Perspective

[MyManLynch]

Freeman's hammy, Marsh's hammy, Elliott's hammy, Reid's everything is a start for an argument to the contrary.

Hang on, Freeman is only 1-2 weeks away from playing.

 

[Baird]

Wow Jack Frost has played every game this year?

 

[TradeDraft]

He wasn't the emergency. Young was and came in for Elliott. If the Elliott injury was known about earlier (which it may have been since it was posted here 3 days ago) then we are effing idiots for only holding 1 player back. If it was something which came up late today not alot we can do. No team holds all 3 emergencies out of the VFL just in case.

Well look at the Idiot Donaveron

 

[Yonchi]

My perspective - I have no idea what our best team looks like. Not since August 2011 have we had our full strength team on the field and those players in relative fitness. Maybe the coaching staff are in some part at fault for this, but since before Buckley's tenure we haven't had a full, fit list.

It's laughable how long our injury list has been in it's current state. This effects those who are playing because they shoulder a bigger load. It also places limitations on the development of our junior players because of a lack of competition for positions and a decreased standard of training.

Our chronic injury predicament has not been shared by the likes of Hawthorn, Sydney, Geelong or Fremantle

 

[Jasper84]

Why not?
I'll take Hawthorn as a better example.
They've had their injuries.
Two best backman out.
Best Midfielder out.
Best Small forward out.
Lost their best tall forward.
Sitting 1st.

Did they lose them all in the same game?

 

[Markfs]

I loved the original post. Great analogy. Does this mean we all barrack for Geelong now? I got confused halfway though...

 

[soreplums]

Some perspective is desperately needed on this board. We have fielded 34 players this year with only 4 playing every game: Cloke, Macaffer, Lumumba, Frost every one else has been in and out of the side. Therefore we have lacked continuity and too much has been placed on young kids. That is not by any means Buckley's fault when he has limited options. And for those who say he has lacked leadership remember that he has dropped Keeffe, White, Seedsman and Young based on poor form throughout the season. His willingness to play young kids, mostly forced, but sometimes by design will only help us as a side in the long run.

Out of a possible 20 games here's is what everyone has played: (injuries as of end of round 21 in **)
1. Fasolo – 10 AFL games 2014
2. Dwyer – 12 AFL games 2014 *injured*
3. Macaffer – 20 AFL games 2014
4. Grundy – 13 AFL games 2014
5. Maxwell – 10 AFL games 2014 *season over (retired)*
6. Goldsack – 18 AFL games 2014
7. Kennedy – 8 AFL games 2014
8. Lumumba – 20 AFL games 2014
9. Clarke – 1 AFL games 2014
10. Pendlebury – 19 AFL games 2014 *injuries TBA*
11. Blair – 19 AFL games 2014
12. Ball – 15 AFL games 2014
13. Adams – 12 AFL games 2014 *season over*
14. Young – 18 AFL games 2014
15. Witts – 18 AFL games 2014
16. Brown – 3 AFL games 2014 *season over*
17. Beams – 19 AFL games 2014 *season over*
18. White – 16 AFL games 2014
19. Elliott – 17 AFL games 2014 *injuries TBA*
20. Reid – 3 AFL games 2014 *season over*
21. Lynch – 0 AFL games 2014
22. Sidebottom – 17 AFL games 2014
23. Keeffe – 16 AFL games 2014
24. Thomas – 11 AFL games 2014
25. Hudson – 0 AFL games 2014 *season over*
26. Williams – 13 AFL games 2014
27. Armstrong – 3 AFL games 2014
28. Sinclair – 3 AFL games 2014
29. Broomhead – 6 AFL games 2014
31. Ramsay – 0 AFL games 2014
32. Cloke – 20 AFL games 2014 *likely season over*
33. Karnezis – 0 AFL games 2014
34. Toovey – 17 AFL games 2014
35. Scharenberg – 0 AFL games 2014
36. Swan – 16 AFL games 2014
37. Martin – 2 AFL games 2014
39. Freeman – 0 AFL games 2014 *likely season over*
40. Seedsman – 8 AFL games 2014
41. Langdon – 17 AFL games 2014
43. Oxley – 0 AFL games 2014 *season over*
45. Frost – 20 AFL games
46. Marsh – 0 AFL games 2014 *season over*

Would be interesting to see how H polls in the Copeland given the amount of games he has played this year

 

[Robroy22]

2 flags pushing for number 3.
Next question.

One flag and nothing from 2008-2013....5 year break if I can count....that'd be pretty similar to where we've been since 2010?

