Perspective

[M29]

Wow that was bad. Ends our finals hopes more than likely.

Who are we to complain though.

We don't have it that tough, we need to remember that people are doing harder in life than we are, football is just a game remember. I just heard Jana Pitman did something to her leg. This is truely the worst news ever, life changing infact. So bad that channel 9,7,10 had it as the first news item tonight ahead of other items such as the mass starvation going on in Africa.

I just can't wait until the herald sun release the commemorative 'Jana Pitmman' poster tomorrow and the day after. Remember, her loss, (and this great countrys loss) is greater than ours today.

 

[Darealrath]

Nice timing too, what with her claims of the other day that this might be her last Olympics.

 

[Dave]

With the towelling north are getting we're still alive, though we'll be out first week if we do make it. That was one of the most insipid efforts I've witnessed for a long time. And to think I argued with the missus about taking my son along. Gee thanks dad. Will get belted next week by williamstown.

Hille, wasn't disgraced today, though someone should have a word in his ear about wet weather ruck work. PUNCH THE LIVING **** OUT OF IT. None of this nancy tap rucking on days like today son. Laycock - took some nice grabs, showed a bit.

Special mention to Mark Bolton, just keeps adding to the highlights reel. That effort in the second quarter, sensational stuff bolts. I bet Windy was stoked.

**** I hate losing to them.

 

[Dave]

Originally posted by Dave
With the towelling north are getting we're still alive

well **** me.

 

[windyhill]

Originally posted by Dave
t.

Special mention to Mark Bolton, just keeps adding to the highlights reel. That effort in the second quarter, sensational stuff bolts. I bet Windy was stoked.

**** I hate losing to them.

" Essendon fans, look away now"
Is there any possible sniff of a chance that this **** will ever be dropped ?

 

[Darealrath]

And Lloyd out 3-5 they are saying. Be a great effort to just make the 8 now.

 

[marcuz]

" Essendon fans, look away now"
Is there any possible sniff of a chance that this **** will ever be dropped ?

Not while sheedy's around he won't. A guy gunning for his spot played another blinder in the 2's yesterday. But as usual sheeds will stick with his favourites and ignore the others.

 

[Disco Clarky]

******** weak effort!

Same 4 or 5 every week. Ive had patience with Bolts but my patience is tested when he continually makes major stuff ups like dropping uncontested chest marks. Huge game this weekend its all or nothing, beat the Pies well make the finals. If Ted doesnt get a game this week ill go hee.

 

[M29]

Is anyone really worried about missing out. All it is doing is saving us wasting our time losing to port, again.

 

[tomatoes]

Hasn't really killed our finals chances. Most people expected us to make it last week before Port Adelaide. Really, if we win 2 more we should still make it. Although, as many have said, it really makes little difference.

 

[BomberGal]

Hasn't really killed our finals chances. Most people expected us to make it last week before Port Adelaide. Really, if we win 2 more we should still make it. Although, as many have said, it really makes little difference.

Yeah, exactly. Nobody expected us to win the Port match and as such, it kind of makes up for yesterday's loss. (Not literally, but you know what I mean.) Probably depends on what happens with Lloyd, too.

Some ****ty results this weekend haven't helped though.

I just can't see us missing, we'll probably scrape through to make up the numbers, again.

 

[Darealrath]

West Coast's win might have nailed us.

 

[Dan26]

Is anyone really worried about missing out. All it is doing is saving us wasting our time losing to port, again.

I am, for the sake of pride.

You see, I realise that if we finish 7th or 8th, it is basically the same as 9th (i.e no chance of winning the flag), but when you support a proud succesful club you want them to be in the finals. I like seeing our finals appearances ticking over each year, gradually catching Carlton's. I like knowing that we've made the finals 18 of 23 years under Sheedy, because it's a proud record, that we want to continue.

So, in terms of winning the flag, I couldn't care less (because I realise we are no chance), but yes I'm worried about missing out for the sake of pride. I'm proud to be in the "best 50%" of the competiton year in year out, and I'd like it to continue for the 7th year in a row.

 

[Dave]

I'd rather miss out if it means we're better able to refresh the list and be closer to the next flag. Being in the finals means jack all if you don't win it.

 

[Dan26]

I'd rather miss out if it means we're better able to refresh the list and be closer to the next flag. Being in the finals means jack all if you don't win it.

Oh please. How are we better off finishing 9th,than 8th? Is it because the 8th pick in the draft is going to better than the 9th pick? It doesn't work that way. I always want us to win as many games as possible, because I go to every game and watch every game, and as supporters we get better value from our club if we win, as opposed to if we lose.

