Remove this Banner Ad

The Missing Ingredients

  • Thread starter Thread starter _RT_
  • Start date Start date
  • Tagged users Tagged users None

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Excitement
When was the last time we all went to games expecting to see some exciting play from our side. I don't mean watching Houli or Rance charge out of the back line thinking Christ I hope they hit a target, I mean excitement where we had someone who could do a few things and get the crowd involved and fired up. The last time I truly felt excitement going to games was in 2011-2012. Back then we had Dusty charging into packs grabbing the ball, fending off a couple of opponents and then charging away and hitting a laser pass into the 50. We also had Deledio playing across HB opposite Houli and running our of the back line breaking lines and kicking long into F50 more often than not hitting Jack on the tit or setting it up for Jack to sit on someones head and that got the crowd going.

Speed
After our finals exit Hardwick said that he knew what we needed and we as fans all believed we knew what we needed. Outside speed was the call and come draft time we went out and we recruited speed. Unfortunately for us one of those speedsters in Drummond has been injured and is out for the year. Another speedster in Deledio has been missing since round 1 and it's noticeable that outside Houli and Titch we're really lacking some line breakers, but we do have a few of them in VFL that have shown some good signs and maybe it's time to reward some of these kids with a crack at senior level. The guys I'm talking about are in particular are Castagna Menadue & Short. Sure they might be rookies but they go any worse than some that have played for us this year.

Flair
In a similar vain to the lack of excitement, where has the flair gone from our side. There just seems to be no emotion or flair about us at the moment. Back in 2012-13 we had Martin Deledio Houli Edwards White & Foley who took the game on by looking to get the ball at HB and then run at the opposition and break lines. Now it seems like outside Houli Edwards and Deledio when he plays there is no flair to our game. Round 1 we had McIntosh Houli Deledio & Edwards running down the wings taking multiple bounces and driving long into the F50. Since then only Deledio has been missing and yet our run and carry seems to have dried up completely. It's pretty much become a case of get the ball at HB go short to the wing, then get the handball back and then go short to the boundary out on the HFF, then wait before going long to an outnumbered forward like Jack or Griffiths or Vickery in the pocket then watch as the ball gets rebounded out the other side. I believe that the inclusion of the likes of Castagna and Menadue as well as the return of Deledio & Conca will help add more run and carry to the team. However before that happens Hardwick removing the shackles that seem to be placed on Cotchin and Martin and given them back their ability to play with flair might just help as well.

Hardness
Saturday night the Hawks beat the Roos, not just on the scoreboard but also in the trenches and it started early. Lewis collects Goldstein and Hodge decks Swallow, while both acts probably get them suspended, it sets the tone for the rest of the team, but it's not just them either. Take a look at the likes of Sydney Fremantle & Port and tell me the players from those sides that you hear being labelled as soft front runners. Personally I can't think of one player. Every player that takes the field for these teams knows that without failure they are expected to put their bodies on the line when it is time to go.

At our club who do you look at and say they have genuine hardness and sets the tone. Morris is kamikaze like but I don't think he instills fear in the opposition. Cotchin is one who fits the ball, willingly throws himself into contests and tries to set the standard for the team but he is often on his own in that regard. We're trying to make Martin a beast of a midfielder having worked on his tank to go with the ball winning ability but it will take some time for it to come together for him. There are a few others in the VFL that fit the bill in regards to having a willingness to wear contact, but their skill set just doesn't match what we want. Perhaps it's time that we take stock and say you know what, having the likes of an Arnot Thomas Dea in the side might be what is needed. These blokes might not be the most skillful players on our list but I've never seen any one of them take a backwards step when a contest was there to be won. Maybe using these guys as the grunts in the side will help in allowing the likes of Cotchin Martin & Miles to do a bit more work on the outside of packs rather than having to continually try and break away from inside a pack.

