Tauru forward? Does Keeler play? Ro is out and we need a tall, maybe even Dodson? Kicked a few bags in the VFL.

Stocker has to play, he’s our closest match to Webster even if he’s slow.

Very underwhelming loss, must win Sunday vs the Dees, 1-1 not the end of the world. 0-2 it’s alarm bells with our upcoming opponents!

Melbourne and GWS are run and gun. That will suit us better.

Might as well mark down Brisbane as a loss. Their control play will pick us apart.