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Pagan mistake, Gibbs.

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Re: the thread, I don't actually mind Pagan's moves with Gibbs. Most times I saw last night Johnson got the ball lace out and not many people would have stopped him. However I saw young number 4 right on his hammer with a cool fist away a fair few times as well, and the way he spoilt without /will be.

Put into perspective, 5th gamer, on a very experience + much stronger player in CJ, and IMO he played him pretty well. He linked up well in defence, he is pretty cool under pressure.

It will help his growth as a player, I won't rubbish Pagan for his use of Gibbs because I did with his use of Walker now look at the player Walker is becoming...
 
we are doing what hawthorn have done with luke hodge and to a much lesser extent jordan lewis
what we did with andrew walker

we are teaching them the game, getting them to learn all aspects of the game and to be accountable
when they move into the midfield they will be accountable players, rather than taggers or receivers

brett ratten started his career as a back pocket, then did some tagging and eventually became one of the best midfielders we have had at our club

gibbs will be a star for us, but by doing these things now we can ensre he is a superstar.
 
The game turned when Fev dropped that chest mark halfway thru the final qtr. That's when the Lions started their run. Poor form by Fev. When will he realise the team needs him switched on for the full game and not spurts.
 
Blueboy16 said:
The game turned when Fev dropped that chest mark halfway thru the final qtr. That's when the Lions started their run. Poor form by Fev. When will he realise the team needs him switched on for the full game and not spurts.
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There were 4 critical points late in the game that hurt us.
1. The abovementiond Fevola dropped mark
2. The obvious blunder in the goal square that led to McGrath's goal
3. Fev passing the ball to Murphy who missed. Note to Fev - you're the full forward paid to kick the goals - just go back and slot it through mate.
4. the free kick paid against Fev when he took a running mark on the goal line. Fox didn't show a reply but what the hell was it for?

There were a few others wher Merrett practically molested fev and the umpires let it go (geez we've had a rough trot this year - even a few non-carlton supporter mates reckon he was stiff last night) but he has to learn to deal with it better.
 

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Peter Dyson said:
There were 4 critical points late in the game that hurt us.
1. The abovementiond Fevola dropped mark
2. The obvious blunder in the goal square that led to McGrath's goal
3. Fev passing the ball to Murphy who missed. Note to Fev - you're the full forward paid to kick the goals - just go back and slot it through mate.
4. the free kick paid against Fev when he took a running mark on the goal line. Fox didn't show a reply but what the hell was it for?

There were a few others wher Merrett practically molested fev and the umpires let it go (geez we've had a rough trot this year - even a few non-carlton supporter mates reckon he was stiff last night) but he has to learn to deal with it better.
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good point- what you have highlighted here are all player issues rather than coaching issues.

players have just as much responsibility as coaches do, if not more on gameday.
 
Gibbs played 125 minuets out of a total 125 minuets game time

it's a development year, having him crunched for 75 minuets in the midfield isn't going to help him long term. Having him play in defence and learning when to run from half back while still keeping his opponent quiet is going to do more for him as a player.

I would prefer him play every minuet of the game for 22 weeks and not get injured for him to get as much experience as possible and then next year he can join the midfield rotation.
 
barone said:
i think pagans protecting him from the bigger bodied midfielders, his a star and should be played on the ball!
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The first part is spot on. If you want Gibbs to have a 12 year plus career then Pagan is doing the right thing. He is protecting him and so he should.

His time will come for playing on the ball.

Some of you are expecting too much from your young players.
 
jj1978 said:
I'm a fan of Pagan and think his tactics for most of the year have been really good.

Last night what did annoy me however was the use of Gibbs in the last quarter. Our midfield was tired and we needed something different and I think throwing Gibbs into the centre and putting Whitnall down back could have given us a sniff.

Murphy never got thrown down back, so why is Gibbs playing 100% of games down back?? Gibbs was touted as the Jesus of midfielders and yet he's not given a chance for a quarter even the last when all the heat is out of the game and it becomes more of a game of attrition.

