Steve Waugh

[dr nick]

worth going out and buying this paper today, 10 pages on steve waugh

 

[Mead]

Originally posted by nicko18
the commerative limited edition of 10,000 "10,000 test runs" framed and signed photos will be available shortly, with the nice frame of course

Cash or Credit?
I'm just waiting for the day when Richie Benaud says 'Marvellous piece, this, perfect collectors item, only $9995.. .. or your SOULLLLLLL!!!!!! mwaHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!! (head rotates around, spilling green goo on that lovely salmon jacket)

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Originally posted by P0RT P0WER
The Queensland gauntlet of Border and Hohns has got to go, Symonds selection was poor, Maher's was warranted but since these clowns have rna things we seem to see Queenslanders popping up left right and centre, the excuses have been youth but when they select Bichel over a young pace bowler it is labelled as experience but when it's Ponting over Steve it is youth, If I was a New South Welshman Id be very bitter.

Yeah sure I can see how New South Wales players get such a raw deal. Barely see any of them in the National squads.

I heard Allan Border a couple of years ago about his record and they asked him about it being overtaken and he replied something along the lines that No-one wants there record to be overtaken and it sounded as if he interpreted it like the way Taylor retired on 334* equal with the Don is the same way his record should be. Steve Waugh is greater than Allan Border and always will be.

This sort of thing really annoys me. In an effort to support one champion, you denigrate another. If you like to see someone take the bit between their teeth when their side was in trouble, look no further than Allan Border. Less than half of his career was spent amongst the likes of Chappell, Marsh, Lillee in a golden era for Australian Cricket. Then when Kim Hughes cracks the sh*ts, AB has the captaincy all but forced upon him and spends years amongst a bunch of no name, no talents getting their arse kicked all over the place. This man too averaged over 50 and faced Garner, Roberts, Holding, Marshall, Ambrose, Walsh, Hadlee, Botham, Imran, Dev on a regular basis. Back in those days, it was a momentous occasion just to make the all conquering Windies bat again or to avoid the follow on. England weren't the rabble that we have seen in recent years either with Gooch, Gower, Botham and Lamb at the top of their game still. I give AB all the credit in the world for the role he played in developing the nucleus of the Australian teams that achieved such great success towards the end of his career and immediately thereafter.

Steve Waugh is a determined player and a favourite but has played with a lot less pressure on him in comparison. You can put them both on a pedestal if you like, but do suggest that Waugh is better than Border and always will be ... well, highly subjective to say the least.

 

[dr nick]

i think it is virtually unanimous in every "top 100 players" ive seen recently that steve waugh is ahead of allan border

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Originally posted by nicko18
i think it is virtually unanimous in every "top 100 players" ive seen recently that steve waugh is ahead of allan border

'Recently' being the operative word. Everybody loves a winner and the current Australian side are like gods. Forget about what you have seen from others, give me your assessment of the two players as far as performance and on field character go. Seems logical to me that they are pretty hard to split and for the most part represent different eras of Australian cricket with fluctuating fortunes. How exactly is AB inferior to Steve Waugh?

I guess recent charts tell you that Eminem is the greatest performer in the world too?

 

[dr nick]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
'Recently' being the operative word. Everybody loves a winner and the current Australian side are like gods. Forget about what you have seen from others, give me your assessment of the two players as far as performance and on field character go. Seems logical to me that they are pretty hard to split and for the most part represent different eras of Australian cricket with fluctuating fortunes. How exactly is AB inferior to Steve Waugh?

I guess recent charts tell you that Eminem is the greatest performer in the world too?

'recently' as in both have had time enough for their careers to flourish. all time charts are not based on current form, but overall career. you seem to imply that these all time lists are chosen with a bias towards current day players. they are not. your eminem remark might be a current top 40 vote, of which not even bradman would be in the fray, eminem would not make the comparative all time lists. in those lists, steve waugh is always above border.

 

[Darky]

Allan Border made more runs, and against better bowlers. Back in those days the side didn't just captain on auto-pilot either.

