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Pendulbury/thomas

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brookers#5

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Who have collingwood been most impressed with, i think pendlebury just oozes class & thomas is good but i must admit i'm not a great fan of hit.
 
Brooks, mate after Bay Pie went to all that trouble listing the different spelling versions of 'Pendlebury' you would think all posters would spell it correctly. At least you got it right in your post.

Answer to question: Who cares we got them both!
 
They perfectly complement each other, Thomas has the flair and polish to pull off inspirational footy whilst Pendlebury is like a football logic machine that thinks through each move and spits out the correct one. Totally different, which is exactly what we want, can't believe we got em both!
 

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brookers#5 said:
Who have collingwood been most impressed with, i think pendlebury just oozes class & thomas is good but i must admit i'm not a great fan of hit.
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Funny how pretty much all non-Collingwood fans dont rate Thomas

Must be all the game winning goals he kicks!!

Thomas has probably delivered more as he had a much better first season

Both clearly demonstrating why we picked them at 2&5, couldn't have asked for any more from either player
 
I rate the kid very highly but just dont like him ie. the way he over celebrates some goals he has that persona where he'll be loved by collingwood supporters but not by others not to say his not good to watch.
 
brookers#5 said:
I rate the kid very highly but just dont like him ie. the way he over celebrates some goals he has that persona where he'll be loved by collingwood supporters but not by others not to say his not good to watch.
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That's probably fair enough. Does tend to put the opposition fans against you when you over-celebrate. I personally don't like it in opposition players but can deal with it when A. Diddy or Thomas do it cause i love em!
 

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Well, I have #10 on my 07 jersey, and not because I'm holding out for a Paul Williams comeback. That said, what Daisy could do so early on was very impressive. I won't forget the time in his first game where he took that speccy, but I reckon much more impressively when he took on McLeod on the wing and made him look second rate, or conversely, made himself look like he'd been playing AFL for years, not mere minutes. Meh, in the end, I'm rapt with both. Well done Derek.
 
Thomas has surprised me. Last year I reserved judgement - loved his flair and the fact that he had a dip but was worried about his size, his kicking and thought his pace was over-rated.

Delighted to confess I've changed my tune. On what he's shown this year, he works hard, tackles brilliantly, is fearless and has definitely picked up a yard on last year. Best of all is his marking - once he gets his hands on the ball, he doesn't let go. Stronger than Fraser in that respect.

btw a few Essendon and Carlton supporters I talked to at work today definitely rate him - and would love to get their hands on him!
 
Pendlebury a fair way ahead of Thomas at this stage (although last month has closed the gap)Oh, and Travis probably eclipsing both of them in the last month. Good times.
Btw, most people on here must have butt-rash from sitting on the fence every time this question comes up.
 
mydarlingclementine said:
Pendlebury a fair way ahead of Thomas at this stage (although last month has closed the gap)Oh, and Travis probably eclipsing both of them in the last month. Good times.
Btw, most people on here must have butt-rash from sitting on the fence every time this question comes up.
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OK, here goes: Would be devastated to lose either of them but, if absolutely forced to make a decision, Pendles by a whisker. Don't press me too hard on why though - maybe size and slightly more potential upside.
 
mydarlingclementine said:
Pendlebury a fair way ahead of Thomas at this stage (although last month has closed the gap)Oh, and Travis probably eclipsing both of them in the last month. Good times.
Btw, most people on here must have butt-rash from sitting on the fence every time this question comes up.
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Dont understand that thinking?

Thomas had the much better first season, he earnt a spot in our best 22......so much so that he was brought into the team for the final after being injured, he also could hold his head high after the final

This year he has been good again, and steps up when we need something

In terms of what they have produced for Collingwood so far Thomas is a fair way ahead IMO
 

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doppleganger said:
Dont understand that thinking?

Thomas had the much better first season, he earnt a spot in our best 22......
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Disagree, Thomas was slightly better, but Pendlebury should never have been dropped.

Maybe it's time for an old-fashioned head-to-head breakdown. Obviously this is only one man's opinion.

Size: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 9
At 184cm Thomas is an ok height for a HFF, but still needs to put on weight. Pendles, at 190cm, is taller than most mids, and already has filled out his frame ok, though could add a couple kgs.

Athlete: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 7
Thomas has a very good vertical leap and good (but not exceptional pace) whilst Pendlebury doesn't really get off the ground much, but his speed would not be too far off. Neither covers a particularly enormous amount of ground at this stage.