Being in the finals doesn't mean jack if you lose at all. All 8 finalists know that 7 of them won't win, but the experience of being there and the thrill given to your own fans of being at the MCG watching your club in a final is priceless. Ask a doggies fans whether they'd rather watch their club play in a losing Grand Final, or watch the garbage they have dished up this year.

You can't buy the memories your club gives you from winning games of football, and playing for draft picks doesn't guarantee anything. But if you win a game of football, it is guaranteeed to be in the record books (and your memory) forever.

 

[M29]

Missing the finals is the kick up the arse the players need. We certaintly won't be gaining any memories from finals this year, infact it's going to do our pride alot worse when we lose to port for the 3rd time in a row in a final.

Infact, apart from last week and the West Coast round 3 game, this season has been amazingly ordinary. Nothing worth remembering.

 

[Dan26]

Missing the finals is the kick up the arse the players need. We certaintly won't be gaining any memories from finals this year, infact it's going to do our pride alot worse when we lose to port for the 3rd time in a row in a final.

Infact, apart from last week and the West Coast round 3 game, this season has been amazingly ordinary. Nothing worth remembering.

Making the finals is better than not making them. I can't believe I am mounting an argument to something so obvious. I don't care if we make the finals and lsoe to Port again - that scenario is better than finishing 9th. Why would I (and you) NOT want the club to make the finals? Sure it'd be a kick in the arse, but it'd be the same for Brisbane if they missed the finals. Same for any club. Not being a genuine contender (like now) is a big enough kick up the arse for a successful club like us.

Did Brisbane need to miss the finals in 2000 to get a "kick up the arse" for 2001? No. If you need to miss the finals to get a kick up the arse" it's a sad reflection on the club, so in no way do I subscribe to that theory.

 

[M29]

Why would I (and you) NOT want the club to make the finals?

Save face and not get pumped. Also, I don't want the hassle of getting time of in my new job.

Not being a genuine contender (like now)

Er, finishing 8th, or if by some miracle 7th, does not make us a geniune contender. Infact the only genuine contenders are from 1st-5th. Despite whatever mathematically equations that anyone can provide to the contrary of it, NO team finishing 6th, 7th and 8th has a realistic shot at the flag.

If you need to miss the finals to get a kick up the arse" it's a sad reflection on the club, so in no way do I subscribe to that theory.

I'd say many of our performances this year have been a sad reflection of the club. So in one way, it's fitting.

 

[Dan26]

Er, finishing 8th, or if by some miracle 7th, does not make us a geniune contender.

I know that. But finishing 8th is better than finishing 9th, just like finishing 9th is better than finishing 10th.

Infact the only genuine contenders are from 1st-5th.

That doesn't mean we should all "want" the club to lose just because we aren't better than the top-5 teams. Whan I watch the club, I feel happier when they win, as I'm sure 99% of fans do.

Despite whatever mathematically equations that anyone can provide to the contrary of it, NO team finishing 6th, 7th and 8th has a realistic shot at the flag.

So? It's still better to make it and add another finals appearance to the club's history than to miss out. What possible benefits are there from finishing 9th that are BETTER than the benefits from finishing 8th? None. Having one higher puck in the draft means next to nothing unless you subscribe to the misguided theory that the 8th draft pick is always betetr than the 9th draft pick.

 

[M29]

Having one higher puck in the draft means next to nothing unless you subscribe to the misguided theory that the 8th draft pick is always betetr than the 9th draft pick.

That's a fair point. We could be just a step away from the next Mark Bolton.

 

[Dave]

Oh please. How are we better off finishing 9th,than 8th? Is it because the 8th pick in the draft is going to better than the 9th pick? It doesn't work that way.

Did I say I wanted us to finish ninth? Continually finishing in the lower end of the eight is simply a recepie for marking time. Under the AFL's socialist system you need a visit to the bottom end of the ladder from time to time to replenish your list.

I always want us to win as many games as possible, because I go to every game and watch every game, and as supporters we get better value from our club if we win, as opposed to if we lose.

I want to see us win the flag.

Being in the finals doesn't mean jack if you lose at all. All 8 finalists know that 7 of them won't win, but the experience of being there and the thrill given to your own fans of being at the MCG watching your club in a final is priceless. Ask a doggies fans whether they'd rather watch their club play in a losing Grand Final, or watch the garbage they have dished up this year.

Ask Collingwood fans if they'd rather have seen their club lose 11 Grand Finals or if they'd have swapped a few of them for a win and a few years out of the finals.

You can't buy the memories your club gives you from winning games of football, and playing for draft picks doesn't guarantee anything. But if you win a game of football, it is guaranteeed to be in the record books (and your memory) forever.

Premierships live a lot longer in the memory than h&a wins I'll give you the tip danny.