 

[soreplums]

Start of the year I had us at 6-10, most likely finishing eighth. Given the start to the year that we had, my expectations changed to us finishing between 4-6. Three poor and unexpected losses to Brisbane, Gold Coast and bulldogs have cost us this opportunity.

Given the injuries to the senior players we had, it was only a matter of time that our top up players, senior players and younger players were going to feel the brunt of a long tough season with an increasing workload on top of a much interrupted preseason. The other concerning thing from the outside is the question of where the leadership of our senior players was onfield during the slump.

I was hoping that we could sneak into the eight this year, but was more hoping that the kids get games and we didn't get any major injuries that would hold us back for the preseason.

Would also like to promote Tapping into the senior coaching team and drop Lappin to either the VFL coach or to the Runner

 

[Robroy22]

All very good points you make. However i ask this. When both teams are close to full strength, which one plays with daring run & carry? Which one can't clear their defensive 50 from a kick out? Which one concedes more forward entries & goals from opposition kick ins by a country mile than the other? Which one streams forward in waves while the other kicks sideways backwards & can't hit targets & when they do clear the area, they have to stop & prop because there is nobody forward of centre to kick to? Injuries always play their part in every teams season & we copped more than our share last night. But i think it's silly to think that everything will be rosy when all players are back. All players will probably never be back at the same time. The team needs to be well drilled on how the game plan works when we have the ball & how it works when we don't have it. Our guys don't seem to be. It's either that or the game plan itself is flawed. We have seen the likes of Goldy, Blair etc being able to play important roles for the team when they know & have faith in the role they play. They look lost along with many others. How many of our players that played in Mick's last year of 2011 have improved under the current coaching structure? For me it's Beams & only Beams. Perhaps Sidey as well. We will need to review this year very hard. That review must come from the board not the coach. We were told everything was to be looked at after losing to Port last year in the elimination final. Players got dumped & more dregs from other clubs brought in. Yet not one of the coaches was moved on. So were they completely blamless in last years fall? Will they be completely blameless in this years further fall?

I take your point too Frizz....but if you want to take this analogy (i.e. when we and the cats are at full strength) we beat Carlton twice and they really struggle to...and they only just disposed of our kids team this year when we were well below strength. I can't remember us playing the catters at full strength for many years (maybe since 2010) so its really hard to judge, but we always seem to do ok against them for all their flair and daring. They still have a core of mature premiership stars (FB, CHB, C, FF, and three midfielders) we have Clokey, Pendles, Sidebottom and Beams (a FF, and three midfielders) spot the difference?

 

[THATSGOLD]

One flag and nothing from 2008-2013....5 year break if I can count....that'd be pretty similar to where we've been since 2010?

Their recent record destroys ours. We were on par with them at one point, haven't breathed the same air for 3 years. Gone backwards.

 

[Robroy22]

Their recent record destroys ours. We were on par with them at one point, haven't breathed the same air for 3 years. Gone backwards.

yet the FACTS say we've achieved about as much as they did after their 2008 premiership?

We all breathe the same air

 

[THATSGOLD]

yet the FACTS say we've achieved about as much as they did after their 2008 premiership?

We all breathe the same air

At least we will be reminded again in two weeks for us those that still need a reality check.

 

[Robroy22]

At least we will be reminded again in two weeks for us those that still need a reality check.

reminded of what?
that half our side is out injured?

 

[HFF]

Perspective?

Sure lets take a look at perspective.

For 3 years now we have gone from premiership, to runners up, to top 4, to 8th and KO'd week one of finals to missing the finals altogether and a percentage under 100- all this with the youngest premiership side in modern history. Instead of continued growth and improvement or at the very least a sustained period, we have regressed and are in free fall decline.

We used to strike genuine fear into the competition with names like Pendlebury, Beams, Swan, Sidebottom, Cloke, Reid, Thomas, Shaw etc.

We used to have a distinct game plan that stood for something and executed to perfection (despite not being a fan of the boundary conscious style).

What do we have now? You couldn't even guess the game plan if you tried. Slow ball movement, slow transition, poor kicking skills (ranked 18th), poor decision makers, no kick in strategy, no defending of the centre corridor, no lead up play, no corridor use, nothing.

That's perspective.

 

[ClaytonM]

Yes it is. The man management of Ben Reid and Nathan Freeman (for starters) has been ridiculous.

Tell me what did they do wrong exactly?

 

[Robroy22]

Perspective?

Sure lets take a look at perspective.

