Pagan plan Vs Whitnall plan

[murphster]

After listening to Pagans comments after the game i decided to go back and watch the game again, Pagan asked the players what they thought we needed to do at half time and sent them back out there and let them play how they thought we should play, after the game he said Lance was the catalyst for our second half play.

Basicly after half time Lance was directing the play and setting our style and plan, we went one on one and moved the ball with confidence and speed, when the ball was turned over our players covered there men a lot better because they were playing one on one instead of zoning off and flooding, under Lance's direction we won the second half by playing pro active accountable football, now people might say that Port backed off because they already had the game won which was why we got back into it and maybe to some extent that is true, however i believe our style of play and positive movement had more to do with it than Port slacking off.

When we went forward we had forwards inside 50 to kick to and moved it quick enough that they couldn't flood back like in the first half, there defenders had to man up on there opponents inside 50 rather than double and triple teaming Fev which resulted in Fev having a lot more one on one contests, which he will win more times than he loses and he did kicking 3 last quarter goals in one on one contests. Eddie was left in the forward 50 and through the pressure he applied kicked 2 goals himself and assisted in others.

The midfield was rotated after nearly every bounce down which gave some of the other players a run in the middle like Wiggens, Scotland, Simpson, Murphy,Bentick, Prendergast, Walker and others which led to a much better performance in the midfield in the second half and particularly in the clearances and tackling around the stoppages, this rotation is how a midfield needs to be used, giving some players a rest while others get to test there mettle and see if they can play in the middle of the ground, it keeps the players fresh and running harder for longer.

The defence did not have the ball coming in at a million miles an hour under no pressure, which enabled them to assist each other as needed because they had time to set up and assess where the ball was going and get across to assist the player under pressure, and also gave them the confidece to run off there man and attack, safe in the knowledge that someone else would have the time to get back and cover there man before the ball was rebounded, this led to the goals kicked by Port suddenly drying up and the pressure was now back on there forwards instead of on our defenders.

With this style of play we will win games with Pagans style of play we will not, amazing how our players looked so much better in the second half and had so much more confidence than when made to play to Pagans abysmal game style. If this is not proof of how much the coaching effects players mind sets then i give up, Pagan might well be a good coach during the week but come game day he is well below par and at the least should let someone else coach on game days like Parkin did in his last couple of years at Carlton.

Every supporter should watch that game again to see the difference between the first and second halves and see the difference in game style when our players are given there orders from elsewhere and allowed to play proactive aggressive attacking footy.


Go the Mosquito Fleet!!!!!!!!

 

[as0l0]

just to clarify. Pagan said that the he asked the players what they did wrong and how they could fix it. The players told him and what the players thought, matched up with what Pagan thought. IN the second half they then went out and implemented what they agreed on.

 

[murphster]

just to clarify. Pagan said that the he asked the players what they did wrong and how they could fix it. The players told him and what the players thought, matched up with what Pagan thought. IN the second half they then went out and implemented what they agreed on.

Pagans thoughts on how to play have not changed between rd1 and rd10, the game style in the second half was like chalk and cheese to Pagans philosiphy, you really think he changed his thinking in the space of a 20 minute break when he hasn't done it in 10 weeks, the players were responsible for the second half resurgance not Pagan the Pesimest it was Whitnall the Wonderkind that implemented that resurgance through positive Play and Leadership.

 

[FieryNayta]

Basicly after half time Lance was directing the play and setting our style and plan, we went one on one and moved the ball with confidence and speed, when the ball was turned over our players covered there men a lot better because they were playing one on one instead of zoning off and flooding, under Lance's direction we won the second half by playing pro active accountable football, now people might say that Port backed off because they already had the game won which was why we got back into it and maybe to some extent that is true, however i believe our style of play and positive movement had more to do with it than Port slacking off.

Well Lance has always been praised for his football smarts. No doubt his confidence and ability to assume control of the team given the oportunity by pagan wont go un-noticed.