Kick: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 9
Thomas has the ability to kick some excellent goals but he also sprays it a fair amount, whether in field kicking or in front of goal (12 goals 14 behinds this year). Pendlebury on the other hand would have to be close to the most efficient kick at the club atm (Lockyer might edge him), and is very good in front of goal too (14.6 this year)

Mark: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 7.5
Thomas is a great mark for his size, especially when he gets a run at it and can use his vert. and sticky hands. But Pendles has been very good in 1-on-1's, using his superior height.

Handball: Thomas - 4 Pendlebury - 7
Neither are a particularly exceptional handballer, with Dale kicking at every chance whilst Scott is second at the club in handballs atm, but rarely doing anything exceptional with it.

Clutch Factor: Thomas - 8 Pendlebury - 6.5
Dale has delivered a few times in crucial situations already in his short career, and whilst Pendles hasn't really been put in that situation, he's done nothing wrong in those types of situations either.

Tackling and Defensive Work: Thomas - 7 Pendlebury - 7.5
Both are good and willing tacklers, with Pendlebury getting the edge simply due to weight of numbers (3.2 tackles a game to 1.9).

Upside: Rather than try to measure this in numbers, I'm just thinking about best and worst case scenario for both players:
Dale Thomas - Worst Case is probably somebody like Steve Johnson (this year)
Best Case is a cross between Brett Burton and Nathan.G.Brown
Scott Pendlebury - Worst Case is Nick del Santo
Best Case is James Hird

Add to this that Pendlebury plays the more important position (inside mid c.f. HFF) and I'd take Pendles any day, although I'm more than glad that we have both. Feel free to add/criticize the various categories.
 
doppleganger said:
Dont understand that thinking?

Thomas had the much better first season, he earnt a spot in our best 22......so much so that he was brought into the team for the final after being injured, he also could hold his head high after the final

This year he has been good again, and steps up when we need something

In terms of what they have produced for Collingwood so far Thomas is a fair way ahead IMO
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Thomas ahead after their first season definitely. (Keeping in mind that Pendlebury had a disrupted preseason due to glandular fever.)

But Pendlebury is significantly ahead of Thomas this season.

Overall, Pendlebury is in front on the strength of his second season.
 
Palmer Stoat said:
Thomas ahead after their first season definitely. (Keeping in mind that Pendlebury had a disrupted preseason due to glandular fever.)

But Pendlebury is significantly ahead of Thomas this season.

Overall, Pendlebury is in front on the strength of his second season.
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Yes im aware of Pendles problems in his first year

I still think Thomas has had a much bigger impact so far, prob as a result of playing more games!

Good thing is that we have em both!
 
mydarlingclementine said:
Disagree, Thomas was slightly better, but Pendlebury should never have been dropped.

Maybe it's time for an old-fashioned head-to-head breakdown. Obviously this is only one man's opinion.

Size: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 9
At 184cm Thomas is an ok height for a HFF, but still needs to put on weight. Pendles, at 190cm, is taller than most mids, and already has filled out his frame ok, though could add a couple kgs.

Athlete: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 7
Thomas has a very good vertical leap and good (but not exceptional pace) whilst Pendlebury doesn't really get off the ground much, but his speed would not be too far off. Neither covers a particularly enormous amount of ground at this stage.

Kick: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 9
Thomas has the ability to kick some excellent goals but he also sprays it a fair amount, whether in field kicking or in front of goal (12 goals 14 behinds this year). Pendlebury on the other hand would have to be close to the most efficient kick at the club atm (Lockyer might edge him), and is very good in front of goal too (14.6 this year)

Mark: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 7.5
Thomas is a great mark for his size, especially when he gets a run at it and can use his vert. and sticky hands. But Pendles has been very good in 1-on-1's, using his superior height.

Handball: Thomas - 4 Pendlebury - 7
Neither are a particularly exceptional handballer, with Dale kicking at every chance whilst Scott is second at the club in handballs atm, but rarely doing anything exceptional with it.

Clutch Factor: Thomas - 8 Pendlebury - 6.5
Dale has delivered a few times in crucial situations already in his short career, and whilst Pendles hasn't really been put in that situation, he's done nothing wrong in those types of situations either.

Tackling and Defensive Work: Thomas - 7 Pendlebury - 7.5
Both are good and willing tacklers, with Pendlebury getting the edge simply due to weight of numbers (3.2 tackles a game to 1.9).

Upside: Rather than try to measure this in numbers, I'm just thinking about best and worst case scenario for both players:
Dale Thomas - Worst Case is probably somebody like Steve Johnson (this year)
Best Case is a cross between Brett Burton and Nathan.G.Brown
Scott Pendlebury - Worst Case is Nick del Santo
Best Case is James Hird

Add to this that Pendlebury plays the more important position (inside mid c.f. HFF) and I'd take Pendles any day, although I'm more than glad that we have both. Feel free to add/criticize the various categories.
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I think his kicking is overrated there. While he is a very solid kick, he isn't able to drill a pass over 40m. 20-30m I've seen him do but not longer. They have a tendency to float high which puts more pressure on the recipient than is necessary. His longer kicking at this point isn't great.
 
