Current Royal Commission into Lawyer X gangland convictions on tainted evidence & police corruption

[petedavo]

From 2015 article by Nick McKenzie
Appears that this journalist was told about lawyer x but missed it's significance at the time.
https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/ba...rence-hodson-murder-case-20150116-12s24g.html
Extract»
I never knew if my meeting with Williams was accidental, or if he had something he had wanted to tell me. My contact didn't say, aside from intimating that Williams was one of those who'd had access to the leaked Hodson files. There had been two leaks, he told me, both implicating Hodson as an informer: one had come from a lawyer, the other a corrupt cop. When I asked about the cop, he pointed at the ceiling to warn of listening bugs, then mouthed what looked like the words "Paul Dale".

At the bakery, I relayed some of these facts to Gregor. As I did, his face turned red and I thought I saw him clench his jaw. The possibility that the leak - and by extension police corruption - had contributed to the deaths of Terence and Christine Hodson had been assiduously and repeatedly downplayed by senior police, led by Simon Overland. But Gregor was surprisingly direct. "Of course the leak played a part in Terence's death. The files could have only been stolen by cops."



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[sprockets]

The problem with that is none of the other substantial evidence may have been discovered without the kickstart from the lawyer.

Without her evidence there may not have been some trials in the first place.

But they're still guilty of the crime, whether they've been found guilty by the courts or not.

 

[petedavo]

I can only guess what they'll be discussing.


Gut feeling says it's this

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[Crimewavex]

John Silvester or Sly of the Underworld. Just quietly, perhaps he might be a little bit concerned.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Silvester_(writer)

• Underbelly 11 : more true crime stories, John Silvester and Andrew Rule ISBN 0-9775440-5-2 (2007)
• Underbelly : The Gangland War, John Silvester and Andrew Rule ISBN 978-0-9775440-6-6 (2008)
• Underbelly : A Tale of Two Cities, John Silvester and Andrew Rule ISBN 978-0-9775440-9-7 (2009)
• Underbelly : The Golden Casket, John Silvester and Andrew Rule ISBN 978-0-9807170-3-7 (2010)

So what are the thoughts behind John Silvester here?
I find him to be heavily pro police and in addition every time i hear him speak or read anything of his is tends to be annoying full of puns.

 

[Badge666]

So what are the thoughts behind John Silvester here?
I find him to be heavily pro police and in addition every time i hear him speak or read anything of his is tends to be annoying full of puns.

Yes Silvester is an old fashioned Police apologist and acolyte who gleans snippets of information from pub talk (always his shout )with the coppers he so admires in dingy inner city bars and restaurants.
Both he and Andrew Rule made an absolute fortune from the drivel of the first couple of Chopper Books until the public wised up at about edition number four that it was utter bullshit being told by Mark Read who was regarded as a despised buffoon by Melbournes criminal fraternity.
Chopper received a little less than a dollar a copy of every book sold ,a royalty of about 8 percent for his imaginative ramblings , and got close to a million all up reportedly,_ so you can imagine how much Rule and Silvester cleaned up for doing a little editing and writing a short foreword.
Read didn't learn anything from the experience....Mark Jacko Jackson allegedly ripped him off unmercifully with the gate takings from the hugely successful "Wild Colonial Psychos" Pub speaking tour as well........

 

[Kurve]

I feel sorry for the kind of decent young cops who took the hits and probably too long to shoot the Burke Street rampager. So green.


Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton was involved in a major murder investigation that used Informer 3838, while also developing strategies to protect the police force and the government in the event of a royal commission into police corruption.

Police affidavits obtained by The Age reveal the extensive involvement of Mr Ashton and current Assistant Commissioner Luke Cornelius in the ill-fated Briars investigation, including a string of highly secretive meetings of which no records were kept.

Mr Cornelius and then deputy commissioner Simon Overland were part of a special advisory group to Operation Briars, which considered potential scenarios including ''a catastrophic leak or the potential of one of the witnesses being identified and killed."

The advisory group discussed appointing Frank Costigan, QC, who had previously served as a royal commissioner, to provide guidance and "help test our thinking.

Operation Briars was launched after allegations emerged that two police officers, David Waters and Peter Lalor, were involved in the 2003 shooting death of male prostitute Shane Chartres-Abbott.

Chartres-Abbott, nicknamed the Vampire Gigolo, was killed the day before he was due to stand trial for raping and biting off the tongue of a woman, amid claims he was threatening to expose corrupt relationships with police.

Operation Briars was launched after allegations emerged that two police officers, David Waters and Peter Lalor, were involved in the 2003 shooting death of male prostitute Shane Chartres-Abbott.

Chartres-Abbott, nicknamed the Vampire Gigolo, was killed the day before he was due to stand trial for raping and biting off the tongue of a woman, amid claims he was threatening to expose corrupt relationships with police.

Informer 3838 had been used by the taskforce to elicit information from Mr Waters about his alleged involvement in the murder plot.

Mr Cornelius, Mr Ashton and Mr Overland recognised the potential for a political scandal and attempted to mitigate the risks.

