Stone Cold Bluff v Monster Hand

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Crosby87 said:
I disagree. If I'm second in chips, out of the money, the chip leader moves all-in, I don't care what my hand is, I fold. I know I can dominate him shorthanded, so I'm still confident about winning, no matter how many chips I have.

I at least would like to make sure I cash. I don't know about you, but I don't like playing for two hours, getting that close, without result.

It's not really playing conservative - it's playing smart. Why call off all your chips when you can smash him with aggressive play later?
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It just doesnt make sense. Conventional strategy says - if everyone is playing tight - loosen up and steal pots. If everyone is playing loose, tighten up and wait for your spots - why should this change just because you are on the bubble?

Noone should EVER play to make the money - if thats all you are trying to do - then quit now. You'll never get anywhere playing like that - you have to play to win - thats where the real money is anyway.
 
I'm fairly inexperienced compared to you guys and this is a great read.

As I said earlier, I folded AKh on the bubble so I would make the money (I was on a pretty short stack so I'm glad I did) BUT I was thinking, as I was doing it, that serious players wouldn't do it and after reading Falchoon's/Phil Gordon's quote and the above from Doug the Almighty, I see the wisdom.

Don't know if I've got the.... how does Mike the Mouth put it?... the *cough* to play loose and aggressive yet, but I'll certainly be more inclined after reading this.
 
Crosby87 said:
Perhaps it's because nobody has written it in a poker book? Lol.
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Actually that's quite ironic. I personally have never read a poker book, virtually self taught, which is probably fine and dandy at the level I play, plus a lot of what I've read online I probably have done all along anyway, position, pot odds etc (I'm an analyst/non practicing qualified Accountant) but I have started reading a couple of sites that R+B has posted. The Phil Gordon one in particular catching my eye.

and my god have I discovered so many people who do play by the book. In fact if I never put into practice what I read in future I will still be a much better player having read the odd book or 2. Bubble poker being one example, raises by the button being another.

It is a great game.


Then again if any bookshop I'd ever been in had a decent poker book........
 

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It just doesnt make sense. Conventional strategy says - if everyone is playing tight - loosen up and steal pots. If everyone is playing loose, tighten up and wait for your spots - why should this change just because you are on the bubble?

Noone should EVER play to make the money - if thats all you are trying to do - then quit now. You'll never get anywhere playing like that - you have to play to win - thats where the real money is anyway.
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I suggest you go back and re-read my posts. Bah, nobody understands what I mean, so whatever.

I speak of risking all my chips in on the bubble, and people accuse me of playing tight. Go back and read a post of mine when this forum opened, and I'm sure I gave people advice to play aggressive on the bubble.

Blah... where's the great Phil Gordon when you need him?
 
Crosby87 said:
Oh, and Matusow isn't as aggressive as you would think.
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I understand where you are coming from and I reckon these things all come down to how you feel at the time about what's going on around you. Sounds vague I know but I really think it's hard to say what's the right way to play cards in any situation without having a feel for the particular game.
Edit: I don't think that made sense.
 
For those interested (I know doug had qualms about credit cards), I suggest you do what I did, and get a Visa Debit Card for the sole purpose of online transactions. The one I recommend is the Victorian Teachers Visa Debit card. How did I choose that you ask? Well I started at InfoChoice and selected Debit, VIC, No Annual Fee. When I need funds for Amazon, poker, etc, I EFT from my main account with another bank. So most of the time, I have next to no money in this account, I transfer funds when I know I need it.
 
red+black said:
I think some of you guys are way too tight. I've recommended tight play near a satellite bubble, but not in a real tournament. I'll have to side with dougthelegend on playing to win.

I'm playing Aces every time on the bubble against the chip leader.
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Agreed, I think its ridiculous to even suggest folding AA preflop if called all in. Its the NUTS.

If you won't play that, what will you play?
 

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red+black said:
For thopse interested (I know doug had qualms about credit cards), I suggest you do what I did, and get a Visa Debit Card for the sole purpose of online transactions. The one I recommend is the Victorian Teachers Visa Debit card. How did I choose that you ask? Well I started at InfoChoice and selected Debit, VIC, No Annual Fee. When I need funds for Amazon, poker, etc, I EFT from my main account with another bank. So most of the time, I have next to no money in this account, I transfer funds when I know I need it.
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Thanks r+b, i'll look at getting one as Id love to kick all your asses and take all your cashes :p;)
 
Carefree-Rob said:
Agreed, I think its ridiculous to even suggest folding AA preflop if called all in. Its the NUTS.

If you won't play that, what will you play?
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Well the alternative argument is wait until you're ITM (in the money). I would probably agree that if you're new to the game, have never cashed, that a cash result is a big deal and you could probably justify folding good hands. If you've played a bit and made a few good cashes, then your focus should no longer be to cash but to win. If I'm 2nd on the bubble, SS goes all in, CL goes all in, and I have Kings, I'm probably going all in too. If CL has rockets or busts me with a weaker hand, so be it, I bubble. Actually, in this case, if the CL scoops, I still finish ITM.
 
Well the alternative argument is wait until you're ITM (in the money). I would probably agree that if you're new to the game, have never cashed, that a cash result is a big deal and you could probably justify folding good hands. If you've played a bit and made a few good cashes, then your focus should no longer be to cash but to win. If I'm 2nd on the bubble, SS goes all in, CL goes all in, and I have Kings, I'm probably going all in too. If CL has rockets or busts me with a weaker hand, so be it, I bubble. Actually, in this case, if the CL scoops, I still finish ITM.
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Considering I have no money, ever, I would wait until the money. To say that's wrong is stupid. It's a matter of opinion. It's what I would do, and I'm sure everyone would differ. I don't think I ever said it was the correct thing to do.

But as my argument has been, to say that I'm a tight player, and to say that I won't go on to win the tournament by not picking up a bit pot, is silly and uneducated.
 
His table manner is ultra agressive (by that i mean that he talks a lot of trash), but his actual poker play is pretty solid. The only thing ive noticed is that he seems to lose it when he loses a big pot or cops a bad beat, and his play suffers a bit.
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For those who listen to the Circuit, Mike was on as a guest tonight, and it was pretty funny.
 
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