 

[slugger]

It's a bit like being an alcoholic. You can't get cured till you admit you have a problem. If we make the 8, we're just papering over the cracks. We've got to admit that our list has some big holes, and that we've wasted this season by playing guys like Misiti for 19 games, and maybe even by recruiting Murphy. We've got to take the leap and play more young guys.

I honestly don't care if we miss out. We can't win or even do some serious damage.

 

[Dan26]

Did I say I wanted us to finish ninth? Continually finishing in the lower end of the eight is simply a recepie for marking time. Under the AFL's socialist system you need a visit to the bottom end of the ladder from time to time to replenish your list.



I want to see us win the flag.



Ask Collingwood fans if they'd rather have seen their club lose 11 Grand Finals or if they'd have swapped a few of them for a win and a few years out of the finals.



Premierships live a lot longer in the memory than h&a wins I'll give you the tip danny.

I think it's a myth that time at the bottom end of the ladder allows you to better build your list to a significantly better extent than a side at the top. I think the effect is minimal. In theory yes, but in practice it's not that simple. Richmond have been at the bottom (or middle) of the ladder for 22 years and it hasn't gotten them anywhere. Developing and bettering the players that you DO have (Essendon has had no peer in this regard) is more important than drafting them. With over 2000 youngsters applying for the draft each year, the top 16 (the first full round of picks) are all going to be capable players. Hell, we finished top of the ladder in '99, and with our first pick in November picked up the runner-up in the rising star for 2000 (Ramanauskas.) And that was after winning 18 H&A games!

I want to win the flag too, and the best way is to recruit smartly, and continue to develop the players we DO have and make them better players, regardless of who those players are. You do not have to spend time out of the finals to be a good team. We finished top three years in a row from 99-01, and this was despite making the finals in 7 of the 10 years directly before '99. It didn't hinder our ability to be a good side. As supporters, the home and away games make up 95% of the matches we attend and watch so winning as many as possible (which obviously bodes well for finals, given that the more H&A games you win, the better placed you are for Setemeber anyway) is always more preferable than time at the bottom of the ladder. As supporters, there is no better value than winning games of football. If you win a game, any game, it's guaranteed to be in the history books forever. Finishing last guarantees nothing in regards to future succcess. All it guarantees is the wooden spoon.

As fo the Collingowod question. (you asked if they'd rather have seen their club lose 11 Grand Finals or if they'd have swapped a few of them for a win and a few years out of the finals) how many years out of the finals, in exchange for a couple more flags would be preferable before the weekly pain of losing year in year out became too much? Would one extra flag, but 10 less finals appearances (that's 10 successful years of winning seasons) really be worth the exchange? When one considers the unbridled joy that comes from winning, and the office exchanges and bragging rights that come every Monday, exchanging a large number of winning seasons for one flag, is not an easy choice. I've got so much joy from so many great victories by Essendon over the last 20 years (many in seasons we didn't win the flag), and those memories wouldn't exist without us being a good side, even if the end reuslt in those seasons was a losing finals series. You can't put a price on the the memories our club in particular has given us over the last 20 years.

 

[M29]

Hell, we finished top of the ladder in '99, and with our first pick in November picked up the runner-up in the rising star for 2000 (Ramanauskas.) And that was after winning 18 H&A games!

Obvioulsy a fluke from our drafting department. We've had some shockers.

Finishing last guarantees nothing in regards to future succcess. All it guarantees is the wooden spoon.

I don't think anyone has said we should finish last.

As fo the Collingowod question. (you asked if they'd rather have seen their club lose 11 Grand Finals or if they'd have swapped a few of them for a win and a few years out of the finals) how many years out of the finals, in exchange for a couple more flags would be preferable before the weekly pain of losing year in year out became too much?

I'd rather they kept making finals and missing flags.

Would one extra flag, but 10 less finals appearances (that's 10 successful years of winning seasons) really be worth the exchange?

For them it would be.

When one considers the unbridled joy that comes from winning, and the office exchanges and bragging rights that come every Monday, exchanging a large number of winning seasons for one flag, is not an easy choice. I've got so much joy from so many great victories by Essendon over the last 20 years

I'm sure the Lightening Premiership is held in high regards everywhere.

You can't put a price on the the memories our club in particular has given us over the last 20 years.

I'm sure the club is working on a way.

 

[dodgey]

Not being a genuine contender (like now) is a big enough kick up the arse for a successful club like us.

Hasn't helped in the Last 2 Years Dan ....More than Blows YOUR theory out of the water ......

FWIW : I agree with M29 on this one. Actually having to watch the WHOLE Finals series unfold from the Outer may Just put some Hunger back into them. Because we have made week 2 for the last 2 years and in some respects...( especially the Win in Freo last year) that was seen as a good achievement...