"We acknowledged around the table, if this thing goes horribly wrong for us and we do find ourselves in territory where we might need to concede that there should be a royal commission, then Frank Costigan would be a helpful person," said Mr Cornelius in a sworn affidavit from November 2007.

"We felt we could trust Frank because of his long-standing relationship with policing," Assistant Commissioner Cornelius said.

The advisory committee also formulated a plan to shield the former Brumby government from any political fallout.

"Our view was we would delay briefing the government about the matter until the last possible minute, if there was a catastrophic leak, because we certainly did not want to expose government to subsequent allegations of that there was political involvement in the thing," Mr Cornelius said.

Mr Ashton, in his former role as assistant director of the Office of Police Integrity, was involved in the Briars investigation from its inception in 2007.

He briefed Assistant Commissioner Cornelius on the explosive allegations that two police officers assisted in providing a hitman with Chartres-Abbott's address in Reservoir.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...-that-used-informer-3838-20181210-p50lda.html


Why does Ashton still have a job?

 

[Kurve]

AdamShand did a really decent podcast on the execution murder of Chartres-Abbott for anyone not familiar with how it all played out.

Melbourne, Victoria: In August 2002, when a male prostitute is accused of raping and mutilating a client, few doubt his guilt. It's a shocking attack, the victim's tongue is almost torn from her mouth. To complete the lurid picture, she says her attacker boasted that he was a 200 year old vampire.

Yet Shane Chartres-Abbott says he was framed and sets out to prove he is the fall guy for a high-level sex ring operating in the city. He fears he will be silenced before he can tell his story but no-one listens. He doesn't know there are others who want him dead. The victim is hiding a complex and volatile past relationship from police.
On June 4 2003, Shane is murdered on the way to give evidence in court.

https://www.thetrialsofthevampire.com/episodes

 

[Crimewavex]

AdamShand did a really decent podcast on the execution murder of Chartres-Abbott for anyone not familiar with how it all played out.

Melbourne, Victoria: In August 2002, when a male prostitute is accused of raping and mutilating a client, few doubt his guilt. It's a shocking attack, the victim's tongue is almost torn from her mouth. To complete the lurid picture, she says her attacker boasted that he was a 200 year old vampire.

Yet Shane Chartres-Abbott says he was framed and sets out to prove he is the fall guy for a high-level sex ring operating in the city. He fears he will be silenced before he can tell his story but no-one listens. He doesn't know there are others who want him dead. The victim is hiding a complex and volatile past relationship from police.
On June 4 2003, Shane is murdered on the way to give evidence in court.

https://www.thetrialsofthevampire.com/episodes

Great podcast too, very highly recommended.
Found it quite interesting that after everything happened Ron Iddles still believes that Keith Faure was the shooter despite so many inconsistencies throughout and the police essentially walking him through the details.

 

[Slartibartfast]

So what are the thoughts behind John Silvester here?
I find him to be heavily pro police and in addition every time i hear him speak or read anything of his is tends to be annoying full of puns.

Pro Police???

How about pro justice !!!!

 

[Kurve]

But they're still guilty of the crime, whether they've been found guilty by the courts or not.

That might simply be a matter of opinion shortly sprockets.

 

[Boomerfan99]

So what are the thoughts behind John Silvester here?
I find him to be heavily pro police and in addition every time i hear him speak or read anything of his is tends to be annoying full of puns.

Very annoying campaigner and shocking writer. Very self-righteous, I don't want a sermon when I am reading about true crime. He is good at delivering the news though.

 

[sprockets]

I feel sorry for the kind of decent young cops who took the hits and probably too long to shoot the Burke Street rampager. So green.


Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton was involved in a major murder investigation that used Informer 3838, while also developing strategies to protect the police force and the government in the event of a royal commission into police corruption.

Police affidavits obtained by The Age reveal the extensive involvement of Mr Ashton and current Assistant Commissioner Luke Cornelius in the ill-fated Briars investigation, including a string of highly secretive meetings of which no records were kept.

Mr Cornelius and then deputy commissioner Simon Overland were part of a special advisory group to Operation Briars, which considered potential scenarios including ''a catastrophic leak or the potential of one of the witnesses being identified and killed."

The advisory group discussed appointing Frank Costigan, QC, who had previously served as a royal commissioner, to provide guidance and "help test our thinking.

Operation Briars was launched after allegations emerged that two police officers, David Waters and Peter Lalor, were involved in the 2003 shooting death of male prostitute Shane Chartres-Abbott.

Chartres-Abbott, nicknamed the Vampire Gigolo, was killed the day before he was due to stand trial for raping and biting off the tongue of a woman, amid claims he was threatening to expose corrupt relationships with police.

Operation Briars was launched after allegations emerged that two police officers, David Waters and Peter Lalor, were involved in the 2003 shooting death of male prostitute Shane Chartres-Abbott.

Chartres-Abbott, nicknamed the Vampire Gigolo, was killed the day before he was due to stand trial for raping and biting off the tongue of a woman, amid claims he was threatening to expose corrupt relationships with police.