For 3 years now we have gone from premiership, to runners up, to top 4, to 8th and KO'd week one of finals to missing the finals altogether and a percentage under 100- all this with the youngest premiership side in modern history. Instead of continued growth and improvement or at the very least a sustained period, we have regressed and are in free fall decline.

We used to strike genuine fear into the competition with names like Pendlebury, Beams, Swan, Sidebottom, Cloke, Reid, Thomas, Shaw etc.

We used to have a distinct game plan that stood for something and executed to perfection (despite not being a fan of the boundary conscious style).

What do we have now? You couldn't even guess the game plan if you tried. Slow ball movement, slow transition, poor kicking skills (ranked 18th), poor decision makers, no kick in strategy, no defending of the centre corridor, no lead up play, no corridor use, nothing.

That's perspective.

Sounds more like whinging to me....but each to their own. Acting like you deserve better for supporting a team has always astounded me. In the 1950's Melbourne people used to expect to win every game they played, later on it was Richmond and then Carlton, then Hawthorn, Essendon, Brisbane and Geelong. I've never equated it with Collingwood people because we've lived through the Colliwobbles era and then the post Millane period but when people get "rabid" because we might miss the finals for the first time in years and start "turning on their own" you've just got to appreciate HOW far we've come as a supporter base. (i.e.: we're as selfish and as ill informed as the rest of them now)...geez I'm proud.

 

[ClaytonM]

Perspective?

Sure lets take a look at perspective.

For 3 years now we have gone from premiership, to runners up, to top 4, to 8th and KO'd week one of finals to missing the finals altogether and a percentage under 100- all this with the youngest premiership side in modern history. Instead of continued growth and improvement or at the very least a sustained period, we have regressed and are in free fall decline.

We used to strike genuine fear into the competition with names like Pendlebury, Beams, Swan, Sidebottom, Cloke, Reid, Thomas, Shaw etc.

We used to have a distinct game plan that stood for something and executed to perfection (despite not being a fan of the boundary conscious style).

What do we have now? You couldn't even guess the game plan if you tried. Slow ball movement, slow transition, poor kicking skills (ranked 18th), poor decision makers, no kick in strategy, no defending of the centre corridor, no lead up play, no corridor use, nothing.

That's perspective.

Perspective. In the 2010 replay when the issue of a new dynasty was raised Lethal replied that when a new team wins there is always claims of a new dynasty but it rarely happens.

Just because the team was young did not mean that future success was assured. It was a rather unskilled team with a very good game plan well executed. Once the game plan was undone so was the unskilled team.

At lot of supporters got caught up in the hubris of the times and now wallow in the pity of their unrealistic expectations being unfulfilled.

 

[HFF]

Sounds more like whinging to me....but each to their own. Acting like you deserve better for supporting a team has always astounded me. In the 1950's Melbourne people used to expect to win every game they played, later on it was Richmond and then Carlton, then Hawthorn, Essendon, Brisbane and Geelong. I've never equated it with Collingwood people because we've lived through the Colliwobbles era and then the post Millane period but when people get "rabid" because we might miss the finals for the first time in years and start "turning on their own" you've just got to appreciate HOW far we've come as a supporter base. (i.e.: we're as selfish and as ill informed as the rest of them now)...geez I'm proud.

Whinging? Unfortunately they are the stone cold facts like them or lump them.

I love this football club as much as any one and I won't stop supporting them but sometimes reality is the best form of perspective.

We don't deserve any more than any other supporter of any team in the comp.

However, we don't deserve any less either and what we have become is way short of any acceptable level.

 

[HFF]

Perspective. In the 2010 replay when the issue of a new dynasty was raised Lethal replied that when a new team wins there is always claims of a new dynasty but it rarely happens.

Just because the team was young did not mean that future success was assured. It was a rather unskilled team with a very good game plan well executed. Once the game plan was undone so was the unskilled team.

At lot of supporters got caught up in the hubris of the times and now willow in the pity of their unrealistic expectations being unfulfilled.

I'm not suggesting we needed a dynasty. However, a sustained period of genuine challenging for silverware is considered acceptable when you see the names on our team sheet throughout 2010/2011.

We moved the ball and hit up more targets in 2010/2011 better than we have in 2012/2013/2014 and that's a fact. Every statistical category has dried up over the last 3 years and the core of the same players have remained during that period.

Expecting to stay competitive up the top end of the league with the age profile of our list from 2010, the quality of calibre players at our disposal (the envy of the comp too for those years) is far from unrealistic expectations when you consider what we had already achieved.

 

[Robroy22]

Whinging? Unfortunately they are the stone cold facts like them or lump them.