I'm confused... and please none of this making him learn a defensive side to his game... I'm sure he's proved he has that cause he's shown us the last few weeks he can be defensive and accountable.
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Dunno, but maybe fitness?

Its his first year, 5th game and he played the whole match. Was also beaten on the lead twice by his opponent (Johnson?) in the last quarter.
 
Keeping Johnson to 3 goals in such a high-scoring game is a win in my book. Given the quality of supply into the Brisbane forward line, Gibbs did a great job.
 
i cant believe people blame fev for the loss on the weekend he had to pass he ball to murphy because he was 30 metres in the clear and calling for it! what if he ignored him and fev missed?? and we blame fev for 1 dropped mark gee people have short term memories how many games has he kept us in or won of his own boot??? Yes he got upset and lost the plot but where was the leadership for someone to go over to him and say keep your head up and worry about the next one? People blame fev as an excuse fact is we ran out of legs due to the perth trip and Brisbanes extraordinary kicking for goal.
 
I understand how some of you are saying Pagan is saving Gibbs to play a 12 year plus career. I think you may have misunderstood my thread.

I agree with Pagan giving Gibbs a tutorial in defensive skills and protecting him to a degree. My thread basically implies that it was the 4th quarter, all players were tired and physical sting was pretty much out of the midfield and game for that matter. Carlton lose a 19 point advantage and are now level/behind on the scoreboard. Would this not be a good lesson, a character building lesson and pressure lesson for our young Gibbs to see how he'd handle his future full time position.

Fine first 3 quarters let him learn some new skills in his trade, but when the sting is out, let him not forget and improve on his midfield skills either.
 
I think it is a good thing Pagan is doing.

Gibbs isn't a star yet and educating him is the best thing we can do. Essendon arn't palying gumbleton because there is no need he needs to learn, same with hawthorn last year with Ellis.

Gibbs as we all know has amazing disposal, knows how to find the ball and can take players on. But without a defensive side to his game he is not a complete player.

Judd is easilly the best player in the league ( and i am not saying gibbs will be better, no way) but his defensive side of the game isn't A grade.

So by teaching Gibbs to tackle, spoil, chase his man and have a good defensive side to the game it will benefit him in the future.

Also Gibbsys body isn't strong enough yet to be in the centre square. Would have got murdered by the mature players in Black,Power and Rischitelli
 

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Don't think I can add too much more to what's already been said i.e. the defensive side, easing him in, no point getting battered, learning experience etc.

But I'd just like to mention that a 5th gamer being in the backline is the least of my worries at Carlton and was far from the worst thing that happened on Sat night. Patience people! We have better, bigger things to sort out.
 
Tommy Alvin said:
A bloke by the name of Brett Ratten did a fair apprenticeship as a back pocket. Didn't hurt him any.[/quote]

Agree

And I suggest there would be a few others as well.

Gibbs will become a star I thought he had a great game on Saturday, I think Pagan used him well and I was not dissapointed that he was left on CJ.

Who would we have put on CJ to allow Gibbs to go into the midfield?
Walker, Simpson, Carazzo not sure if any of them would of done better.

Maybe just a change might of worked but i think we were just tired and they ran out the game better.

Development is the key this year and next but the signs are there.
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TruBlue said:
Tommy Alvin said:
A bloke by the name of Brett Ratten did a fair apprenticeship as a back pocket. Didn't hurt him any.[/quote]

Agree

And I suggest there would be a few others as well.

Gibbs will become a star I thought he had a great game on Saturday, I think Pagan used him well and I was not dissapointed that he was left on CJ.

Who would we have put on CJ to allow Gibbs to go into the midfield?
Walker, Simpson, Carazzo not sure if any of them would of done better.

Maybe just a change might of worked but i think we were just tired and they ran out the game better.

Development is the key this year and next but the signs are there.
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Carrazzo eventually went onto him, by which time the damage had been done.
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bourbons said:
Dunno, but maybe fitness?

Its his first year, 5th game and he played the whole match. Was also beaten on the lead twice by his opponent (Johnson?) in the last quarter.
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only just for one of them. was about the best attempt to spoil without spoiling I have seen from our team for many years.
 

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Pagan mistake, Gibbs.

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