One ABC commentator said the other day that when Border played well, Australia was always in with a chance, whereas without him they were stuffed. Batted anywhere from 3-6, and as captain he didn't have current world-beaters like Hayden, Ponting, McGrath and Warne at his disposal at their peak.

I think that's more pressure than what S.Waugh puts up with these days, flying from country to country flogging whatever unprofessional rabble trots out disguised as a Test team.

 

[dr nick]

Originally posted by Darky
Allan Border made more runs, and against better bowlers. Back in those days the side didn't just captain on auto-pilot either.

One ABC commentator said the other day that when Border played well, Australia was always in with a chance, whereas without him they were stuffed. Batted anywhere from 3-6, and as captain he didn't have current world-beaters like Hayden, Ponting, McGrath and Warne at his disposal at their peak.

I think that's more pressure than what S.Waugh puts up with these days, flying from country to country flogging whatever unprofessional rabble trots out disguised as a Test team.

that must be why no-one of importance (and by that i mean professional cricketing journos, commentators and ex players, notself professed experts such as yourself that claims steve waugh captains on auto pilot, but by judging australia's form back then, you could say the same for border) rates border higher than steve waugh.

 

[P0RT P0WER]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Yeah sure I can see how New South Wales players get such a raw deal. Barely see any of them in the National squads.

I wasn't referring to New South Wales players, I was reffering to Steve Waugh and being a New South Welshmen I'd be very bitter seeing the way he is treated, before making assumptions read my posts CLEARLY!

This sort of thing really annoys me. In an effort to support one champion, you denigrate another. If you like to see someone take the bit between their teeth when their side was in trouble, look no further than Allan Border. Less than half of his career was spent amongst the likes of Chappell, Marsh, Lillee in a golden era for Australian Cricket. Then when Kim Hughes cracks the sh*ts, AB has the captaincy all but forced upon him and spends years amongst a bunch of no name, no talents getting their arse kicked all over the place. This man too averaged over 50 and faced Garner, Roberts, Holding, Marshall, Ambrose, Walsh, Hadlee, Botham, Imran, Dev on a regular basis. Back in those days, it was a momentous occasion just to make the all conquering Windies bat again or to avoid the follow on. England weren't the rabble that we have seen in recent years either with Gooch, Gower, Botham and Lamb at the top of their game still. I give AB all the credit in the world for the role he played in developing the nucleus of the Australian teams that achieved such great success towards the end of his career and immediately thereafter.

Steve Waugh is a determined player and a favourite but has played with a lot less pressure on him in comparison. You can put them both on a pedestal if you like, but do suggest that Waugh is better than Border and always will be ... well, highly subjective to say the least.

[/COLOR]I was never denigrating Allan Borders onfield efforts I was critiscizing his off field antics, so again before you rant and rave like you continously do read my post CLEARLY. I personally rate Steve Waugh better, but each to their own, they have similar averages and runs scored but IMO Allan Borders were more individual than Steve Waughs but Steve Waughs ability to be best in the world year after year and be the most feared test team ever just shows what a true leader he is. Not only has he been able to re-write history his time at the helm has smashed most records that were not seen as breakable. Allan was one of the greatest but not comparable to Waugh, Waugh also spent time in his early days against these great bowlers you mentioned, but he has brought a new dimension to test cricket, taking new risks to the game, winning games so convincingly time and time again some under three days others by innings and ample runs, Waugh always stands up when we are looking down the barrell, people like yourself seem to forget the self heroics of the 99 world cup, the West Indies tour etc when he dragged us out of loseable situations into great wins. This is the greatest side of any era and captained by the greatest captain of all time.[

 

[P0RT P0WER]

Quoted by Nicko18 - i think it is virtually unanimous in every "top 100 players" ive seen recently that steve waugh is ahead of allan border

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's


I guess recent charts tell you that Eminem is the greatest performer in the world too?

Again you try an make assumptions and do not read the post clearly, if you use your brain Nicko was trying to elaborate the top 100 of all time and it seems pretty obvoius when he is talking about Border and Waugh as Border is no longer playing that he is going on past tense. Another pathetic response trying to start an argument with a response that is not even relevant to the subject!