I love this football club as much as any one and I won't stop supporting them but sometimes reality is the best form of perspective.

We don't deserve any more than any other supporter of any team in the comp.

However, we don't deserve any less either and what we have become is way short of any acceptable level.

Unfortunately they are the stone cold facts like them or lump them.
What are the facts again? That we've lost too many games for your liking? How did you justify us losing the 2011 GF again?
How could we have lost that with the game plan and the super team we had?

reality is the best form of perspective...
I'd actually go as far as to say that not sometimes but always this is the best policy. So how do you expect a gun performance from a very young and injury riddled team?

We don't deserve any more than any other supporter of any team in the comp.
Ok so if there's 9 sides above us and 8 below us, we're just about where we deserve to be then?
Unless you have unrealistic expectations?

 

[frizzle]

Perspective. In the 2010 replay when the issue of a new dynasty was raised Lethal replied that when a new team wins there is always claims of a new dynasty but it rarely happens.

Just because the team was young did not mean that future success was assured. It was a rather unskilled team with a very good game plan well executed. Once the game plan was undone so was the unskilled team.

At lot of supporters got caught up in the hubris of the times and now wallow in the pity of their unrealistic expectations being unfulfilled.

The game plan was not undone. We just decided to use something else for some reason. We went completely opposite to what made us successful. We made the ball carrier shit themselves with pressure & made teams kick to a contest. Freo are still doing exactly this today. It still works. We have replaced contested man on man pressure style for an uncontested zone game plan. It has been a major part of why we are where we are. Pressure brings turnovers not zones.

 

[jathanas]

Robroy22 I see what you did in the OP. I'm fast becoming a fan of your work! Thank you.

 

[domin8tors]

Tonight has been a terrible night for the Cats, but in essence it merely puts a full stop on their disastrous season. The season started badly when young gun Josh Caddy broke a hand in the NAB cup. He would miss the next 10 weeks. Harry Taylor then pulled a calf muscle in the next practice match and the Cats were forced to restructure their side without their key swingman, who missed the next 18 weeks. When Jesse Lonergan dislocated his shoulder, missed four weeks before returning for a quarter and dislocating it again he would require a reconstruction and the cats would be without their premiership winning key defenders for the majority of the season. Luckily Cory Enright had regained career best form down back and was leading his young defence with aplomb until he too succumbed to a career ending ankle injury that left the Cats defence decimated.
Brownlow medallist Jimmy Bartel had been down on form early in the season, despite once again sinking the Dons in the ANZAC day match it was clear that the Cats most outstanding big game player of the last 6-7 years was carrying significant injuries and when he had to be "rested" to overcome the niggles he left a midfield already strained by injuries to try and stem the tide against overwhelming odds.

But tonight the wheels fell off completely and coach Chris Scott was left to lament his own terrible luck.
Steve Johnson was unable to shrug off an injury sustained last week and dropped out of the side this morning. Captain and reigning club champion Joel Selwood pulled out of the side five minutes before tonight's game succumbing in the warmup. Five minutes into the game Harry Taylor re injured his right leg and his season was officially over after 8 quarters of senior footy for the year. ( so much for the swing man)
When Tom Hawkins and then Mitch Duncan both suffered serious injuries and were assisted from the field the Cats were effectively playing the Lions without 6 of their best 22 and with only one player on the bench for over a half of footy. The lions quickly smelt blood and put the Catters to the sword, as any side in this situation would.


Now I could have substituted any side into my little story here, but when you lose that many quality players (and so many of them structural keys to our teams performance) the result will always be the same. 2014 has had its moments ( ANZAC day and beating the Swans in Sydney comes to mind) but you can only push Stuff uphill for so long. Our backs broke tonight, luckily the spirit still survived. Someone asked before "didn't Goldsack get hurt as well?" Yep he did but he got up again. And he tried his best to run when he really couldn't do it. Grundy threw himself about and took several excellent marks. Broomy and Ben Ken had some spark and Sidey ran himself into the ground trying. But against the numbers and a good young running side it was never going to be enough once Clokey went off.

We can all get our backs up and call for lynchings and stuff but in the real world, what happened tonight would have been the same had Geelong (or any other team for that matter) been in our place. The spirt's intact and it will show itself again.

Heads up Pie boys and girls.

someone with a little perspective is nice to see. for those doubters out there I'd like to see them but pen to paper and rule out the top 10 players from each club and then tell me how many games that team wins. as GWS proved in beating Sydney at the start of the year. if you don't have the personnel and you are off by even 5% teams will beat you.