If you're going to use these ratings I'll give my view.

Size: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 9
Agree. Pendlebury is probably already at the optimum size. Maybe a few more kgs so he can be brilliant in clearances.

Athlete: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 7

Pendlebury would be marked lower, but you have to think about his mobility and agility for his size.

Kick: Thomas - 6.5 Pendlebury - 8
Pendlebury's kicking I've always thought was overrated but this year he has really started to prove me wrong. My only criticism is he isn't Buckley or even Hodge like in penetration and ball speed. Thomas is an inconsistant kick and doesn't have a superb Buckley-esque technique, however he knows what to do, i.e. what type of kick he needs to perform in most, if not all situations. He knows when to put it infront of the player leading, when to lob the ball a bit so the player can take it in his stride and so on.


Mark: Thomas - 9 Pendlebury - 8
 Pendlebury is very good on the lead and one on one but sometimes he doesn't have strong hands but thats probably the only fault. I'm not only rating them on marking but his ability to do the right thing once the battle is lost, Thomas always keeps his feet and is often able to run on to the ball (look at him vs. Malceski) or even tap it to our advantage.


Handball: Thomas - 7.5 Pendlebury - 8.5

Disagree. Again I'm not taking into account just their ability to handball but their decision making with the handball. One of Thomas' strengths IMO is actually his ability to get the ball in a tough situation and shoot out the handball in one swift fluid movement, it is one of his lesser known trademarks. However he can fluff a handball or two, usually because it's too weak or too powerful to handle. Pendlebury may not regularly shoot out 35+ metre killer looping handballs but his ability to get space, read the players around him and handball it to the right option is only paralleled by the elite of the competition.

Clutch Factor: Thomas - 8.5 Pendlebury - 6.5
 This is a basketball term and I think it isn't that big a factor in the AFL. Pendlebury like clementine said has done nothing wrong but he hasn't really proven this side of his game like Dale has. Although against St.Kilda in the last quarter he did a great job on Dal Santo.


Tackling and Defensive Work: Thomas - 8 Pendlebury - 6.5
 Thomas is brilliant in this aspect of his game, but I can't really give him a 9 or higher unless he is Aaron Davey like or he goes to the midfielder and proves to be a very accountable player (which I think he has the capability to do, he is underrated in this aspect). Pendlebury's perceived weakness is accountability, but he doesn't have to be when he is so good forward of centre. However he is very quick to cover loose players and is a very good chaser and superb at fighting for a ball up with great 2nd and 3rd effort in and under. This part of his game makes up for the lack of accountability for his direct opponent.

Upside:
Dale Thomas - Worst Case good half forward flanker/forward pocket player with match winning ability (what he is now)
Best Case Elite outsidish quick midfielder (akermanis/cooneyish [but a Cooney who has actually stepped up to the elite])
Scott Pendlebury - Worst Case Basically what he is now, a not quite inside, not quite outside midfielder, and maybe stuck as the #2 or 3 midfielder if he doesn't develop (can't see it happening)
Best Case - Elite All around midfielder, R.Harvey-esque

I still can't split them after all that, I'd probably choose Pendlebury as it is a safer option (not that he hasn't got upside). I just wanted to voice my opinions using your ratings system.
 
Jabso, I'll give you Thomas as a good handballer (haven't seen it personally, but it's possible), but Pendles being unaccountable is wrong. He has a better tackle rate than either O'bree or Licca for example. The reason he gets overlooked here is that whereas Thomas is scrappy going for tackles (and undersized, so it's more noticeable), Pendlebury never really loses poise. This is also why some people have him rated as just an average athlete. To rate Thomas that much better defensively when statistically he's a mile behind (given, playing a diff. position, but still), isn't accurate.

Also, I certainly agree that his kicking doesn't have Buckley or Hodge penetration, but Buckley's an 11. Hodge would be a 9.5 (occasionally sprays it). The only noticeably better kicks on our team would be Clement and Didak (before the injury). Heater and Lockyer probably on par.

Re: "Clutch Factor" I had to include this since the biggest argument for Thomas thus far imo is that he's a "big game player". But yeah, I stole the term from bball.

Edit: Btw, not a fan of the Akermanis comparison either, because (the young) Akermanis would be close to Buckley in that 11 kicking range. And Thomas is already a fair way in front of Aker's defensive/marking ability
 

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