Of those areas the ones that we can address this year are the first 3, unless we're willing to give those hardnosed lesser skilled players a decent run. As I mentioned we've got the players with the excitement factor and flair & we've got kids who have speed and skills. So why not give them a crack and remove the shackles that sees the team more often than not going around in circles. Over the next couple of months I'd like to see us work towards getting the following side on the park:

B: Castagna Astbury Chaplin
HB: Houli Rance Deledio
C: B.Ellis Vlastuin Conca
HF: Martin Griffiths Lennon
F: Riewoldt Vickery Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin C.Ellis
INT: Menadue Miles Hunt McIntosh

IMO that side addresses the 3 issues above that can be fixed this year. We bring in some speed across the ground. Deledio back to HB gives us that run and carry flair we've been missing, Vlastuin into the middle gives us a bit more hardness in the middle while starting Martin and Edwards up forward adds a little bit of flair to the side
 
Our stars are too busy playing their role to be able to play their natural games. This has seen the flair etc disappear from their games sadly
 

Log in to remove this Banner Ad

Remove this Banner Ad

Menadue looks like he'll be a player but he's so skinny, I'm worried that he'll get smashed to smithereens if we introduce him too early. Agree that Castagna and Short should get a look in soon. Castagna probably first cab off the rank.

I wonder if there's any chance we can give McDonough a decent crack as a forward with spells in the guts at AFL level? He might not make it but he's been played out of position it seems to me every time he's stepped up to the seniors.
 
Menadue looks like he'll be a player but he's so skinny, I'm worried that he'll get smashed to smithereens if we introduce him too early. Agree that Castagna and Short should get a look in soon. Castagna probably first cab off the rank.

I wonder if there's any chance we can give McDonough a decent crack as a forward with spells in the guts at AFL level? He might not make it but he's been played out of position it seems to me every time he's stepped up to the seniors.
This is so important . I watched his under 18 carnival and he was better than Steve Milne by a long shot at 18. The guy has freakish talents but they are being trained out of him.
 
Missing Ingredient ............................ A midfield coach. Feel jealous when I see Harvey, Voss, Ratten, Kirk, Goodwin, etc at other clubs and we have Lade and McQualter.
Did you hear Max Bailey on Talking Tigers when he said he was surprised he was made Forward line development when he came to the club because he'd never played forward . Pmsl only at Richmond and under Dimma. Not only does he do it to his players but he does it to his coaching staff as well.
 
Excitement
When was the last time we all went to games expecting to see some exciting play from our side. I don't mean watching Houli or Rance charge out of the back line thinking Christ I hope they hit a target, I mean excitement where we had someone who could do a few things and get the crowd involved and fired up. The last time I truly felt excitement going to games was in 2011-2012. Back then we had Dusty charging into packs grabbing the ball, fending off a couple of opponents and then charging away and hitting a laser pass into the 50. We also had Deledio playing across HB opposite Houli and running our of the back line breaking lines and kicking long into F50 more often than not hitting Jack on the tit or setting it up for Jack to sit on someones head and that got the crowd going.

Speed
After our finals exit Hardwick said that he knew what we needed and we as fans all believed we knew what we needed. Outside speed was the call and come draft time we went out and we recruited speed. Unfortunately for us one of those speedsters in Drummond has been injured and is out for the year. Another speedster in Deledio has been missing since round 1 and it's noticeable that outside Houli and Titch we're really lacking some line breakers, but we do have a few of them in VFL that have shown some good signs and maybe it's time to reward some of these kids with a crack at senior level. The guys I'm talking about are in particular are Castagna Menadue & Short. Sure they might be rookies but they go any worse than some that have played for us this year.

Flair
In a similar vain to the lack of excitement, where has the flair gone from our side. There just seems to be no emotion or flair about us at the moment. Back in 2012-13 we had Martin Deledio Houli Edwards White & Foley who took the game on by looking to get the ball at HB and then run at the opposition and break lines. Now it seems like outside Houli Edwards and Deledio when he plays there is no flair to our game. Round 1 we had McIntosh Houli Deledio & Edwards running down the wings taking multiple bounces and driving long into the F50. Since then only Deledio has been missing and yet our run and carry seems to have dried up completely. It's pretty much become a case of get the ball at HB go short to the wing, then get the handball back and then go short to the boundary out on the HFF, then wait before going long to an outnumbered forward like Jack or Griffiths or Vickery in the pocket then watch as the ball gets rebounded out the other side. I believe that the inclusion of the likes of Castagna and Menadue as well as the return of Deledio & Conca will help add more run and carry to the team. However before that happens Hardwick removing the shackles that seem to be placed on Cotchin and Martin and given them back their ability to play with flair might just help as well.