Captain after Kouta? What do you think his chances are?

 

[bibi01]

things to consider:
(which you touched on)

how much did port drop off
was the increased effort due to game plan change or pride or both
we still lost the 3rd 1/4 by 3 points. carl 2.3 15 - port 2.6 18 port had plenty of chances to win the 1/4 by more
pagan moved lance to the backline after 1/4 time.

our biggest problem is we can get the basics of football right.

we have poor disposal by foot
poor disposal by hand
we drop easy marks
we miss too many set shots from inside 50
players are not accountable for their opponent
we don't apply enough pressure on our opponents
we miss too many tackles
we don't shepherd/block enough

 

[bibi01]

Pagans thoughts on how to play have not changed between rd1 and rd10, the game style in the second half was like chalk and cheese to Pagans philosiphy, you really think he changed his thinking in the space of a 20 minute break when he hasn't done it in 10 weeks, the players were responsible for the second half resurgance not Pagan the Pesimest it was Whitnall the Wonderkind that implemented that resurgance through positive Play and Leadership.

murphster question's for you

what are you thoughts on why we beat and what type of gameplan did we implement against
win v melbourne?
win v essendon?
came within 7 points of sydney?
leading collingwood at 1/2 time?

 

[as0l0]

Pagans thoughts on how to play have not changed between rd1 and rd10, the game style in the second half was like chalk and cheese to Pagans philosiphy, you really think he changed his thinking in the space of a 20 minute break when he hasn't done it in 10 weeks, the players were responsible for the second half resurgance not Pagan the Pesimest it was Whitnall the Wonderkind that implemented that resurgance through positive Play and Leadership.

I'm not really sure what Pagans plan is, but the thread was based on Pagans comments and I wanted to make sure the comments were accurately represented.

 

[one_twelve112]

The fact of the matter is, Port took the pedal off the gas after half-time. Simple.

We could have gone in with exactly the same gameplan before HT or after HT and would have had the same result. Port dictated the play in the first half and we played on their terms, our game plan(s) were completely dismantled because Port did as they pleased. It was a matter of not being able to execute the game plan, rather than executing it incorrectly.

 

[murphster]

murphster question's for you

what are you thoughts on why we beat and what type of gameplan did we implement against
win v melbourne?
win v essendon?
came within 7 points of sydney?
leading collingwood at 1/2 time?

First of all against Melbourne we played hard at it positive one on one footy, but most importantly and i have said this before the win came down to 1 inspirational act by Fevola where he chased down and tackled Byron Pickett on the wing which just lifted the young kids so much that it got us over the line, these acts by senior players have been lacking ever since and really do hurt us and the development of our younger players.

If you go back and look at my posts from those games i am pretty sure i gave my opinions on why we won or lost, to hard to remember games that far back.

 

[murphster]

things to consider:
(which you touched on)

how much did port drop off
was the increased effort due to game plan change or pride or both
we still lost the 3rd 1/4 by 3 points. carl 2.3 15 - port 2.6 18 port had plenty of chances to win the 1/4 by more
pagan moved lance to the backline after 1/4 time.

our biggest problem is we can get the basics of football right.

we have poor disposal by foot
poor disposal by hand
we drop easy marks
we miss too many set shots from inside 50
players are not accountable for their opponent
we don't apply enough pressure on our opponents
we miss too many tackles
we don't shepherd/block enough

With this style of play we will win games with Pagans style of play we will not, amazing how our players looked so much better in the second half and had so much more confidence than when made to play to Pagans abysmal game style. If this is not proof of how much the coaching effects players mind sets then i give up

 

[The Grover]

Who would want to be a coach, certainly not me. I do agree with Murphster about flooding back, it only plays into the better teams hands. All their backs get free rein to set up play & they still penetrate the flood.

I would prefer to see us play man on man, make our forwards man up on their men.

Also agree with other postings that our skills & movement of the ball & tackling/shepharding are not up to scratch.