Informer 3838 had been used by the taskforce to elicit information from Mr Waters about his alleged involvement in the murder plot.

Mr Cornelius, Mr Ashton and Mr Overland recognised the potential for a political scandal and attempted to mitigate the risks.

"We acknowledged around the table, if this thing goes horribly wrong for us and we do find ourselves in territory where we might need to concede that there should be a royal commission, then Frank Costigan would be a helpful person," said Mr Cornelius in a sworn affidavit from November 2007.

"We felt we could trust Frank because of his long-standing relationship with policing," Assistant Commissioner Cornelius said.

The advisory committee also formulated a plan to shield the former Brumby government from any political fallout.

"Our view was we would delay briefing the government about the matter until the last possible minute, if there was a catastrophic leak, because we certainly did not want to expose government to subsequent allegations of that there was political involvement in the thing," Mr Cornelius said.

Mr Ashton, in his former role as assistant director of the Office of Police Integrity, was involved in the Briars investigation from its inception in 2007.

He briefed Assistant Commissioner Cornelius on the explosive allegations that two police officers assisted in providing a hitman with Chartres-Abbott's address in Reservoir.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...-that-used-informer-3838-20181210-p50lda.html


Why does Ashton still have a job?

Maybe he still has a job because those under him 'qualified' to take his place are just as bad. Maybe it's endemic in police forces around the world. Maybe better the devil you know.

Interesting that they also didn't want to tell the govt of the day for the reasons given when the real reason is because they thought they were above the law and the govt might have put a stop to what they were doing. Why were they so concerned about a Royal Commission if they believed they were doing the right thing? While I have faith that the police are far better than the crooks, the Royal Commission should be wide ranging and not just about this particular episode. Victoria is commonly referred to as a Police State and it has to stop.

 

[sprockets]

That might simply be a matter of opinion shortly sprockets.

Well, the evidence shows they're guilty. Evidence > opinion!

 

[Slartibartfast]

Well, the evidence shows they're guilty. Evidence > opinion!

High court stop short of saying Vic Pol had acted criminally.

 

[Slartibartfast]

I think it may come down to the point that the lawyer acted without integrity but that is her responsibility and not Vic Pol’s.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Thats not a good approach by any body enforcing the law but extreme times encourages extreme measures.

 

[Kurve]

I think it may come down to the point that the lawyer acted without integrity but that is her responsibility and not Vic Pol’s.

They recruited and managed her as a registered informant for four years, she was being paid.

They're responsible. imo.

 

[Dan Moody]

Had a few 'Bronze Up' while I was there, one in particular I remember well. We turned the water off to his cell and let him stew in it for quite some time.

It was his way off getting out of going to court. It worked but he had a price to pay. He was squealing like a little girl by the end.

He was one of the crew involved in the 'Trial From Hell'

Something to do with poetry his surname.

i grew up with sean, lived around the corner from me in noble park. i was also good mates with his buddy, meggsy, as we called him at primary school. sean was always a badass, one of the neighbourhood kids you'd steer clear of. was an a-hole at school as well, luckily i was never on the wrong side of him but i admit it wasn't much of a surprise to see what had become of him. meggsy on the other hand, was more a a naughty kid, a larrikin that i got on really well with.

 

[Slartibartfast]

They recruited and managed her as a registered informant for four years, she was being paid.

They're responsible. imo.

Her life, her choice, her responsibility.

 

[petedavo]

I wonder if 3838 was the only Lawyer on VicPol books?

Mario Condello?

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...der-secrets-to-his-grave-20180511-p4zeny.html

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[Chameleon75]

I wonder if 3838 was the only Lawyer on VicPol books?

Mario Condello?

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...der-secrets-to-his-grave-20180511-p4zeny.html

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Thought he had his legal license revoked years earlier

 

[sprockets]

I wonder if 3838 was the only Lawyer on VicPol books?

Mario Condello?

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...der-secrets-to-his-grave-20180511-p4zeny.html

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He was the first one that came to my mind when this kerfuffle broke.

 

[petedavo]

Thought he had his legal license revoked years earlier

Dunno. But all the names in that story are the same names in other lawyer x stories. That can't be coincidence, or is it just what John Silvester does when he writes stories?

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[Fabab]

Is Dennis Dennuto involved?

 

[petedavo]

This is interesting in light of what the High Court said about "administration of justice and public confidence in the justice system" in finding number 10 of the High Court Judgement.

This was a statement in the Coroner's Court made whilst Police were trying to keep a lid on the brewing scandal that Lawyer X was a registered Police Informant...

"But Rachel Doyle, SC, representing Victoria Police, said the need to ensure the administration of justice could "trump" the wishes of both men, and the fact their evidence would help Judge Gray perform a thorough investigation might provide the Hodsons' family with answers and promote public confidence in the justice system."

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...-at-hodson-murder-inquest-20140722-zvl5m.html

I can only wonder what Rachel would've said differently had she any inkling of what the High Court would be saying now about the Police conduct in these very same areas of jurisprudence at the time she was making this statement?

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