Hardness
Saturday night the Hawks beat the Roos, not just on the scoreboard but also in the trenches and it started early. Lewis collects Goldstein and Hodge decks Swallow, while both acts probably get them suspended, it sets the tone for the rest of the team, but it's not just them either. Take a look at the likes of Sydney Fremantle & Port and tell me the players from those sides that you hear being labelled as soft front runners. Personally I can't think of one player. Every player that takes the field for these teams knows that without failure they are expected to put their bodies on the line when it is time to go.

At our club who do you look at and say they have genuine hardness and sets the tone. Morris is kamikaze like but I don't think he instills fear in the opposition. Cotchin is one who fits the ball, willingly throws himself into contests and tries to set the standard for the team but he is often on his own in that regard. We're trying to make Martin a beast of a midfielder having worked on his tank to go with the ball winning ability but it will take some time for it to come together for him. There are a few others in the VFL that fit the bill in regards to having a willingness to wear contact, but their skill set just doesn't match what we want. Perhaps it's time that we take stock and say you know what, having the likes of an Arnot Thomas Dea in the side might be what is needed. These blokes might not be the most skillful players on our list but I've never seen any one of them take a backwards step when a contest was there to be won. Maybe using these guys as the grunts in the side will help in allowing the likes of Cotchin Martin & Miles to do a bit more work on the outside of packs rather than having to continually try and break away from inside a pack.

Of those areas the ones that we can address this year are the first 3, unless we're willing to give those hardnosed lesser skilled players a decent run. As I mentioned we've got the players with the excitement factor and flair & we've got kids who have speed and skills. So why not give them a crack and remove the shackles that sees the team more often than not going around in circles. Over the next couple of months I'd like to see us work towards getting the following side on the park:

B: Castagna Astbury Chaplin
HB: Houli Rance Deledio
C: B.Ellis Vlastuin Conca
HF: Martin Griffiths Lennon
F: Riewoldt Vickery Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin C.Ellis
INT: Menadue Miles Hunt McIntosh

IMO that side addresses the 3 issues above that can be fixed this year. We bring in some speed across the ground. Deledio back to HB gives us that run and carry flair we've been missing, Vlastuin into the middle gives us a bit more hardness in the middle while starting Martin and Edwards up forward adds a little bit of flair to the side
Two likes for this post
The first bc I agree entirely with it
The second bc Morris and Newman weren't in the team
 
Menadue looks like he'll be a player but he's so skinny, I'm worried that he'll get smashed to smithereens if we introduce him too early. Agree that Castagna and Short should get a look in soon. Castagna probably first cab off the rank.

I wonder if there's any chance we can give McDonough a decent crack as a forward with spells in the guts at AFL level? He might not make it but he's been played out of position it seems to me every time he's stepped up to the seniors.

McDonough wants the chance too mate. He's a forward/mid and that's where he wants to play. I would say he's pretty frustrated at the fact that he hasn't had the chance to play there in the seniors
 

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

You forgot one major missing ingredient.
Leadership.
Brought this up in the #SackHardwick thread earlier.
It's something that needs to be seriously discussed, and reviewed at the end of the season.
I believe Cotchin should be captain, absolutely.
He has no where near enough support around him and that's the problem.
If my memory serves me correctly, the current leadership group consists of: Cotchin, Deledio, Maric, Morris, Chaplin and Grimes.
The fact of the matter is that 2 of these blokes came from other clubs (Chaplin and Maric), one is injury prone and has't even played 50 games of AFL football, and the other, in my opinion, is a dud footballer with probably the worst set of skills and football smarts in the entire league.
I mean, how does this even happen?
It's no wonder that we can't win without Deledio, there is absolutely no one to step up in his absence.
How are Rance and Riewoldt not included in that group.
I'd even have Bachar in there. He has probably been in our top 2 players so far this season, if not the best.
Not only is Bachar a quality footballer, but the work he does off the field for the club and AFL is fantastic.
I know everyone is going to turn around and say "everyone should be a leader out there" and yeah, thats true.
The bottom line however, is that leadership groups are there for a reason, and that is to lead by example and help pick their team mates up when they are down and low on confidence.
Who is coming through with potential leadership material?
I know Cotchin is only 25 and won't be giving up the captaincy any time soon, but is there anyone that really stands out?
Vlastuin is probably the only one at this stage, and I'm still not convinced he will become an elite AFL player.
I have big hopes for Corey Ellis.
If you have a look through all our top draft picks over the years, you can't say there have been that many 'leaders' picked.
Even at TAC level, these things should surely be looked at.
I know Vlastuin was captain of Vic Metro, so thats promising.
But how about the rest of our first round picks?
B. Ellis? Too much of an outside player to be skipper.
Martin? Would inspire you with his actions on field, but is definitely not a leader.
Vickery? Whacks blokes cheaply and is too much of a confidence player to be a leader.
Conca? Same as Vickery.
Lennon? Doesn't look likely to be a captain, or leader in any form. Jury is still out for me.
Corey Ellis? I have hope. I really do. Classy, hard at it, wins his own ball. Bit of Sam Mitchell about him.
I'm not necessarily saying that the clubs next captain HAS to be a first round pick, but history will tell you that generally your better players are the ones putting their hands up for captaincy and ultimately leadership.