Was watching some old matches from 10 years ago on foxtel, the only differences between then & now are players shorts not as tight now, no flooding back then & grounds in better condition.

Whoever invented flooding should be shot, the AFL needs to come up with something simple to stop it.

Everyone put their thinking caps on, its ruining our game.

 

[BlueWorld]

Flooding is only worthwhile if you have the skill to hit targets. We don't. We'd be better off with the long kicking game we used to have and make more use of our tall forwards & crumbers, who are supposed to be our main area of strength. Pagan needs to devise a game plan that makes the most of our list's strengths, not one that only makes us look worse.

 

[SA Blue]

Murphster, you have listed a lot of changes that occured in the second half. It would be naive to think that all these changes were Lance's idea and that it is as simple as this. To think that a few changes by Lance (I am sure he actually did very little) altered the side that much is fanciful. As stated by others, Port dropping off is far and away the reason for the better scoreboard.

You are going to have to realise that the main issue we have is our list and the quality of our players on it.

Are we playing to the best of our ability? No.
Is the best of our ability that much better? No.
Would some adjustment to our game plan make us a far better side? No.

Blueworld, you raise an interesting question re game plans. Should a game plan be made to suit the team, or should a team be made / drafted to fit a game plan?

 

[bibi01]

[/B]

With this style of play we will win games with Pagans style of play we will not, amazing how our players looked so much better in the second half and had so much more confidence than when made to play to Pagans abysmal game style. If this is not proof of how much the coaching effects players mind sets then i give up

the main problem I have with this is that on countless ocassions I have heard the players speak and thay all say the same thing

we didn't follow the game plan through, we went into our shells and reverted back to our old ways.

 

[bibi01]

Murphster, you have listed a lot of changes that occured in the second half. It would be naive to think that all these changes were Lance's idea and that it is as simple as this. To think that a few changes by Lance (I am sure he actually did very little) altered the side that much is fanciful. As stated by others, Port dropping off is far and away the reason for the better scoreboard.

You are going to have to realise that the main issue we have is our list and the quality of our players on it.

Are we playing to the best of our ability? No.
Is the best of our ability that much better? No.
Would some adjustment to our game plan make us a far better side? No.

Blueworld, you raise an interesting question re game plans. Should a game plan be made to suit the team, or should a team be made / drafted to fit a game plan?

spot on SA Blue

we are just not very good, plenty of players with unfullfilled potential.

 

[mediumsizered]

Well Lance has always been praised for his football smarts. No doubt his confidence and ability to assume control of the team given the oportunity by pagan wont go un-noticed.

Captain after Kouta? What do you think his chances are?

Lance will definitely be captain next year. He has shown more leadership than any one else at the club this season and on current form is the best player at the club. We need a captain who can steer the young players in the right direction, tell them where to run to, where to stand, where not to stand. Lance does all this and this is why Setanta should be given a chance lining up beside Lance in defence.

Further down the track, I have no doubt Lance will coach the club and will be a huge success. I used to think that Diesel had the best football brain I had ever seen, but Lance is in a class of his own and realistically could coach the club now, but we will let him finish his playing career first.

 

[as0l0]

Lance will definitely be captain next year. He has shown more leadership than any one else at the club this season and on current form is the best player at the club. We need a captain who can steer the young players in the right direction, tell them where to run to, where to stand, where not to stand. Lance does all this and this is why Setanta should be given a chance lining up beside Lance in defence.

Further down the track, I have no doubt Lance will coach the club and will be a huge success. I used to think that Diesel had the best football brain I had ever seen, but Lance is in a class of his own and realistically could coach the club now, but we will let him finish his playing career first.

agree with everything you said.

 

[BlueBelle]

Well Lance has always been praised for his football smarts. No doubt his confidence and ability to assume control of the team given the oportunity by pagan wont go un-noticed.

Captain after Kouta? What do you think his chances are?

No offence to Big Red but you don't have to be football smart to see that an attacking game suits us better than a defensive game!