Next years leadership group:
Out: Chaplin, Morris, Grimes
In: Rance, Riewoldt, Houli.

Sorry if this rant has annoyed anyone, but it's just been missing for so long at our club and I am fed up.

Would appreciate some discussion on this topic too, unless it's been covered elsewhere.
 
You forgot one major missing ingredient.
Leadership.
Brought this up in the #SackHardwick thread earlier.
It's something that needs to be seriously discussed, and reviewed at the end of the season.
I believe Cotchin should be captain, absolutely.
He has no where near enough support around him and that's the problem.
If my memory serves me correctly, the current leadership group consists of: Cotchin, Deledio, Maric, Morris, Chaplin and Grimes.
The fact of the matter is that 2 of these blokes came from other clubs (Chaplin and Maric), one is injury prone and has't even played 50 games of AFL football, and the other, in my opinion, is a dud footballer with probably the worst set of skills and football smarts in the entire league.
I mean, how does this even happen?
It's no wonder that we can't win without Deledio, there is absolutely no one to step up in his absence.
How are Rance and Riewoldt not included in that group.
I'd even have Bachar in there. He has probably been in our top 2 players so far this season, if not the best.
Not only is Bachar a quality footballer, but the work he does off the field for the club and AFL is fantastic.
I know everyone is going to turn around and say "everyone should be a leader out there" and yeah, thats true.
The bottom line however, is that leadership groups are there for a reason, and that is to lead by example and help pick their team mates up when they are down and low on confidence.
Who is coming through with potential leadership material?
I know Cotchin is only 25 and won't be giving up the captaincy any time soon, but is there anyone that really stands out?
Vlastuin is probably the only one at this stage, and I'm still not convinced he will become an elite AFL player.
I have big hopes for Corey Ellis.
If you have a look through all our top draft picks over the years, you can't say there have been that many 'leaders' picked.
Even at TAC level, these things should surely be looked at.
I know Vlastuin was captain of Vic Metro, so thats promising.
But how about the rest of our first round picks?
B. Ellis? Too much of an outside player to be skipper.
Martin? Would inspire you with his actions on field, but is definitely not a leader.
Vickery? Whacks blokes cheaply and is too much of a confidence player to be a leader.
Conca? Same as Vickery.
Lennon? Doesn't look likely to be a captain, or leader in any form. Jury is still out for me.
Corey Ellis? I have hope. I really do. Classy, hard at it, wins his own ball. Bit of Sam Mitchell about him.
I'm not necessarily saying that the clubs next captain HAS to be a first round pick, but history will tell you that generally your better players are the ones putting their hands up for captaincy and ultimately leadership.

Next years leadership group:
Out: Chaplin, Morris, Grimes
In: Rance, Riewoldt, Houli.

Sorry if this rant has annoyed anyone, but it's just been missing for so long at our club and I am fed up.

Would appreciate some discussion on this topic too, unless it's been covered elsewhere.
I'll discuss it . The club employed the guy that ran the leading teams program at Geelong to work with our players. There are no excuses as it hasn't worked. They blamed leadership last year and addressed it and it's still happening . It's crazy .
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Remove this Banner Ad

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Back
Top Bottom